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MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

  1. #26
    Lifer
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    Fuck that.

    If any kind of "cops" showed up to the local track here and tried to pull that bs I'd be livid.

    Define "valid".
    Livid with the officers themselves? Because it seems like that's misdirected anger. It should be with the legislators who passed the law. It's been half a decade since it was signed. Officers get some discretion, but should we really be expecting that they ignore a law completely without some special justification to do so?

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  2. #27
    Senior Member bstnsboy's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    In my opinion it's all about getting the tax dollar here in mass. They want to make sure you pay the sales tax on that nice new offroad toy you bought. there are some limited riding area's open in mass but from what i can see it's mostly for dirt bikes. You cant ride your atv or utv most places in mass. They can bust your chops if your on your own private property! It would be one thing if the money spent on sales tax and registration actually went back into riding area's and trail maintenance but it doesn't! It disappears into some general fund....probably for narcan for the junkie's! who knows.....It's a sad situation.

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  3. #28
    Your Father csmutty's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by aldend123 View Post
    Livid with the officers themselves? Because it seems like that's misdirected anger. It should be with the legislators who passed the law. It's been half a decade since it was signed. Officers get some discretion, but should we really be expecting that they ignore a law completely without some special justification to do so?
    If that was my job I sure as shit would be looking for a different career. That's just messed up. Couldn't go home and feel like I did something positive. Just that I pissed people off who weren't doing anything wrong but living in a state that can't control spending.

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  4. #29
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by bstnsboy View Post
    It would be one thing if the money spent on sales tax and registration actually went back into riding area's and trail maintenance but it doesn't! It disappears into some general fund....probably for narcan for the junkie's! who knows.....It's a sad situation.
    It doesn't go in to a general fund. Check a few posts back for the law. "(c) Monies deposited into the fund that are unexpended at the end of the fiscal year shall not revert to the General Fund and shall be available for expenditure in the subsequent fiscal year." And the narcan stuff is basically a barroom cliche. Think about that one a little more. For starters, if you think they're making a choice to play roulette and then need help when it goes poorly, realize non-motorcyclists could say the same about your hobby. Stick to the problem and the facts. Riding is a great hobby, and we'd all like it to be as accessible as possible.

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  5. #30

    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    lol, mad at the state for charging you a tax to use your ohv, then getting nothing in return, and possibly watching the tax money disappear into non-ohv use? gov't grab for money? you sure California didn't take over MA?

    it's worse out here...although closed competition bikes don't need registrations, anything else has a title and annual/bi-annual registration that accrues the day it's first registered. If you (or a previous owner) stops paying it, the feeds just add up. Man does it suck to transfer registration on an $800 dirt bike with $550 of registration back fees. It's just not worth it. Open desert areas = hardly (and can't) be enforced. It's only a big deal on state riding areas where they have entry gates and inspections.

    the way I justify it - I'm paying it

    but I'm trying to ride as much as I friggen can

    So just $44 for a couple years? it's not so bad, eh?

    then I figure - they will not be able to enforce any private land deals...if they do, it'll just be a %-age they keep chasing to 100, but never achieving

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  6. #31
    Lifer Chippertheripper's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    If that was my job I sure as shit would be looking for a different career. That's just messed up. Couldn't go home and feel like I did something positive. Just that I pissed people off who weren't doing anything wrong but living in a state that can't control spending.
    You're projecting.

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  7. #32
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Is there some sort of exemption that groups can apply for to cover a special event. Ie if I go to a NETRA event in Freetown and ride without a sticker, am I in violation? Or am I covered by some sort of special use permit that NETRA applied for?


    My $0.02 is with Smutty. Officers have (or at least demonstrate) a tremendous amount of latitude in what they enforce and what they don't. So yes, if they show up and ticket me for riding an organized event at a private MX course I'm going to be pissed and I'm going to take it out on them. Surely they understand how absurd this situation is?!

    I cannot understand how machine regs can be required for riding on private land. That's ridiculous. Are you going to start registering bicycles next? What about hiking shoes? Does your lawn mower? Or maybe that qualifies as an agricultural implement? Just ridiculous.

    Leave the riders alone. Get your revenue somewhere else. (Like maybe from the tax on the fuel they pump on the way to the event, from the food they buy when there, and maybe the hotel room they rent the night before.)


    My new plan is to simply not ride dirt in MA. Ever.

