Quote:
Originally Posted by KillBill  aeX
Any thoughts since you are going to be working for Ducati in the near future? |
Here are my thoughts as a
fan of racing, not as a Ducati employee, which I'm not (yet). I'm merely stating this as another motorcycle racing fan.
You asked for it... (copied from another board where I already addressed this)
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a13x said:
Ducati has a valid point. You could see this day coming ever since the I4 OEM's lobbied to get their 750's bumped up to 1000.
Anyone who thinks a 1000cc Twin and a 1000cc I4 are even close to 'equal' need to go over the numbers. For instance.. how about
a stock 1098 (red) compared to a stock 1st gen ZX10 (blue) 
A 999 with Akro pipes puts out 10hp less than the stock 1098 on that same dyno. Lets look at that again. A 999 with aftermarket pipes is 20HP behind a bone stock ZX-10, that's rediculous.
Currently, even thou the Ducati's get away with less 'strict' restrictions than the I4's, they aren't even close powerwise. The built-to-the-hilt, grenade, mega-expensive 999 motors are putting out about 195HP last I read, while the I4's are around 220 - 230. Also the longtime advantage twins had squirting out of corners due to the power delivery has been taken away somewhat by the introduction of effective traction-control on the I4's the last few years.
The I4's weigh the same as the twins (weight handicap was removed in 2003), make 20 to 30 more HP, get out of the corners just as good, and cost the OEM's less to build while far more reliable. Not to mention they still MAKE the version of the bike they are racing.
Motorcycle organizations all over the world constantly monitor and evolve the various performance indexes that constitute racing classes. This isn't a outrageous offense nor request on Ducati's part.
The 1098 is currently legal for World Superstock racing, where it's competitive, not a world-killer. If allowing the 1098 allows Ducati to get back into AMA racing, continue in World Superbike, be competitive, and still make the budget numbers, I don't see what the problem is.
Oh yea the Troy Bayliss Factor. Troy Bayliss is probably one of the greatest Ducati racers of all time. Not to mention he, and the rest of the guys on the 999 have bucketloads of data on the bike. The F07 is the exact same bike as the F06, which in turn was a small change from the F05.
Look at Bayliss' 2006 season, he dominated the first half of the year winning 8 of the first 12 races. Past the midway point he only won 4 of 12. What happened.. did he slow down.. hello? No, moreso all the other teams started to figure out their bikes and traction-control systems and their programs kept getting stronger. Whereas the 999 is at the end of it's evolutionary chain.
Biaggi.. hahah
Personally I think that's a empty threat. Alstare and Biaggi want to go (back) to MotoGP in 2008 regardless of what Ducati does. They are just looking to cover their asses incase they can't put together a competitive GP package. Since Biaggi currently is the Big Hot Shit GP Guy on the WSB grid, Alstare knows they have a effective bargaining chip and are using it for all it's worth.
Quote:
| falconeight said: My only argument is that I would rather see 1000cc v-twins battle 800cc or 850cc inline four rather than have the engine sizes grow. As a consumer I would not want and would never buy a bike bigger than a 1000cc twin or 750 inline 4. Insurance would get even higher and its in no way neccessary. I would like to see WSBK restrict bikes to a certain BHP and leave the engines alone or make them smaller. |
Oh I agree 100% with that. But AMA / FIM was pressured by Japan to allow the 1000cc I4's and here we are.
Originally it was:
750 4 cylinders
900 3 cylinders
1000 2 cylinders
Ducati ran the 916 until the 750's got too fast, then they used their allowable 'cap space' and bumped up to 998/999. The Japanese on the other hand had a few options. Honda bent the rules and made V4 750's, low-number legal bikes, and won a few championships (RC30, RC45). Then they abandoned that course of action and left Superbike racing until the RC51 with which they won with as well.
Kawi, Suzuki, and Yamaha got tired of 750's as a class in general once sales of those bikes slowed down. The everyday consumer either bought 600's or 1000's and 750 sales slowly died off. Hence... the Big Four wanted to race 1000 I4's so they could sell them.
And here we are.
Don't point your finger at Ducati, they are a tiny company who sold 4500 bikes in the USA in 2004. Take a gander over at the Big Four who think Joe Neighbor should buy a 155HP stock streetbike.
Besides the RC51, anyone else remember Suzuki's attempt at a vtwin racebike, the TLR1000? Suzuki at one point had 4 factory riders in the AMA, two racing the GSXR750, and two racing the TLR1000, all in the Superbike class! That was amazing to watch. The bike sucked however and they quickly abandoned that strategy, bored and stroked the 750 motor, and introduced the class changing GSXR1000.
and lastly
Dennis Noyes, you so crazy! *click link below*
SPEEDtv.com | World Superbike | WSBK: Ducati Threatens to Quit Unless 1198 Allowed (Part I) | by Dennis Noyes | The latest headlines from FIM World Superbike | Bayliss, Corser, Haga, Toseland, Barros, Pitt, Lanzi, Xaus, Abe, Walker, Ducati, Suzuki, Y Quote:
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There have been lots of headlines and knee-jerk reactions. On the surface, it is hard to understand why the factory that has won 12 of 19 titles in the young world championship, the team that won last year’s in commanding style, would want or need a 20% increase in capacity. A closer look at the rules and the precedents in World Superbike racing, however, makes Ducati’s position seem more logical. - Dennis Noyes
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