[bigred875]

Originally posted by Doc
We DO use the technology!

Carpet bombing...? Wouldn't that kill innocents by our hand?

Might as well nuke em till they glow and bomb the bright spots.

we are pulling our punches...we are not hitting them with everything we have..that's wrong

[odduc]

Hey Doc, for the record, I am a veteran of the first Persian Gulf War.
We beat them into submission, then. Why not now ? Who are we afraid of offending ? And, why must good soldiers die so that the politicians can save face with people who don't even like us in the first place ? I don't give a rat's ass about civilian casualties as long as our people are safe. The kids will grow up to be terrorists, anyway, because that is the culture and we're not going to change that. Besides the civilians will eventully help us by turning in the insurgents after they understand the consequences of choosing to ally themselves with the bad guys.

[Doc]

Originally posted by bigred875
we are pulling our punches...we are not hitting them with everything we have..that's wrong

We are hadcuffed by the American people.

[bentbryan]

So let me get this straight - you think I should have to go over to fight in a war based on a complete sham (WMDs), that has been poorly led through its entirety, and has no effective goals at the moment other than "staying the course"?

Saddam never had WMD's? lol.

READ THE DULFER REPORT ASSHOLE!

[beet]

Originally posted by Doc
I agree with RichW on the point of build bases watch and adjust. Isn't that what we are doing?


Bigred... Again you bring up valid points and I find it difficult to explain using this medium.

You and I agree on alot of things, there are just a few differing points.

Kinda like the Iraqi's.

We need to change what we are doing because politicians and money hungry defense cotractors and Oil conglomerates are not listening to the Generals on the ground. (Those decisions are in their pay grade).

What is being said by the Generals is "Stay the course, give me what I need and we will have stability" (notice I did not say VICTORY because I do not believe it is about that).

Is this because they are war mongers and baby killers? Is it because they want job security? Are they just stubborn? Maybe. Or is it because they believe they can make a difference.

100 soldiers a month may die but there are alot more insurgents dying. Is that a good thing? Well it depends on your perspective I guess.

Yes the insurgents are coming in from all over but we are handing them their asses. Yes they have seen and fought centuries of wars (the Soviets most recently) but I think we are doing a better job than they were (the Soviets).

Ahh typing.. I am getting a backache and a wristache.

Are you guys gonna be at the drunkathon? I'll buy you a beer. You too Rich. (And I can't forget Beet)

[Doc]

Originally posted by bentbryan
Saddam never had WMD's? lol.

READ THE DULFER REPORT ASSHOLE!

Dude we all ready went over that! read the posts :

[bentbryan]

You're mis-interpreting me. Err...I mean I botched that joke!

[highsider]

Define WMDs.

Because if you mean a bunch of rusty, shitty, useless chemical stations and some cluster bombs that haven't been of any use since the Iran/Iraq War, then I guess they had them. But those are *NOT* the weapons Bush said we were after - he said there would be nukes and chemical/germ warfare on a scale large enough to pose a threat to the US.

This was not found.

We have bigger fish to fry. Lets go invade Korea, that should be fun.

P.S. - George Bush, Sr. sold Saddam cluster bombs (which are considered WMDs) to help him kick Iran's ass. No one ever found those cluster bombs.

[bigred875]

Originally posted by Doc
We are hadcuffed by the American people.

they choose to be handcuffed...that is the problem..they need to get the media out and get the damn job done

[bigred875]

Originally posted by highsider
Define WMDs.

Because if you mean a bunch of rusty, shitty, useless chemical stations and some cluster bombs that haven't been of any use since the Iran/Iraq War, then I guess they had them. But those are *NOT* the weapons Bush said we were after - he said there would be nukes and chemical/germ warfare on a scale large enough to pose a threat to the US.

This was not found.

We have bigger fish to fry. Lets go invade Korea, that should be fun.

