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KTM Freeride E-XC

  1. #76
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC


    If sound is a concern, and performance, you should go to an RC car off road race some time. Real pro level stuff. Then you can see the fuel burners and electric ones on the same track.

    They don't even race them in the same class. The electrics absolutely SLAUGHTER the gas. It's not even a competition. And hearing a brushless electric mod class truck hooking up on dirt on the straightaway is music, man. It's just not as loud. JUST as angry, if not more so.


    Everyone had the same complaints/get off my lawn/change is bad when the first higher performance 4 strokes came out. WELL SEE THAT 125 WILL KICK THE SHIT OUT OF THE 125 STROKER, SO THEY HAD TO CHEAT AND GO 250CC, SEE I'M RIGHT

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  2. #77
    Lifer Chippertheripper's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by TheIglu View Post
    If sound is a concern, and performance, you should go to an RC car off road race some time. Real pro level stuff. Then you can see the fuel burners and electric ones on the same track.

    They don't even race them in the same class. The electrics absolutely SLAUGHTER the gas. It's not even a competition. And hearing a brushless electric mod class truck hooking up on dirt on the straightaway is music, man. It's just not as loud. JUST as angry, if not more so.


    Everyone had the same complaints/get off my lawn/change is bad when the first higher performance 4 strokes came out. WELL SEE THAT 125 WILL KICK THE SHIT OUT OF THE 125 STROKER, SO THEY HAD TO CHEAT AND GO 250CC, SEE I'M RIGHT

    Why would anyone go to a nerdfest like that?!

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  3. #78
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Beats getting laid and racing motorcycles.

    Seriously though, I was spending the same amount monthly racing off road 1/10'th stock class, which is the EX500 class of the RC world, as I was racing an actual EX500 at the same time. That's when I sold it all off and just went with bike racing.

    What can I say? I just like racing, in all forms. Driving + racing. Just gets me goin. You should see how brutal shit gets on go-karts. Lol.

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  4. #79
    Where is my fast? GixerJockey's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    You ride goofy trail bikes. I ride Moto. Completely different world.
    Debatable...




    But the fact that you're a dildo, is not.

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  5. #80
    Lifer Kurlon's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    The RC world currently doesn't mirror the dirtbike world in one key area: Total energy required

    In the RC world, the energy required to complete a race is low enough that the energy storage density penalty that you get with current battery tech isn't big enough vs nitro that the electric RC is running with a smaller power supply. As a result the electric's ability to more quickly dump that available energy on demand outweighs the gasser's ability to carry more raw energy potential overall.

    On the dirtbike scene, the electrics still need to be output limited to get a viable runtime vs their gasser counterparts while trying to stay close in weight. As batt tech gets better, that'll change as it has with RC cars, but we haven't hit that crossing point in the curves yet.

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  6. #81
    Your Father csmutty's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by TheIglu View Post
    If sound is a concern, and performance, you should go to an RC car off road race some time. Real pro level stuff. Then you can see the fuel burners and electric ones on the same track.

    They don't even race them in the same class. The electrics absolutely SLAUGHTER the gas. It's not even a competition. And hearing a brushless electric mod class truck hooking up on dirt on the straightaway is music, man. It's just not as loud. JUST as angry, if not more so.


    Everyone had the same complaints/get off my lawn/change is bad when the first higher performance 4 strokes came out. WELL SEE THAT 125 WILL KICK THE SHIT OUT OF THE 125 STROKER, SO THEY HAD TO CHEAT AND GO 250CC, SEE I'M RIGHT
    That would be true if 4 strokes were actually better...

    They had to handicap the 2 strokes in order to make the 4 strokes competitive... Remember?

    And how many off road riders here are on 2 strokes vs 4? I'd be willing to wager there are more 2 strokes. Go to a woods race. You'll see...2 strokes.

    The facade of being new tech wore off and people realized they actually missed their 2 strokes and went back. Eventually people might realize electric isn't better and will go back to 2 strokes. Seems to be a cycle.

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  7. #82
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurlon View Post
    The RC world currently doesn't mirror the dirtbike world in one key area: Total energy required

    In the RC world, the energy required to complete a race is low enough that the energy storage density penalty that you get with current battery tech isn't big enough vs nitro that the electric RC is running with a smaller power supply. As a result the electric's ability to more quickly dump that available energy on demand outweighs the gasser's ability to carry more raw energy potential overall.

    On the dirtbike scene, the electrics still need to be output limited to get a viable runtime vs their gasser counterparts while trying to stay close in weight. As batt tech gets better, that'll change as it has with RC cars, but we haven't hit that crossing point in the curves yet.
    Oh, I realize that. But, the tech is there, and it's continuing to progress.

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  8. #83
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    That would be true if 4 strokes were actually better...

    They had to handicap the 2 strokes in order to make the 4 strokes competitive... Remember?

    And how many off road riders here are on 2 strokes vs 4? I'd be willing to wager there are more 2 strokes. Go to a woods race. You'll see...2 strokes.

    The facade of being new tech wore off and people realized they actually missed their 2 strokes and went back. Eventually people might realize electric isn't better and will go back to 2 strokes. Seems to be a cycle.
    The piston travel required for the power stroke of a 4 stroke is half of that of a two stroke. It's simply evened up the firing displacement based on necessary movement of mass.


    Of course, we sure are seeing some crazy 2 stroke GP bikes, now aren't we.....

