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There is no god

  1. #451
    Lifer richw's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god


    Look it all simply breaks down to

    My God can beat up your God

    WHY ?

    Because He's, 3, three, Three Gods in One.

    God the father knows what to do

    God the Son gets things done.

    God the Spirit can sneak around and watch you when you sleep....Oh yes he is... NO wait he's watching Charlize Theron while she sleeps Ok then, carry on

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  2. #452
    Lifer a13x's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by seth399 View Post
    this day and age your friends condemned you for that??? Not calling you a liar just wondering if that's true
    I'd been 'condemned' by folks (not exactly friends) in this 'day and age'. Dude Seth you HAVE been to the South haven't you? Not like we live in these enlightened times. Shit just read this thread


    PS: I can't wait till the day we discover life on other planets. Ha. Religious people are going to have a field day with that.

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  3. #453
    Posting Freak yesterdayze's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by a13x View Post
    PS: I can't wait till the day we discover life on other planets. Ha. Religious people are going to have a field day with that.
    Amusingly enough (while I tend to doubt we will discover sentient life on other planets as I doubt we will make it before our world ends lol) at least as far as religious people who use the Bible, there is nothing in the Bible that says there can't be aliens. Nothing says there is either. It does mention that Lucifier was the prince of this domain. Some think this indicates other domains. I think they are stretching, nonetheless, it never says there aren't. So I guess even IF that did happen, it wouldn't throw all religious people for as big a loop as you assume, and I'm pretty sure God is big enough to be God whether or not aliens exist. On the other hand, the people that would hail aliens as saviours, now those people worry me :p

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  4. #454
    Just Registered 13's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by a13x View Post
    PS: I can't wait till the day we discover life on other planets. Ha. Religious people are going to have a field day with that.
    Are you helping with that search? Download the screensaver and let your computer search when it's not in use!


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  5. #455
    Posting Freak yesterdayze's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by 7.62gigawatts View Post
    Are you helping with that search? Download the screensaver and let your computer search when it's not in use!


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  6. #456
    Just Registered Cheese's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    Amusingly enough (while I tend to doubt we will discover sentient life on other planets as I doubt we will make it before our world ends lol) at least as far as religious people who use the Bible, there is nothing in the Bible that says there can't be aliens. Nothing says there is either. It does mention that Lucifier was the prince of this domain. Some think this indicates other domains. I think they are stretching, nonetheless, it never says there aren't. So I guess even IF that did happen, it wouldn't throw all religious people for as big a loop as you assume, and I'm pretty sure God is big enough to be God whether or not aliens exist. On the other hand, the people that would hail aliens as saviors, now those people worry me :p
    A fine theory if they (visiting aliens) are less advanced than us. If they are more advanced, they will chuckle at our fairy tales of how the earth was created by a God and straighten out the myths once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    On the other hand, the people that would hail aliens as saviors, now those people worry me :p
    Why? What if aliens have answers?
    • Ways to correct global warming
    • Advanced medicine to cure the terminally ill
    • Alternate clean energy sources
    • Solutions to undue all the bad we have done to our planet without Armageddon

    I'm not talking miracles here, just modern science.

    Good luck with your search to prove that aliens don't exist. I think a similar search has been done for a certain other higher being without much success.

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    Last edited by Cheese; 11-01-09 at 09:16 AM.

  7. #457
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by Ćheese View Post
    I think a similar search has been done for a certain other higher being without much success.
    Oh snap!

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  8. #458
    Posting Freak yesterdayze's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by Ćheese View Post


    Why? What if aliens have answers?
    • Ways to correct global warming
    • Advanced medicine to cure the terminally ill
    • Alternate clean energy sources
    • Solutions to undue all the bad we have done to our planet without Armageddon

    I'm not talking miracles here, just modern science.

    Good luck with your search to prove that aliens don't exist. I think a similar search has been done for a certain other higher being without much success.
    Why would you assume they are more advanced? Besides, answers don't make a savior and what search to prove aliens don't exist are you talking about? I commented that I have no qualms about them existing. As I mentioned I tend to doubt we will ever get there, but I have no problem with them existing or not existing.

    On that similar search to the one that you pulled out of thin air... I would hazard that all the changed lives and miracles that are too inconvenient to acknowledge would tend to indicate a little higher level of success in finding that certain other higher being you mentioned. That's just my take. You and your enlightened mind of course have the right to subject this to whatever convenience works for you.