P.S. - George Bush, Sr. sold Saddam cluster bombs (which are considered WMDs) to help him kick Iran's ass. No one ever found those cluster bombs.

never nukes lol "this was not found" there really isnt much to say that...they were there..and now they are gone..W did not make that up...he had plenty of time to hide(bury?) or move them our(syrai) between the time leading up to the inspections and in the 2 weeks they were blocking the inspectors...and even then there were how many inspectors...and how much land? Iraq is the size of california...you cant beleive the inspectors can say without a doubt there isnt a possibilty that he had them...but that is a moot point as the country voted for the war...W didnt act alone and more then one country had teh same intell

and yes Iraq used to be our allie..allies help each other our..things have changed...he bit us in the ass...

and invade n. korea? why? by your logic that would be wrong too... If we went into n. korea instead of Iraq...left saddam do what ever he wanted...he would be the one with the nuke instead...and there is no china to keep iraq in check like there is for N. korea....

[highsider]

Originally posted by bigred875
never nukes

and yes Iraq used to be our allie..allies help each other our..things have changed...he bit us in the ass...

and invade n. korea? why? by your logic that would be wrong too... If we went into n. korea instead of Iraq...left saddam do what ever he wanted...he would be the one with the nuke instead...and there is no china to keep iraq in check like there is for N. korea....

I was joking about North Korea.

I could have sworn I remember Colin Powell showing off some crappy photos of "suspected nuclear weapons bunkers".

And Bush Sr. arming Iraq was a good idea at the time; if Iraq had won, and had then been our ally, we'd have been in the door for lots of cheap oil. I just wonder if that played a part in Bush, Jr's kick-in-th-door strategy - i.e., of course we'll find WMD's, we sold them to the bastards. But the shit we sold them was never found.

[bigred875]

Originally posted by highsider
I was joking about North Korea.

I could have sworn I remember Colin Powell showing off some crappy photos of "suspected nuclear weapons bunkers".

And Bush Sr. arming Iraq was a good idea at the time; if Iraq had won, and had then been our ally, we'd have been in the door for lots of cheap oil. I just wonder if that played a part in Bush, Jr's kick-in-th-door strategy - i.e., of course we'll find WMD's, we sold them to the bastards. But the shit we sold them was never found.

that quit being a damn troll! lol

there was no doubt he was looking to obtain and develope them but I dont think we were sure if he had them or not....a big threat was that he would get one from russia(or somewhere) and sell them to al-qeda and/or the chemical weapons he did have..atleast that was my understanding....

and like you said..powell showed pics of the mobile labs etc...they were mobile for a reason

[richw]

The WMD's are in the hands of disgruntled ODFU members

Dictatorships are a cult of personality. If the fearless leader wants to feel more secure there is nothing like a few WMD's to keep the populous in line. After Gulf War 1 Saddam was on shaky ground but the threat to toss a couple of bio or chem weapons are very good to keep the rebels and Iran in check.

The same goes for Kim Jung Ill nothing like a Nuke to shut up your critics.

Whats almost better then WMD's the threat of WMD's. Sort of the opposite of Dr. Strangelove. "What's the point of a doomsday bomb if you keep it a secret"

It is force multiplication if the loyal black guard has access to WMD's they can control a population of millions.


My plan would be to flood dictator countries with single shot buck shot pistols with like 5 rounds each. When 2/3rds of the population was armed then every local dictator stooge could be bumped off. Eventually the dictators own people would pop him before it was their turn.

[Doc]

Originally posted by richw
The WMD's are in the hands of disgruntled ODFU members

Dictatorships are a cult of personality. If the fearless leader wants to feel more secure there is nothing like a few WMD's to keep the populous in line. After Gulf War 1 Saddam was on shaky ground but the threat to toss a couple of bio or chem weapons are very good to keep the rebels and Iran in check.

The same goes for Kim Jung Ill nothing like a Nuke to shut up your critics.

Whats almost better then WMD's the threat of WMD's. Sort of the opposite of Dr. Strangelove. "What's the point of a doomsday bomb if you keep it a secret"

It is force multiplication if the loyal black guard has access to WMD's they can control a population of millions.


My plan would be to flood dictator countries with single shot buck shot pistols with like 5 rounds each. When 2/3rds of the population was armed then every local dictator stooge could be bumped off. Eventually the dictators own people would pop him before it was their turn.