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  9. #84
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by TheIglu View Post
    Of course, we sure are seeing some crazy 2 stroke GP bikes, now aren't we.....
    If only 2 stroke GP bikes were allowed by the rules in MotoGP...

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  10. #85
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Bah, you are no fun. Look at the tech that's resulted because of it!!!!!

    200hp leeter bikes are teh yawn now.

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  11. #86
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    If you watched straight rhythm this year, you could clearly see the difference in power and control between the 2t and 4t 250s. The 4 strokes had more options in the rhythms because they could recover more easily from mistakes, or simply spun less. I love 2t bikes, and for putting around the woods where you use 1/10 of the power, they are tractable and easy to live with. At full honk on critical obstacles/gaps, triples, etc. I think they really are harder to control. Interestingly, the electrics were out there too. They were closer than expected, but seemed a little heavy and less responsive than either 2 or 4T environmental disasters.

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  12. #87
    Your Father csmutty's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by TheIglu View Post
    The piston travel required for the power stroke of a 4 stroke is half of that of a two stroke. It's simply evened up the firing displacement based on necessary movement of mass.


    Of course, we sure are seeing some crazy 2 stroke GP bikes, now aren't we.....
    I did specify dirt riders in the above statement. Epa killed 2 strokes, which is why you don't see them in gp...

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  13. #88
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    I did specify dirt riders in the above statement. Epa killed 2 strokes, which is why you don't see them in gp...
    Wrong again. Honda killed 2strokes in GP.

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  14. #89
    Your Father csmutty's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    Wrong again. Honda killed 2strokes in GP.
    You don't think that had anything to do with the lack of 2 stroke street bikes?

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  15. #90
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Nothing. There were still millions in production at the time.

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  16. #91
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    You don't think that had anything to do with the lack of 2 stroke street bikes?
    Lack of 2 smoke street bikes in the US means nothing compared to the world market. Honda just doesn't LIKE two strokes as a company and pushed DORNA to get rid of them.

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  17. #92
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    It's not called being difficult. It's called having an opinion. Being quiet might help short term, but people are going to find something else to complain about. Change isn't always bad, but it's not always better. Our town installed an electric car charging station 4 or so years ago. I've seen exactly one car use it during that time. Don't you think if it was better more people would have bought the Kool aid? I mean... It is free fuel...
    You can both have an opinion and debate it in a difficult manner. We're in agreement that some people will find new things to complain about. But I also said earlier that I think it'll be harder for the complainers to stir up the rest of the town, as their complaints will seem more transparent as whining than genuine concerns. Only time will tell.

    Your point about the charging station is a pretty low sample, and misses that there may be other factors. Some chicken-egg problem there. To get people to buy fully electric cars, a big sticking point is ability to charge. Building a network of chargers means some may remain pretty low usage at first. Especially if your region doesn't have many buyers, so it ends up primarily catering to people on a trip from NYC to Boston. I'm sure it's been used more than you realize too. It's free? You don't put a credit card in? Even if it's totally free, the target audience for an newer and/or expensive car usually isn't super budget conscious. Especially if the charging station is miles from their home. Electric vehicles are also bought in an attempt to help reduce carbon emissions, not just fuel savings.

    Your overall point still seems like you're expecting the first model available to be better than everything, and not that it'll have to grow better over time in order for more people to see value in it. That's pretty much how all technology works. I thought my friend was silly for buying one of the early smart phones and paying extra for a 3G data plan. Tapping away with a stylus (no touchscreen), with dial-up speeds, no wifi, and most sites didn't have mobile versions. But he's exactly the guy who'd enjoy it, and people like him helped pave the way for phone-computers we all have now.
    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    And how many off road riders here are on 2 strokes vs 4? I'd be willing to wager there are more 2 strokes. Go to a woods race. You'll see...2 strokes.

    The facade of being new tech wore off and people realized they actually missed their 2 strokes and went back. Eventually people might realize electric isn't better and will go back to 2 strokes. Seems to be a cycle.
    It's true that a lot of the top riders are 2T. But 'missed their 2 stroke' is important. I think some people just prefer the riding style. Maybe it's the best for racers, but a lot of regular riders who lean 2T do so out of personal preference because they find it more exciting.

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  18. #93
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Also, the new argument against bikes instead of sound is already out there and being used against individuals riding on their own land: Dust. Electrics don't help on that front.

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  19. #94
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Yeah, dust is the new enemy...

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  20. #95
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Part of why I like my 2T woods bike is the noise doesn't carry as much as a 4T. It is, effectively, quieter.

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  21. #96
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Other people having fun that isn't your kind of fun is the enemy...

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  22. #97
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Quote Originally Posted by aldend123 View Post
    It's true that a lot of the top riders are 2T. But 'missed their 2 stroke' is important. I think some people just prefer the riding style. Maybe it's the best for racers, but a lot of regular riders who lean 2T do so out of personal preference because they find it more exciting.
    There is also a strong argument to be made, particularly in amateur racing, that two-strokes are more popular largely because they're cheaper to maintain than four-strokes.

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  23. #98
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    If dust is unhealthy, I'm fucked... Shared album - Paul Duval - Google Photos

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  24. #99

    Re: KTM Freeride E-XC

    Seriously?

    Actually my friend's uncle said dust was an accomplice in Vegas too...but nobody talks about it because of the fake news

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