    On a side note, you do realize global warming isn't even widely excepted any more right? Pretty much has been proven that we are just observing a standard cycle. While I applaud all the fruits of the resultant paranoia (more energy efficient stuff, lower emissions on cars etc) and while I appreciate that it gives 'knowledgeable' people something to argue about rather then bombarding me with their 'proofs' that I am a fool for putting my faith in a God that must not exist because they can't see Him, I do wish they would do a little less media learning and a little more real research.

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  9. #459
    Just Registered Cheese's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    Why would you assume they are more advanced?
    In a word, evolution. It will depend on who discovers whom. Since we were supposedly created in God's image, being discovered by a more advance species that doesn't share our form could throw another monkey wrench into the bible.

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    Besides, answers don't make a savior
    Indeed. The opposite is true since a savior's miracle provides an easy answer.

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    I would hazard that all the changed lives and miracles that are too inconvenient to acknowledge would tend to indicate a little higher level of success in finding that certain other higher being you mentioned.
    Again, miracles are the easy answers to a complex occurrence that we don't understand.

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    On a side note, you do realize global warming isn't even widely excepted any more right? Pretty much has been proven that we are just observing a standard cycle.
    Yes, we have evidence of temperature cycles but we do not have any record of a temperature increase that is this rapid.

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  10. #460
    Posting Freak yesterdayze's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by Ćheese View Post
    In a word, evolution. It will depend on who discovers whom. Since we were supposedly created in God's image, being discovered by a more advance species that doesn't share our form could throw another monkey wrench into the bible.

    I suppose we will see If God suddenly comes back through the clouds ready to judge the world I would imagine that would put a monkey wrench in evolutionists theories, and personally, right or wrong, I would rather have been thought a fool in man's eyes then God's.

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  11. #461
    Just Registered Cheese's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    I would rather have been thought a fool in man's eyes then God's.
    Touche

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  12. #462
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by Ćheese View Post
    Touche
    you forgot that umlatte thingamafreekinjiggy....

    Touché

    I would rather have been thought a fool in man's eyes then God's.
    And, as far as I'm concerned, that didnt earn a touché....it was a lame point...again! (Unless you were implying that he IS a fool in your eyes...in which case the touché goes to you...!)

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    Last edited by DucDave; 11-02-09 at 07:55 AM.
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  13. #463
    Lifer richw's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Even an Infinite God is tired of this thread

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  14. #464
    Posting Freak yesterdayze's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by richw View Post
    Even an Infinite God is tired of this thread
    Indeed, which is why I think most people were trying to not even breath on this thread for fear that the resurrection applies to old threads as well haha..... let it die

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  15. #465
    Perpetual Amateur CEO's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Bertrand Russell made a good analogy about this BS, way back in the day...

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  16. #466
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    Re: There is no god

    LOL ....thank you CEO for the wiki reference

    A direct lift from that article
    In an article entitled "Is There a God?"[1], commissioned, but never published, by Illustrated magazine in 1952, Russell wrote:
    If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time.[2]

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  17. #467
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    Re: There is no god

    To quote the late, great George Carlin..

    Quote Originally Posted by George Carlin
    When it comes to bullshit, big-time, major league bullshit, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time!

    But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit!

    But I want you to know something, this is sincere, I want you to know, when it comes to believing in God, I really tried. I really, really tried. I tried to believe that there is a God, who created each of us in His own image and likeness, loves us very much, and keeps a close eye on things. I really tried to believe that, but I gotta tell you, the longer you live, the more you look around, the more you realize, something is fucked up.

    Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed. Results like these do not belong on the résumé of a Supreme Being. This is the kind of shit you'd expect from an office temp with a bad attitude. And just between you and me, in any decently-run universe, this guy would've been out on his all-powerful ass a long time ago. And by the way, I say "this guy", because I firmly believe, looking at these results, that if there is a God, it has to be a man.

    No woman could or would ever fuck things up like this. So, if there is a God, I think most reasonable people might agree that he's at least incompetent, and maybe, just maybe, doesn't give a shit. Doesn't give a shit, which I admire in a person, and which would explain a lot of these bad results.

    So rather than be just another mindless religious robot, mindlessly and aimlessly and blindly believing that all of this is in the hands of some spooky incompetent father figure who doesn't give a shit, I decided to look around for something else to worship. Something I could really count on.