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  8. #33
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by nhbubba View Post
    My $0.02 is with Smutty. Officers have (or at least demonstrate) a tremendous amount of latitude in what they enforce and what they don't. So yes, if they show up and ticket me for riding an organized event at a private MX course I'm going to be pissed and I'm going to take it out on them. Surely they understand how absurd this situation is?!
    you should be pissed and taking it out on the track owner for not explaining the laws well enough. NETRA events clearly say MA reg needed unless they have a specific pass for an event. i'll get to that because The Wick mentioned this as well.

    Robby could have handled the whole thing very differently and in a way that HELPS us not hurts us. posting what he did, and i'm glad alden called out specifics, only fueled the followers into calling reps names VIA PHONE (really?) and riling them up. nothing positive comes from that.

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  9. #34
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    NETRA events clearly say MA reg needed unless they have a specific pass for an event. i'll get to that because The Wick mentioned this as well.
    So it's been a few years since I've done a NETRA event. (I know, I know..) The last one I did was in MA with Chipper, the big bearded french oaf and crew. I did not have any MA reg and thought I was covered by some sort of event thing NETRA or the club had secured. My read at present is that I was in the wrong and subject to all kinds of mean and nasty stuff like having my bike confiscated.

    Are we pissed at Wick for not securing these permits for their events? Could this have been handled that way?

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    Last edited by nhbubba; 05-05-17 at 07:55 AM.

  10. #35
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by nhbubba View Post
    So it's been a few years since I've done a NETRA event. (I know, I know..) The last one I did was in MA with Chipper, the big bearded french oaf and crew. I did not have any MA reg and thought I was covered by some sort of event thing NETRA or the club had secured.

    Are we pissed at Wick for not securing these permits for their events? Could this have been handled that way?
    the problem is that it's been a gray area, which is why being smart about all of this is better than flying off the handle and attacking anyone who isn't an off-roader. the Wick has said the EPO's position has not always been clear. initially 'closed-course' events had a pass but law is law, so it depended on who you dealt with and in what area. not good. needs revision NOW with all groups banding together.

    let me throw the emails i've received into bullet points. i really hope 508 gets back to me because they are having to deal with this head on while trying to create a new facility. they had reg stations available right at sign in. i'm VERY curious how that went.

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    Last edited by typeone; 05-05-17 at 08:00 AM.
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  11. #36
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by nhbubba View Post
    My new plan is to simply not ride dirt in MA. Ever.
    i know Mark said the same thing and so are others but i dont get it. Massachusetts has ~20 legal places to ride for pretty short cash in the long run. most, if not all, are maintained pretty damn well from what i've seen. forests grow fast, tracks get sacked out, maintenance is constant.

    totally agree with whoever said it earlier, i don't see what the big deal is ... BUT i certainly know the laws need revision. it's too general and went beyond the initial intent to keep kids educated and safe. hey, parents, how about fucking parenting for a while! accidents happen, kids die, you shouldn't strangle an entire state over that. maybe now that some time has passed, we can get things moving back in our direction. the sport is growing in MA.

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  12. #37
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    the problem is that it's been a gray area
    I agree. Gray areas are usually pretty bad. Especially when LEOs start enforcing their interpretations out of the blue. (Looks like these laws were passed in 2010. Why the enforcement now?!)

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    they had reg stations available right there.
    Explain this to me. There was a mechanism in place to reg day-of but riders ignored it? Was there some sort of paperwork requirement?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    BUT i certainly know the laws need revision. it's too general and went beyond the initial intent to keep kids educated and safe. hey, parents, how about fucking parenting for a while! accidents happen, kids die, you shouldn't strangle an entire state over that. maybe now that some time has passed, we can get things moving back in our direction. the sport is growing in MA.
    Now you're making sense.

    It's an overreaction. Overreach. And now it's apparently about to be enforced. Awesome.

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  13. #38
    Your Father csmutty's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Well now I know I'm never riding in Mass again unless it's illegal already so nfg.

    Hope CT doesn't get any ideas.

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  14. #39
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by scottieducati View Post
    From an article about "Sean's Law": "The bill also establishes an advisory group to increase communication among ATV riders, landowners, law enforcement agencies and other interested parties."

    So who is this Advisory group, how do we get involved and contact them? Seems like riders, and owners of properties to support off-road vehicles are being woefully underrepresented.
    MA OHV Advisory Committee

    Legislation signed in August of 2010 (Ch. 202 of the Acts of 2010, “An Act Regulating the Use of Off-Highway and Recreation Vehicles (the Act)”) brought significant changes to Massachusetts Recreation Vehicle Laws...