[Josephd14]

Originally posted by richw
My plan would be to flood dictator countries with single shot buck shot pistols with like 5 rounds each. When 2/3rds of the population was armed then every local dictator stooge could be bumped off. Eventually the dictators own people would pop him before it was their turn.

I guess we did not learn our lesson concerning arming groups of people inorder to eliminate another group?? I'm sure most know what i'm refering to.

This all will take time. More time then our instant gratification society is willing to accept.

That about sums up 70% of America decent.. Lets not forget going in for WMD was not the only SMOKING GUN that everyone thinks it was.. He violated a cease fire agreement over 15 times, he blocked inspectors and led them on wild goose hunts, then he would let them in a couple months later after a stern talking too from the UN .. And every time the Inspectors found NOTHING?? Why would he do this?? are we this nieve?? I don't think there was or is anything wrong with the intention in Iraq, but i will be ther first to say as a right leaning Independent, Bush needs to make some changes with personal around him..

[odduc]

[richw]

My point was single shot 12 gauge pistols... Not effective against troops but great for a public crowd.

Today they announced the elimination of the Iraq Saddam library website.

Upon examination by good technical people it contained exact plans for a functional atomic bomb. All was down loadable until yesterday.

Gone fission

Move slowly away from the population centers

[bigred875]

He violated a cease fire agreement over 15 times, he blocked inspectors and led them on wild goose hunts, then he would let them in a couple months later after a stern talking too from the UN .. And every time the Inspectors found NOTHING?? Why would he do this?? are we this nieve?? I don't think there was or is anything wrong with the intention in Iraq, but i will be ther first to say as a right leaning Independent, Bush needs to make some changes with personal around him..

unfortunately this falls on deaf ears..non of that matters for most people..i have stopped bringing it up...

"Bush needs to make some changes with personal around him.." this is what really needs to happen and W said was it yesterday? he isnt getting rid of rummy

[benVFR]

Talk of UN resolutions falls on deaf ears because Bush (and conservatives) have been feeding us the idea that the UN doesn't matter for the last 6 years.

If the UN doesn't matter, and we're not really going to participate, what do the resolutions mean?

You can't use UN resolutions to justify a war the UN doesn't approve of as you say the UN doesn't matter.

I can agree with neo-cons that the UN is becoming irrelevant but we need to at least TRY to keep it relevant.

[tonyd]

Originally posted by bigred875
:...but that is a moot point as the country voted for the war...

Where was I when this vote took place?
Are you talking about congress voting for it? That's not "the country". Besides in 2003 Congress was still scared to say no to GWB for fear of being "unpatriotic".

[bigred875]

Originally posted by benVFR
Talk of UN resolutions falls on deaf ears because Bush (and conservatives) have been feeding us the idea that the UN doesn't matter for the last 6 years.

If the UN doesn't matter, and we're not really going to participate, what do the resolutions mean?

You can't use UN resolutions to justify a war the UN doesn't approve of as you say the UN doesn't matter.

I can agree with neo-cons that the UN is becoming irrelevant but we need to at least TRY to keep it relevant.

you spun that a bit lol they have been saying the UN doesnt matter because they never do anything when someone breaks them...we have been trying to work with the UN from the begining and once we realized(after 9/11) that we can no longer sit around hoping for the UN to do that right thing W man'd up and did something about it....more facts the lefties always forget

[richw]

The UN is just a waste of good real estate.

Give it to Trump for a Casino.

Make the UN Headquarters in Tehran and see how popular and relevant it is.

Time for the

Euro-American Jihad

[Josephd14]

Originally posted by tonyd
Where was I when this vote took place?
Are you talking about congress voting for it? That's not "the country". Besides in 2003 Congress was still scared to say no to GWB for fear of being "unpatriotic".

Ahhhh, I believe they are the vioce of the country last i knew, so yes i would say in a round-about way, they are the country.. Did you ever notice they call them "Representatives" ?? although i will be the first to admit that they seem to REPRESENT there own interest rather then the people that put them there, half the time.. As for anyone in Politics who is afraid of being called names, I suggest they find a new line of work.. Teddy has been called a Murderer for almost 40 years, hasn't seemed to bother him much..

[richw]

Saddam's invited to a neck tie party

I like swingers


Too bad mandatory appeal