    And immediately, I thought of the sun. Happened like that. Overnight I became a sun-worshipper. Well, not overnight, you can't see the sun at night. But first thing the next morning, I became a sun-worshipper. Several reasons. First of all, I can see the sun, okay? Unlike some other gods I could mention, I can actually see the sun. I'm big on that. If I can see something, I don't know, it kind of helps the credibility along, you know? So everyday I can see the sun, as it gives me everything I need; heat, light, food, flowers in the park, reflections on the lake, an occasional skin cancer, but hey. At least there are no crucifixions, and we're not setting people on fire simply because they don't agree with us.

    Sun worship is fairly simple. There's no mystery, no miracles, no pageantry, no one asks for money, there are no songs to learn, and we don't have a special building where we all gather once a week to compare clothing. And the best thing about the sun, it never tells me I'm unworthy. Doesn't tell me I'm a bad person who needs to be saved. Hasn't said an unkind word. Treats me fine. So, I worship the sun. But, I don't pray to the sun. Know why? I wouldn't presume on our friendship. It's not polite.

    I've often thought people treat God rather rudely, don't you? Asking trillions and trillions of prayers every day. Asking and pleading and begging for favors. Do this, gimme that, I need a new car, I want a better job. And most of this praying takes place on Sunday His day off. It's not nice. And it's no way to treat a friend.

    But people do pray, and they pray for a lot of different things, you know, your sister needs an operation on her crotch, your brother was arrested for defecating in a mall. But most of all, you'd really like to fuck that hot little redhead down at the convenience store. You know, the one with the eyepatch and the clubfoot? Can you pray for that? I think you'd have to. And I say, fine. Pray for anything you want. Pray for anything, but what about the Divine Plan?

    Remember that? The Divine Plan. Long time ago, God made a Divine Plan. Gave it a lot of thought, decided it was a good plan, put it into practice. And for billions and billions of years, the Divine Plan has been doing just fine. Now, you come along, and pray for something. Well suppose the thing you want isn't in God's Divine Plan? What do you want Him to do? Change His plan? Just for you? Doesn't it seem a little arrogant? It's a Divine Plan. What's the use of being God if every run-down shmuck with a two-dollar prayerbook can come along and fuck up Your Plan?

    And here's something else, another problem you might have: Suppose your prayers aren't answered. What do you say? "Well, it's God's will." "Thy Will Be Done." Fine, but if it's God's will, and He's going to do what He wants to anyway, why the fuck bother praying in the first place? Seems like a big waste of time to me! Couldn't you just skip the praying part and go right to His Will? It's all very confusing.

    So to get around a lot of this, I decided to worship the sun. But, as I said, I don't pray to the sun. You know who I pray to? Joe Pesci. Two reasons: First of all, I think he's a good actor, okay? To me, that counts. Second, he looks like a guy who can get things done. Joe Pesci doesn't fuck around. In fact, Joe Pesci came through on a couple of things that God was having trouble with.

    For years I asked God to do something about my noisy neighbor with the barking dog, Joe Pesci straightened that cocksucker out with one visit. It's amazing what you can accomplish with a simple baseball bat.

    So I've been praying to Joe for about a year now. And I noticed something. I noticed that all the prayers I used to offer to God, and all the prayers I now offer to Joe Pesci, are being answered at about the same 50% rate. Half the time I get what I want, half the time I don't. Same as God, 50-50. Same as the four-leaf clover and the horseshoe, the wishing well and the rabbit's foot, same as the Mojo Man, same as the Voodoo Lady who tells you your fortune by squeezing the goat's testicles, it's all the same: 50-50. So just pick your superstition, sit back, make a wish, and enjoy yourself.

    And for those of you who look to The Bible for moral lessons and literary qualities, I might suggest a couple of other stories for you. You might want to look at the Three Little Pigs, that's a good one. Has a nice happy ending, I'm sure you'll like that. Then there's Little Red Riding Hood, although it does have that X-rated part where the Big Bad Wolf actually eats the grandmother. Which I didn't care for, by the way. And finally, I've always drawn a great deal of moral comfort from Humpty Dumpty. The part I like the best? "All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put Humpty Dumpty back together again." That's because there is no Humpty Dumpty, and there is no God. None, not one, no God, never was.