    The law also created an OHV Advisory committee with the mission:

    “The committee shall advise the secretary and the department of conservation and recreation, the department of fish and game, the department of environmental protection and the office of environmental law enforcement on matters involving the commonwealth's regulation of off-highway vehicles, as defined in section 20 of chapter 90B, including the development and enforcement of state regulations and policies, safety and training programs and the distribution of available state funding.”

    This 13-member committee consists of representatives of off-highway vehicle users, the MA Powersport Dealers Association, the Department of Public Health, child safety advocates, snowmobile users, public land organizations, private landowners, Massachusetts Forest and Park Friends Network, and state and local law enforcement authorities. The committee meets quarterly, and has advised EEA and its agencies on a variety of topics related to the implementation of the Act, including uses of the OHV program fund, outreach, education, and OHV regulations.

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    Last edited by typeone; 05-05-17 at 08:24 AM.
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  15. #40
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Hey, maybe I am overreacting.

    We've covered the requirements for an in-state rider. What about out of staters? What is the current state of that process? How would I, a NH resident register to ride in MA right now?

    For contrast in NH you are not required to have a permit to run at a private MX course or come over and putt around my back yard.
    Major events like the NETRA dirt classic are usually covered under group, special event permits and riders are not required to have permits.
    When a permit is required, they simply go to one of the gazillion OHV/snowmobile or boat reg stations, provide their VIN number, show their drivers license and pay their $67. I've done this countless times. It takes 15 minutes and is painless.

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  16. #41
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    Well now I know I'm never riding in Mass again unless it's illegal already so nfg.

    Hope CT doesn't get any ideas.
    can you even ride dirt in CT? Rocky Hill MX, Central MX, Milford MX ... that it? Thomaston Dam has never been clear to me how that works. only raced there. ah, thinking now, that's another ACE project, right?

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  17. #42
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by nhbubba View Post
    Hey, maybe I am overreacting.

    We've covered the requirements for an in-state rider. What about out of staters? What is the current state of that process? How would I, a NH resident register to ride in MA right now?

    For contrast in NH you are not required to have a permit to run at a private MX course or come over and putt around my back yard.
    Major events like the NETRA dirt classic are usually covered under group, special event permits and riders are not required to have permits.
    When a permit is required, they simply go to one of the gazillion OHV/snowmobile or boat reg stations, provide their VIN number, show their drivers license and pay their $67. I've done this countless times. It takes 15 minutes and is painless.
    if breakdirt doesn't chime in, he's always got the reg process down, i'll look it up. i don't remember.

    and yes, NH should be an example we look to. i get my NH permit at a freakin' convenience store. not cheap, but i love it. and you've gone more flexible with day passes. smaht.

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  18. #43
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    $67. Doesn't seem all that bad to me. It is per year, so roughly 3x what you pay for yours.

    In my opinion the NH permitting process is a decent example. Roll into a OHV permitting station (there are a gazillion, even marinas can issue them). Provide your VIN number and driver's license. Pay $67. Leave with stickers. Painless.

    Also NH has (again, my opinion) a pretty decent track record of putting fees back into trails and upkeep. Most of it seems to go to quad and snow use where trail bikes are prohibited.. but hey. It's something. I've seen Fish & Game enforcement dealing with individuals and I've seen them dealing with clubs (MVTR). They are approachable and not raging dicks about it. Also the enforcement seems pretty consistent year to year.

    Again.. wren't these laws passed 7 years ago? Why the sudden enforcement? Pressure from Boston?

    I can't help but draw parallels to the FUD surrounding MA gun laws.

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  19. #44
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    check out the detail i added from the OHV Advisory Committee page, that's quite a range of representation. smells fishy. i haven't been through the past meeting notes yet, but i'm planning to attend the Sept 20th meeting.

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  20. #45
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by nhbubba View Post
    $67. Doesn't seem all that bad to me. It is per year, so roughly 3x what you pay for yours.

    Again.. wren't these laws passed 7 years ago? Why the sudden enforcement? Pressure from Boston?

