[Stoneman]

During the summer of 2001, I was ready to hand in my leased Chevy Blazer and search for a new vehicle. Living where I was at the time made leasing no longer a viable alternitive, so purchasing was my best option. My criteria was simple and short: decent gas mileage, all wheel drive or 4 wheel drive, and must be capable of hauling say, 500 pounds (10 cartons of paper) *IF* needed, must be dependable and reliable and capable of withstanding many, many miles of commuting type travel (500 miles a week)...

Now, I did my homework. I talked to current owners, I read endless articles. Everything was pointing me to the Subaru Outback wagon. I didn't just decide one day, "...I'm gonna go get me wunna those..." Never once - NOT ONCE - in my 'research' did I come across anything negative about 'em. The ONLY thing I didn't like was the relatively short warranty (3 years/36,000 miles). None the less it was a no brainer. Or so I thought...

Up until it hit 50,000 miles, I was entirely happy with it. Relatively small things here & there. But overall, very happy. Keep in mind this is a 2001 purchased brand new. It now has only 62,350 miles on it...

First problem: Brand new car at this point, literally. The damn dealership CAN'T get the tires on it balanced. After giving them THREE tries, I took it to an independant garage that nailed it first try...

50,000 miles: brakes disintigrate. Gone! Rotors perfed, calipers toast. Never gave me a warning. I had the rotors turned and pads replaced at roughly 25,000 miles. One day it was fine (no fade, or shake, or degradation), the next day nothing. Soob wouldn't cover it (not part of the warranty), so I took it to yet another independant...

60,517 miles: Head gasket goes. Naturally, not covered. After some pissing and moaning, they got Subaru to pay for the repairs. Nice of them, no doubt. And I commend the local service department for stepping up and taking it up with Subaru. But now I'm starting to REALLY wonder. Why is this blowing head gaskets at 60,000 miles? It's only 2-1/2 years old!

Here we are now. 62,320 odd miles on it now and my tranny is toast. Soob wants $4500 to replace it. Naturally, I asked them to step up again and call Soob. Which they willingly did. How nice it was of Subaru to offer to cover $3000 dollars of the repairs, leaving me with 'only' a $1500 tab for a tranny FOR A 2-1/2 YEAR OLD CAR!!!

I know I can get it done elsewhere for far less money. But you see my point here, right? 2-1/2 years, 62,000 miles and this thing is falling apart. And Soob's willing to pick up 2/3 of the tab??? This is fuggin' outrageous!!!

How many OTHER vehicles do we currently own? Let's see: '84 Corvette, '89 Chevy 1/2 ton 4 x 4, 2003 Volvo, '73 Chevy 1 ton RV, all with far more wear & tear than I would dream of inflicting on the Soob. Never - and I mean NEVER - have I run into this type of bullshit with ANY other vehicle I've EVER owned. And that list goes FAR beyond the list of 'currently own'...

Never fuggin' again, never...

[KevinB]

That sucks.
I had similar problems with a 96 GMC Savana Van, all started around 55K. Wiring harness shorted out and tranny went at 60K, dealer didn't give a shit. Ended dropping around $5K to keep it running.No new vehicle should need anything other than normal maintence for at least the first 4 or 5 years in my opinion. So I switched to Ford and haven't looked back.

Kevin

[stoinkythepig]

Geez, maybe my Durango is not so bad after all...

It shifts a little funny now and then, originally came with crappy tires, and has required a new intake manifold gasket last fall. It's now 5 years old with 70,000 miles (I don't use it for commuting). Otherwise, it's been fine and it tows my boat extremely well.

[Stoneman]

That's the other thing. I've NEVER used it to tow anything, and I've never really hauled anything substantial in it. Not that it could...

[PinHead]

Damn that car allways seemed pretty nice too. Maybe a little 4-wheeling in the near future before you get rid of it

[Stoneman]

Originally posted by PinHead
Damn that car allways seemed pretty nice too. Maybe a little 4-wheeling in the near future before you get rid of it

I'm tellin' ya. Up until about a month ago, I loved the thing. As far as I was concerned, I was a Soob customer for life. But now, once I get it back, it's going immediately on the auction block. NEXT weekend I'll be bringing it around to see what I can muster in a trade for it. Probably try working my mojo on a Ford Sport Trac 4 x 4 this time around...