    In fact, I'm gonna put it this way. If there is a God, may he strike this audience dead! See? Nothing happened. Nothing happened? Everybody's okay? All right, tell you what, I'll raise the stakes a little bit. If there is a God, may he strike me dead. See? Nothing happened, oh, wait, I've got a little cramp in my leg. And my balls hurt. Plus, I'm blind. I'm blind, oh, now I'm okay again, must have been Joe Pesci, huh? God Bless Joe Pesci. Thank you all very much. Joe Bless You!

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  18. #468
    Posting Freak yesterdayze's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    I suppose some things it is best to just roll your eyes at. Those two quotes would definitely make it into my list of "umm, okay *shrug*".

    I guess I am curious though;

    Why does the fact that some people believe in God, or are Christians get you so wound up? Did some religious person shoot his or her mouth off and act like a jerk to you or mock you? If so, ignore them and they will hopefully figure out that doing that is immature and shows a lack of understanding of the concept of "personal" beliefs as well as a lack of intellectual depth to their own beliefs; and yeah, that goes both ways. This thread was started because the author was apparently intellectually curious on people's reasons for believing. He asked. People debated back and forth, mostly politely and honestly, so why waste your time in this thread if your goal is merely to be a prick?

    You have the right to your personal beliefs whatever they may be and whether or not I agree with them I will argue just as strongly for your right to them as I will for what I believe. Someday we both die. That much we can both agree on. The way I see it we are playing a game of "Heads I win, tales you lose". Either way I win. You on the other hand have a 50/50 chance of being right and a 50/50 chance of being wrong. I'm not saying that to play the fear card. Obviously the fear card wouldn't have any effect on you since you are certain that you can't be wrong. I'm being honest about why I examined what I did with open eyes and made it a point to study not just listen to what religious people or non religious people said.

    What it boils down to is people have it all backwards. You have way more faith then I do. I didn't have nearly enough faith to be an atheist. I am very scientifically minded but there was just too much that made me wonder if there wasn't more. So that left agnostic. I didn't have enough faith to sit and hope I was all set so I went out and searched. What I found opened my eyes and I believe. Does it bother you that I don't have as much faith as you do? I would suggest that you be happy that you are so confident in the infallibility of your conclusion and if you are intellectually curious as to why someone didn't choose to go the same way as you then ask, but have the decency to interact with some level of courtesy.


    And seriously, for the love of God, or for crying out loud or for pete's sake or whatever floats your boat....seriously.... this thread..... it's like a horror movie where you want to scream at the screen 'just stay down!!!'



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  19. #469
    Career Grifter KawiSmurf's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    I have tried hard, oh so very hard, to refrain from entering this thread, but I don't see why I should be biting my tongue. This being a public forum and all, I guess I may as well comment on few things.


    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    Did some religious person shoot his or her mouth off and act like a jerk to you or mock you?
    It'd be much easier to point out the ones that haven't acted like that.

    I had a really good friend in high school that I used to occasionally get into a debate with over religion, because he acted like the kind of person you described. He was raised in a strongly christian family, and consistently defended the virtues he was taught as a child. It always ended in a stalemate, he not understanding my point of view, and I not understanding his. What we did understand, is that we could be good friends despite our core difference.

    Years later, after going to college, joining the peace corps, and heading up a large independent humanitarian effort on the west coast, that same friend is now very much an atheist. I recently asked him why, what it was that changed him. He told me the major turning point was helping in the relief effort down in New Orleans. Over the years since then, he's seen even more of the dark side of humanity, and now knows in his heart that there is absolutely no fucking way there is any kind of "enlightened being" behind it all. In his words: "If there is a god, we don't need his kind of help. If this is all his doing, he can just fuck off."

    Again, from a man who was once one of the most devout christians I've ever met.


    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    Those two quotes would definitely make it into my list of "umm, okay *shrug*".

    The way I see it we are playing a game of "Heads I win, tales you lose". Either way I win. You on the other hand have a 50/50 chance of being right and a 50/50 chance of being wrong.
    And they way I see it, your comments like these sound a bit smug, and mean you are seriously verging on acting like the very type of religious person you previously condemned. I would think that after some of the posts you've left, you'd be one of the last to say there has to be a winner and loser, or a right and wrong here.


    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    You have way more faith then I do.
    I seriously, seriously doubt that. Seriously. I don't need 'faith' to get through my daily life. Some people do need that. I get up for work everyday, do my job, come home, and live comfortably and happily without having to believe someone is guiding me through it all. I make decisions for myself, be they good or bad. I am mature enough to take responsibility for my own actions without having to blame a so-called "higher power."