    I can't help but draw parallels to the FUD surrounding MA gun laws.
    it's not bad at all, i just meant i don't ride NH frequently enough so the first time i had to pay i was a little surprised. no biggie. a 4pk of craft beer is almost up to that. and i like craft beer.

    yes, your question on timing, why now, is what started this whole thing for me.

    it's actually not an all-of-a-sudden thing. NETRA was 'targeted' in 2015 and 2016, no one else ... according to NETRA, the EPO has been saying for 4 years that enforcement would be coming. well, the years have passed and no one worked to change anything (that's not a fair statement, i realize) so they're 'just doing their job' that everyone knew they were going to do.

    more on this in a bit... i don't want to just copy/paste the email exchanges.

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  21. #46
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by csmutty View Post
    Fuck that.

    If any kind of "cops" showed up to the local track here and tried to pull that bs I'd be livid.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Define "valid".
    Valid as in, it's the law on the Massachusetts books. It's not a guideline, it's not a suggestion, it's not an unofficial policy, it's not some guy's idea.. it's the law.

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  22. #47
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    more on 'why now'...

    It is quite obvious to me as I attend the OHV Committee meetings and listen to the EP’s at these meetings that 2017 was finally going to be the year of enforcement for organizations and events beyond NETRA. And the EP’s do not have to have a search warrant as has been recently suggested. Many of the events are open to the public, or to anyone who desires to observe or participant in the event. They can sit at the entrance to an event and see just one bike that appears to not have a sticker and they then have the right to take an enforcement action, etc. You say most closed courses have not had this requirement before. You are correct prior to 2010, but they did have the requirement beginning in 2010.
    regarding closed-course events...

    There is a clause in the law for certain riders to be excluded from the requirement if it is a sanctioned event and the Sanctioning organization has received a waiver from DCR.
    so, constant involvement needed by race organizations. if we've let 7 years go by and haven't made progress, that points to no one being able to work together.

    heart of the issue right here...

    There were a number of New England riders who would not ride NETRA events because they knew the EP’s might show up. There were a number of comments made on social networks indicating they thought that NETRA had the EP’s in “it's back pocket”. This was crap! We have asked, begged, and touched base with other off road riding stakeholders including JDay and certain of the motocross track owners. We have received nothing but a deaf ear! Since we were the only ones being “targeted” no one wanted to help and be part of working with us to potentially solve the problems. Some folks thought this was only a NETRA problem and they did not want to become involved in something that did not affect them. This was a mistake in my opinion. It would have been better if we could have had a group of stakeholders rallying this issue five years ago through today, and we may have been able to make some headway to fix the issues by now. We have a lobbyist who we pay to assist us and he has reached out to stakeholders, receiving no responses.
    this is total BS and the reason i mention aiming anger at the tracks and riders who refused to talk sensibly. Marshall's post on FB was not smart, not to mention misleading.

    the Wick i'm not clear on because they had a big change of hands and their own drama going down. i forget what years that happened in though, need to review.

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    Last edited by typeone; 05-05-17 at 08:56 AM.
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  23. #48
    Lifer
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by number9 View Post
    Valid as in, it's the law on the Massachusetts books. It's not a guideline, it's not a suggestion, it's not an unofficial policy, it's not some guy's idea.. it's the law.
    Just like the speed limits on I495.

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  24. #49
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    The difference in cost is not so clear. NH, no sales tax, MA 6%. So a new 10k bike costs 640 to reg that first time...

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  25. #50
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: MA OHV Laws - 2017 Edition

    this is good...

    I reached out to my local reps. I wrote a pretty thoughtful, from the heart plea. I received a quick positive response, but learned that my rep had received disrespectful, name calling messages. While it may feel good to vent, I assure you we make no progress this way. Tell a story about why this means so much to you, save the rants for a Facebook post or something.
    The OHV Advisory Committee has agreed to put on the table an exemption for "closed course competition motorcycles" It appears that while the off-road community has been well represented they were unaware of the designation as motocross bikes are designed and manufactured as such.
    I just spoke with a State Rep directly. The Rep said you must call your own rep from your town and politely explain that you would like the law to be changed to eliminate the requirement of ATVs to be registered when used on private property. My rep stated that they were going to begin the process of drafting something to change the law, but the rep further stated that everyone needs to call their own reps and be polite and discuss the issue.
    this is not...

    Lets stage a ride lets see whos king then mafuckas
    There all just a bunch of half wits who weren't good enough to be real cops so now they feel the need to be douchbags in the woods and think they can get away with what they want because there's usually no one around.
    Idk why everyone has these "problem" solving ideas state ain't gonna listen not worth bitching on fb
    uh, maybe because we should be thinking of ways to solve the problem so that we can ride... MORE

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