[PinHead]

Originally posted by Stoneman
Ford

[RandyO]

I have come to the conclusion that cars from Japan, Korea, Canada, United States, Mexico, Brazil, Italy and all the eastern euoropean countryies are all throwaway junk and that only the Germans and Swedes know how to build cars

[Stoneman]

Originally posted by RandyO
I have come to the conclusion that cars from Japan, Korea, Canada, United States, Mexico, Brazil, Italy and all the eastern euoropean countryies are all throwaway junk and that only the Germans and Swedes know how to build cars

I'm beginning to think along those same lines. So far, I'm very impressed with Cheryl's Volvo and their customer service. I wouldn't know about German cars. I'd NEVER own one...

[Stoneman]

Originally posted by PinHead

Yeah, I know. But I got away from Chevy 'cuz I had problems with my '98 Blazer. And look what happens when I go with an import that's known for it's longevity and reliability....

[Stoneman]

So far, I'm totally disappointed with Soob's so-called customer service. I got in touch with Soob North America. Talk about deaf ears. About all they do is start a file for ya. Thanks for calling, have a nice day...

I happened to be able to corner wunna the sales managers when I was picking it up yesterday. His answer was simply, "...ya got a bad one. You've got some equity in it, you should consider a trade. Don't let one bad one ruin it for ya. Or, if you're that concerned, we can offer you an extended warranty (20,000 miles. Woo) for a mere $1200..."

Are you fuggin' kidding me??? "...you got a bad one..." ??? "...don't let one bad one ruin it..." ??? How many of these pieces of shit should I go through before I decide that they're all pieces of shit??? What the fuck does 'I got a bad one' mean??? 'Course, he didn't have any ignorant answers for THOSE questions...

And naturally, I think the other head gasket is starting to weep now too. Couldn't do 'em both could they? Of course not. There was nothing wrong with the other side of the engine....

I've fuggin' had it with this piece of shit. Does any one know anything about NEW HAMPHSIRE'S Lemon Law arbitration?

[rocker]

Originally posted by Stoneman
His answer was simply, "...ya got a bad one. You've got some equity in it, you should consider a trade. Don't let one bad one ruin it for ya.

So Pretty much he admitted you got a lemon... That's nice..

Good luck with the bs Jay..

[stoinkythepig]

See:
http://www.is-it-a-lemon.com/New_Hampshire/index.htm

The lemon law in NH states that you need to show 3 unsucessful repairs or 30 days (total) out of service within the warranty period. Sounds like you have several successful repairs for problems in and out of warranty. Bummer.

[snowborder]

Jay, was it a 4 banger or the H6 thing they have now? My wife wants one of these cars and I keep putting it off.

As for German Cars screw that... Did you ever wonder why the Audi and Volkswagon cars have one headlight on.

They are plagued with huge electrical problems.

3 guys I work with... 1 bought A4, 1 bought A6 and one bought Passat.

They all had problems with the Stock Radio... it seems it connected to everything. Can't figure out what a radio has to do with Air conditioning.

They all had blown headlights and taillights in the first 3 months of ownership.

One had a squirrel move into the interior dashboard. Now how the hell does a squirrel move into dashboard. Chewed through all the wires. Well it turns out the wiring harness has this huge gaping hole in it.

[Stoneman]

Originally posted by snowborder
Jay, was it a 4 banger or the H6 thing they have now? My wife wants one of these cars and I keep putting it off.

It's the 4 cylinder (boxer). The tranny problems aren't specific to the 4's though. On the automatics, the tranny pump goes. On the manuals, the clutch'll burn up in no time...

The head gasket problems don't seem to be engine specific. It's happening to the 2.5 liter 4 cylinders as well as the H6's...

I'd stay away from Soob, and this'll be the ONLY one I ever own. Wait 'til the H6's are a bit more proven before you get one. I have the newer 2.5 liter 4 cylinder in mine and everyone thought it was great. But now that those generation engines are starting to get over 50,000 miles on 'em, these problems are starting to pop up on a regular basis. Wait 'til the H6 equipped cars start getting 50,000 - 60,000 miles on 'em. Then see where they're at...

And by the way, mine'll be going back into the shop AGAIN next week...

[Honclfibr]

That's really a shame to hear about the new engines, the old 2.2s they put in the legacies were nothing short of bulletproof IME. My family owned two of them (92 and a 95) and I have a friend with a 93, all went for at least 150k without needing anything more expensive than a CV halfshaft.

But you can see the decline in build quality even between the 92 and 95 cars...sad to see Subaru cheaping out like that...

[stoinkythepig]

Originally posted by snowborder
Jay, was it a 4 banger or the H6 thing they have now? My wife wants one of these cars and I keep putting it off.

As for German Cars screw that... Did you ever wonder why the Audi and Volkswagon cars have one headlight on.