    Chris brought up Russell's teapot, which I think of everytime I see the comments from the religious folks in this thread. Sometimes I like to think I belong to the church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, if only for the comparative self-awareness factor.


    Quote Originally Posted by yesterdayze View Post
    And seriously, for the love of God, or for crying out loud or for pete's sake or whatever floats your boat....seriously.... this thread..... it's like a horror movie where you want to scream at the screen 'just stay down!!!'


    hypocrite
    Pronunciation: \ˈhi-pə-ˌkrit\
    Function: noun

    1 : a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion
    2 : a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings


    As with all threads/forums on the interwebs, contributing to it will not make it go away any faster.

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    Last edited by KawiSmurf; 11-04-09 at 02:18 AM.

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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by Tabby View Post
    Wow, I can't believe some of you guys. So many damn absolutes. You know that posting this will generate heated responses from those with some manner of spirituality. They almost have to.
    I'm an AGNOSTIC. Which means, at least to me, that I just plain don't have, or claim to know "The Answer". Where do we come from? The most sincere answer? I don't know.
    Is there a god? I don't know. Where do we go when we pass? I don't know. I put no faith in the various dogmas that exist. They were all created by man, or men who claim to have conversed with a divinity. Are they wrong? I don't know. As an atheist would rule out any possiblity of a supreme being or entity, I can't support their dogma either. How do they ultimately know? They don't. The various peoples put "faith" to the forefront of their belief systems. Faith isn't fact. It may be very strong and unwavering, but it isn't fact. We humans seem to have an intrinsic need for some kind social, spiritual, or philisophical structure to guide us. Are they/we wrong? I don't know. As an agnostic, I try to take as neutral a stance as is practical. If I see people trying to live good, fruitful lives, with good measures of kindness involved, I almost don't care how they got there. They are fine by me. In my limited travels and life, I have seen good and bad examples of almost every dogma practiced by people. As far as where do we go when we expire? I don't know. I do fall back on the most simple of lessons taught in high school physics class. Energy is neither created or destroyed. It is transformed from form to another.
    Is life a form of energy? I don't know. I'll leave with some lyrics from my favorite band, Rush.
    "Why are we here? Because we are here! Roll the bones!"
    "Why does it happen? Because it happens! Roll the bones"

    Have fun!!

    Couldn't have said it better myself.

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  21. #471
    Just Registered drop's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by KawiSmurf650 View Post
    I have tried hard, oh so very hard, to refrain from entering this thread, but I don't see why I should be biting my tongue. This being a public forum and all, I guess I may as well comment on few things.




    It'd be much easier to point out the ones that haven't acted like that.

    I had a really good friend in high school that I used to occasionally get into a debate with over religion, because he acted like the kind of person you described. He was raised in a strongly christian family, and consistently defended the virtues he was taught as a child. It always ended in a stalemate, he not understanding my point of view, and I not understanding his. What we did understand, is that we could be good friends despite our core difference.

    Years later, after going to college, joining the peace corps, and heading up a large independent humanitarian effort on the west coast, that same friend is now very much an atheist. I recently asked him why, what it was that changed him. He told me the major turning point was helping in the relief effort down in New Orleans. Over the years since then, he's seen even more of the dark side of humanity, and now knows in his heart that there is absolutely no fucking way there is any kind of "enlightened being" behind it all. In his words: "If there is a god, we don't need his kind of help. If this is all his doing, he can just fuck off."

    Again, from a man who was once one of the most devout christians I've ever met.




    And they way I see it, your comments like these sound a bit smug, and mean you are seriously verging on acting like the very type of religious person you previously condemned. I would think that after some of the posts you've left, you'd be one of the last to say there has to be a winner and loser, or a right and wrong here.




    I seriously, seriously doubt that. Seriously. I don't need 'faith' to get through my daily life. Some people do need that. I get up for work everyday, do my job, come home, and live comfortably and happily without having to believe someone is guiding me through it all. I make decisions for myself, be they good or bad. I am mature enough to take responsibility for my own actions without having to blame a so-called "higher power."

    Chris brought up Russell's teapot, which I think of everytime I see the comments from the religious folks in this thread. Sometimes I like to think I belong to the church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, if only for the comparative self-awareness factor.




    hypocrite
    Pronunciation: \ˈhi-pə-ˌkrit\
    Function: noun

    1 : a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion
    2 : a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings


    As with all threads/forums on the interwebs, contributing to it will not make it go away any faster.




