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Bowe Bergdahl

  1. #1
    Lifer SteveM's Avatar
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    Bowe Bergdahl


    Hero or deserter?

    POW or kidnapping asset?

    The trade?

    I think there is a lot going on here and I don't know what to make of it.

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  2. #2
    Back marker... jwm2k3's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Lots of people not a fan of this guy...

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    Lifer Pittenger5's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Timing is very handy. We might not give our veterans proper medical care, but we sure as shit wont leave them in captivity for *6* years! 5 maybe, but never 6!

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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Homeland (Showtime Series)?

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    Lifer SteveM's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Quote Originally Posted by Trajiks9 View Post
    Homeland (Showtime Series)?
    I said the same thing to my wife last night, except in the show there was no suspicion he had abandoned his post before being captured.

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  6. #6
    Lifer Falko's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    The trade is what has me concerned. Very few people knew of the deal until it was happening. Many of those who should have been aware the deal or been instrumental to it were kept out of it. Many so it is bad to barter with terrorists, but I see the Taliban currently as an enemy in the context of this action. But I do feel those released from Guantanamo were terrorists. Slippery slope.

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  7. #7
    Lifer jasnmar's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    The trade was done in violation of both US and international law, but WTF. We don't need no stinkin' laws.

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  8. #8
    Lifer SteveM's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    If they're POW's and not terrorists, shouldn't we have a formal declaration of war?

    After all, this would not be the first time we declared war on something other than an easily identifiable sovereign nation. We declared war on drugs and that went well.

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  9. #9
    Lifer greenmonster's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    reported 6 fellow soldiers died in the course of looking for him

    http://nypost.com/2014/06/02/six-sol...ling-backlash/

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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    We'd line you up and shoot ya for this back in my day...

    A lot of sketchiness in this story.

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  11. #11
    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    The Daily Beast is decidedly Liberal, yet:

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-of-night.html

    ...the truth is: Bergdahl was a deserter, and soldiers from his own unit died trying to track him down.

    On the night prior to his capture, Bergdahl pulled guard duty at OP Mest, a small outpost about two hours south of the provincial capitol. The base resembled a wagon circle of armored vehicles with some razor wire strung around them. A guard tower sat high up on a nearby hill, but the outpost itself was no fortress. Besides the tower, the only hard structure that I saw in July 2009 was a plywood shed filled with bottled water. Soldiers either slept in poncho tents or inside their vehicles.

    The next morning, Bergdahl failed to show for the morning roll call. The soldiers in 2nd Platoon, Blackfoot Company discovered his rifle, helmet, body armor and web gear in a neat stack. He had, however, taken his compass. His fellow soldiers later mentioned his stated desire to walk from Afghanistan to India.....



    I believe that Bergdahl also deserves sympathy, but he has much to answer for, some of which is far more damning than simply having walked off. Many have suffered because of his actions: his fellow soldiers, their families, his family, the Afghan military, the unaffiliated Afghan civilians in Paktika, and none of this suffering was inevitable. None of it had to happen. Therefore, while I’m pleased that he’s safe, I believe there is an explanation due. Reprimanding him might yield horrible press for the Army, making our longest war even less popular than it is today. Retrieving him at least reminds soldiers that we will never abandon them to their fates, right or wrong. In light of the propaganda value, I do not expect the Department of Defense to punish Bergdahl.
    Military Times:

    More than 2,300 people had signed a petition on the White House’s official website as of noon Eastern on Monday demanding the Obama administration punish the man it recently traded five terrorism detainees to free.

    The petition asks the White House to “Punish Bowe Bergdahl for being AWOL/Desertion during Operation Enduring Freedom.” It went live Saturday and needs 100,000 signatures by June 30 to garner a White House response.
    Afghanistan criticizes swap for Bergdahl

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    Last edited by Garandman; 06-02-14 at 01:54 PM.
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    go faster cdovego's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Seems pretty obvious what's happening here if you're in the know.

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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    The father is now under suspicion for being one who is working to free prisoners from Guantanamo. I can't find the original article I read (I believe it was USA Today), but this link brings you to the see the Tweet he deleted. http://www.wtam.com/onair/bob-frantz...her-a-12415101

    And it's interesting how the release didn't follow any of the rules and it comes back to the "President has the power to make the decision". Why is there a system in order if it is all going to fall on one man who isn't interested in following the systems in place? The whole system, from top to bottom is broken, and it's this broken system which just released who I believe are 5 terrorists to go back and do it all again.

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    go faster cdovego's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Exactly how I see it too.

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  15. #15
    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Quote Originally Posted by aprilb View Post
    The father is now under suspicion for being one who is working to free prisoners from Guantanamo. I can't find the original article I read (I believe it was USA Today), but this link brings you to the see the Tweet he deleted. http://www.wtam.com/onair/bob-frantz...her-a-12415101 //
    What father wouldn't do anything to free his son?