They are plagued with huge electrical problems.

3 guys I work with... 1 bought A4, 1 bought A6 and one bought Passat.

They all had problems with the Stock Radio... it seems it connected to everything. Can't figure out what a radio has to do with Air conditioning.

They all had blown headlights and taillights in the first 3 months of ownership.

One had a squirrel move into the interior dashboard. Now how the hell does a squirrel move into dashboard. Chewed through all the wires. Well it turns out the wiring harness has this huge gaping hole in it.

I drive a 92 Jetta with 160,000 miles on it. Had it since it was new and it has had no odd electrical problems. Up until late 2002, when the differential disintegrated and put a large hole in the transaxle, the car had never had any major problems. Used tranny was $450 so it was cheap to fix and it's been fine ever since. I have been thinking about replacing it with something newer but the damn thing just keeps running and running. I'd buy another. Wife wants a rag top bug. Not sure I'd want to drive one of those all Winter since they seem to scream "I'm ".

[snowborder]

yeah a 92! We are in 2004 and these are the shitboxes they are selling now. If anything they should be beter than a 92.

Those old folks that say "they don't build em like they used to" are 100% right.

Well, anyway Audi and Volks are now built in China and Mexico.

Subaru's are built in the US.

[snowborder]

another reason not to buy Euro is the Euro is like 30 something % higher meaning parts are 30% more expensive than the damn car is.

All these guys are scrambling to shift production to countries on an even keel with US Peso.

[stoinkythepig]

Mine was one of the ones that could have been made in Mexico, the 92s were made in both Germany and Mexico, mine happens to be German in origin though. After 92, they shipped all the tooling for the German Jettas to China. They still make them the same way there but only for the Chinese market. They still make early 90s style Buicks and certain Citroens in China too.

[snowborder]

I just got back from China.... Passats are this years current model... Golf's the same, Jetta the same

Audi's are the same.

Which leads me to believe they are made in China now.

They do have the older model Jetta's but they are just as old as the ones here.

The only Vehicle that I saw that was old in US that is made now in China is the Jeep Cherokee Sport and Classic models. This year they call it a Jeep 2500 with modern front end. Looks kind of cool. Beijing Jeeps have historically been the same with a 2.5 liter 4 cylinder.

The other car being made in China is the Buick Regal by Shanghai Buick Inc. Pretty nice car, has a DVD player with a screen in both the seat backs

[stoinkythepig]

Originally posted by snowborder
I just got back from China.... Passats are this years current model... Golf's the same, Jetta the same

What part of China? I've been to Beijing, Wuhan and a little city in the country caled Jing Men. China is not my favorite place to go.

[snowborder]

Beijing, Tianjin, Jinan, Shanghai, Ningbo, Guangzho, Huhhot, Batoa

yeah what a crap hole. It would be a nice country if they had just taken care of it.

Then the food.... if you stay in Beijing and what not .... not bad... but talk about eating garbage.

That is how SARS started, the way they eat, it is who can eat the most disgusting things around and still live. It is one big contest to save their face. Fuck that... give a beer, a steak and some potatoes dammit.


Gambei!

[stoinkythepig]

This China discussion seems oddly familiar. I think we've done this before.

The food was indeed the worst I have ever had. I was much happier with Japanese and Korean food.

Did you happen to Gambei with Maotai? It's a horrible tasting liquor made from sorgum.

Do you travel to lots of other places? I spent quite a bit of time in South America, Australia, and Europe as well as Asia and North America (obviously). South America is an awesome place to go and prpbably my favorite place to travel on business. I drove from Bueono Aires Argentina to Santiago Chile once over a two week span and it was easily the best road trip I have ever been on. The Andes are an amazing mountain chain to see in person.

[oreo_n2]

sorry to hear stoneman, hope you can find a decent replacement.... want a 99 accord?...

so where would i find mass lemon law stuff?

my "certified" 99 honda accord blew the motor a month ago (~60k miles), got it back last friday and on saturday it blew the head gasket and had to be towed from nashua to cambridge. I got it back this past weds and thursday some of the vtech valves went south... just got it back today and it seems alright now.... but give it a day or two.
the dealership has been good about keeping me in rentals and covering all the repairs (and that horrid tow bill) so i cant complain too much there... except for the trio thingy...
What i dont know... is if i should stick it out now or fight some lemon law thing? the whole power plant has been re-built at this time.... it may be worth keeping. i paid too much for this honda in order to get it certified (damn good thing i did) and because of their reputation. maybe reputations arent something to warrant very highly in todays world.