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  22. #472
    Rider. Just a rider... DucDave's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    You have one fuckin chance at this. There is no afterlife. Live today as if you will never have another day like this one. Do no harm to others. Expect that others will do no harm to you.

    Do good because it makes YOU feel good. We have evolved that way for a reason.

    So, yesterdayze....you actually lose. Wasting time and energy propping up a fairytale that has outlived is utility as anything other than a morality play.

    And I believe Russell is wrong. It's actually a teacup....

    “Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.” Richard Dawkins

    and, more importantly,

    "...when two opposite points of view are expressed with equal intensity, the truth does not necessarily lie exactly halfway between them. It is possible for one side to be simply wrong." Richard Dawkins

    The God Delusion is one of the clearest articulations of the problems that are manifested by belief in God and the why athiesm respresents a far better path going forward.

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  23. #473
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    Re: There is no god

    Quote Originally Posted by KawiSmurf650 View Post
    It'd be much easier to point out the ones that haven't acted like that.
    Which goes both ways, I was asking him personally because I was curious. That big long Gerorge Carlin rant obviously was going to come across how it was intended to; mocking and condescending.

    Quote Originally Posted by KawiSmurf650 View Post
    And they way I see it, your comments like these sound a bit smug, and mean you are seriously verging on acting like the very type of religious person you previously condemned. I would think that after some of the posts you've left, you'd be one of the last to say there has to be a winner and loser, or a right and wrong here.
    Nah, no smugness intended, and my apologies for sounding that way just stating the way I see it which is why I prefaced it by that. My personal reason.

    After some of the posts, especially after the post my response was aimed at I do however find commenting on my perceived smugness slightly ironic; no offense intended, just amused. Still, I can see how it came across and perhaps I should have been more clear that I was posting the response mainly to the guy who posted the Carlin stuff and was talking about my personal reasons; reasons I don't feel any of you should have to apply to yourselves if you don't agree. Merely stating that is my personal take on it.

    As for a right or wrong, neither of us can currently prove who is right or wrong. Regardless of that unless you assume there are alternate realities for each of our beliefs and we go into that reality when we die then both of us can't be right. So, one of us has to be wrong. He believes he is right, I believe I am right and there would be little point to believing if we didn't actually think we were right. I made sure I was careful to reiterate that I standby the idea of everyone having the right to their own belief, and frankly, my response was more aimed at the unnecessary incindery quote by Carlin that was posted. Was I offended myself? Nah, I just thought it was rather lame and was if anything more annoyed that people felt the need to post a half page mocking rant while other people had been trying to have an honest discussion. I have often been told by many of my non christian friends that I am probably the easiest Christian to be around that is still actually a Christian. I'd hate to come across wrong and offend some of those friends.


    Quote Originally Posted by KawiSmurf650 View Post
    Seriously. I don't need 'faith' to get through my daily life. Some people do need that. I get up for work everyday, do my job, come home, and live comfortably and happily without having to believe someone is guiding me through it all.
    What I was saying is that for me, I wouldn't have enough faith in myself to not take the safe way out even if I didn't initially have beliefs. I wasn't saying he has more faith in a higher power, he has more faith in the conclusion that there is no higher power. A faith I don't share as even if I thought I could 'prove' to myself the nonexistence of a higher power, the nagging doubt would still lead me to the need to find something.

    If I am going to be reminded so often of the Christians that get out there and act arrogant because of their belief systems then it seems only fair that we also look at the fact that non Christians do the same thing in the way that they mock and deride Christians, especially if they are doing it in the same thread comments about Christians doing it were made. That is clean cut hypocrisy.

    As for myself sounding hypocritical, I hope I haven't been and if I have been then I sincerely apologize. I can see the hypocrisy in posting to a thread I want to die however... so my bad on that.... The stupid thread keeps coming back to life after days of being dead. I was rather hoping it would die a few pages back where we both were like 'okay, we agree, it can't be proven either way and we both respect each others right to their own beliefs'. I suppose refraining on posting when new comments are made would help....it's... just... so.. hard.. captain, I canna do it....

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  24. #474
    Rider. Just a rider... DucDave's Avatar
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    Re: There is no god

    but...you do have to get in the last word...right?

    (like my wife...)

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  25. #475
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    Re: There is no god

    I'm getting really sick of all the stupid quoting in this thread. You can all quote as many idiots as you want, it doesn't make one side or the other any more or less true.

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