    He wasn't the only soldier disillusioned with the mission, but he sure picked a bad way to to show it.

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    Lifer SteveM's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    If he did desert and if six were killed looking for him, imagine being their parents...

    I completely get doing anything to get my child back, regardless of circumstances.

    As to his decision, I wasn't there and I did not serve. It isn't my place to judge from the comfy armchair the armed forces afford me.

    Of course, if it was winter on NESR, it would be different!

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  17. #17
    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveM View Post
    If he did desert and if six were killed looking for him, imagine being their parents...

    I completely get doing anything to get my child back, regardless of circumstances.

    As to his decision, I wasn't there and I did not serve. It isn't my place to judge from the comfy armchair the armed forces afford me.//
    You don't have to judge. Members of his own platoon, who were prevented from speaking out about his circumstances while he was captive, are now speaking up. Knowledgeable military observers are stating that he did desert. He mailed home books and uniforms. He had discussed it with other soldiers.

    The Pentagon has not said how Bergdahl was captured, but a defense official has confirmed he walked off his post without authorization before he was captured.
    Without question the Army investigation will continue. It may come to pass that they even begin court martial proceedings against him.

    Understand that desertion of your post in a combat situation is a very, very serious charge in the Army. It is punishable by death (though unlikely - his mental state at the time would be taken into account). He was in a combat outpost at the time. Paratroopers (and Rangers and Special Forces) also sign a special contract (that basically says "You will often operate behind enemy lines where it will be impossible to relieve you - deal with it") that may or may not have bearing.

    There were thousands of deserters from the services during the recent conflicts: but almost all of them occurred on US soil and thus may be treated as "Absent without Leave" instead, depending on the circumstances. The difference is that someone who deserts intends to stay away permanently.

    There is some speculation already that the Obama administration may prevent the Army from conducting a court martial. All speculation. Right or wrong the guy has been through an ordeal and deserves a chance to get healthy.

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    Last edited by Garandman; 06-03-14 at 09:24 AM.
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    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Very latest update.

    The Army may still pursue an investigation that could lead to desertion or other charges against Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl, who was freed from five years of Taliban captivity in a prisoner exchange last weekend, Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff said Tuesday.

    Dempsey also told The Associated Press in a telephone interview from his plane that Bergdahl’s next promotion to staff sergeant, which was set to happen soon, is no longer automatic because Bergdahl isn’t missing in action any longer.

    Speaking publicly for the first time about the case, Dempsey said he does not want to prejudge the outcome of any investigation or say anything that might influence a commander’s decision.

    But he said U.S. military leaders “have been accused of looking away from misconduct, and it’s premature” to assume they would do so in Bergdahl’s case, despite the soldier’s five years as a Taliban prisoner.

    ....There are a variety of offenses related to an absence without proper approval, and a number of potential actions could be taken by the military. He could be tried by court martial under the Uniform Code of Military Justice for desertion; he could be given a non-judicial punishment for a lesser charge, such as being away without leave. And he could be given credit for time already served while he was a prisoner.

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  19. #19
    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    And from his brother Paratroopers.

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  20. #20
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Waiting for either side to spin this against each other. Oh wait, it's already happening.

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  21. #21
    Lifer greenmonster's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    sounds good to me...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Bowe Bergdahl-trade-marine-jpg  

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    Last edited by greenmonster; 06-03-14 at 12:15 PM.
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  22. #22
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Hmmm, which party is blocking immigration reform because FUCK MEXICO?

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  23. #23
    Lifer odduc's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Did I stumble upon an immigration reform discussion?

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  24. #24
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Quote Originally Posted by TheIglu View Post
    Waiting for either side to spin this against each other. Oh wait, it's already happening.
    Absolutely inevitable, because the [secret] negotiations were leaked in 2011, it was done over the objections of many Republicans and some Democrats, and the precedents are a lot more complicated than the simplistic "We don't negotiate with terrorists" might imply. Carter negotiated with Iranian "Terrorists", Reagan had Iran-Contra, Clinton met with Jerry Adams when he was still officially a terrorist, and Bush's administration made deals with Sunni "Terrorists" in Anbar province. See how I did that? Two Democratic and two Republican precedents.

    The BIG difference is that in this case we were negotiating for an American Prisoner of War. Bergdahl was naive at best and mentally ill at worst when he walked away, but there's no doubt he was being held prisoner and that the Taliban is conducting military operations in that theater. The Taliban is not on the state department's official terrorist organization list. So while it might have been a bad deal or not, it is as fair to say that this was a prisoner swap.

    That the Democrats and Republicans are politicizing all this should come as no surprise to anyone. And both parties wonder why more Americans are now Independents than members of either party....

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  25. #25
    Lifer Kurlon's Avatar
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    Re: Bowe Bergdahl

    Didn't Obama just sign a Democrat pushed through law specifically outlawing what Obama just did?

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