Paying the Stupid Tax

[loudbeard]

So I've been on the hunt for a second bike for most of the season. No real reason why as I think my Speed Triple is the most fun you can have with your clothes on. I decided on a Bonneville, bought it, and my ex's dumbass brother promptly high sided it into a curb at 10 mph after swearing he knew how to ride. (This is another topic for another thread.) As it turns out, probably the best thing that could have happened to that bike, at least as far as I'm concerned. I was actually about to "invest" money and cafe the damn thing. Well I paid ~$8100 out the door for the bike. Got ~$4300 from dummy's insurance company, fixed nothing, brought it to Bettencourt's and got $4000 for trade on a new DR-Z 400 dual sport. Great deal for me.

Well I brought it up to Jay's place this past Saturday and thrashed on it a bit....on the stock Trailwing's. Well it kept up pretty will. Obviously Jay's TC250 could smoke me at any time not to mention his skills are certainly at a higher level, but the DR-Z did nicely. The problem is now I really have a dirty itch. I think I made a mistake getting a dual sport and should have just picked up a purpose built machine. That's the problem with dual anything, they do two things decently, but neither thing very well.

I started looking at mods to make the DR-Z a better trail bike, then I started crunching numbers on what it would cost to do so. A spare set of wheels, rotors, hubs, +2 rear sprocket, and dirt tires is going to cost close to a grand. Springs for my weight (230 pounds) and a few other desirable items have me approaching $1500. For those that know my tendency to go full retard know it probably doesn't stop there....but for the sake of the argument, lets say it does.

So here's the argument: Pay the stupid tax, trade it in for a real dirt machine. I spoke with Jesse at Bettencourt's, here's the basic numbers. Trade in book value is about $4k. Retail is around $5500. Checked the numbers he quoted me with NADA and he's being straight forward with me. He said since I *just* bought the bike and would be returning my business there, he'd be "willing" to give me $5k for the bike. For comparison's sake, I paid $6700 out the door. So what we're talking about is my losing about $1700 but ending up with a bike I'll be much happier with.

So here are the options, and mostly what I'm looking for opinions on. Feel free to rub in my being a dumbass with your answers.

* Go for a new CRF250R
Pros: Right sized bike for my skill level, no previous owner history to worry about.
Cons: It costs me more of my money money.

* Swap them for a 2010 YZF450
Pros: No money out of pocket (other than what I've already wasted,) would never out grow it
Cons: Previous owner history, probably a bit too much bike for my skill level

So would you recommend a new dirt rider going straight to a 450? I do realize that it's a lot of bike. I'm a pretty experienced street rider, I have a 150 horse triple that's a wheelie, stopie, burnout monster and I handle it well. I wouldn't say the power of the 450 scares me, but I am worried it would hinder my development as a rider. Btw, the 2010 450 is a fuel injected bike and is more or less the same bike as a new one.

So bring on the thoughts, opinions, and facts. Flame away at my foolishness. Suggestions on other dirt machines, keep in mind one of the biggest reasons to swap is to drop 90 pounds on the machine and have a much better suspension.



Edit: Forgot to say, the bike will see a lot of woods riding, but will definitely be getting into so MX as well.

[MarkMarine]

I have nothing constructive to add for bike choice, as all I can recommend is the (first) only bike I've owned. But it seems that within dirt you can have a woods bike OR a MX bike, and they seem to be setup fairly different suspension wise. Dunno if there is a model or two that do both well.

As to your dilemma with the dealer, 1700 is kind of steep considering you just bought the bike, I'd be a little upset about that and try to get that loss under a grand.

Otherwise, I saw a lot of 200X bikes on CL right now that you could get with your $1700. Why not have two bikes?

[Imbeek]

Buy something like a 2005 crf250 for 2 grand and likely sell it for close to that in a year or two when you decide how much you like dirt bikes and what kind of riding you will be able to do.

Find one already set up for the type of riding you think you will like...it's actually not that easy to set the same bike up well for both motocross and tight woods.

[loudbeard]

I have been tossing around the idea of keeping the DR-Z and picking up an older bike. There are a few good options on CL:

http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/mcy/4142501298.html

http://providence.craigslist.org/mcy/4109310749.html

http://nh.craigslist.org/mcy/4129860217.html

http://nh.craigslist.org/mcy/4134050742.html

I'm not opposed to keeping the DR-Z, I just feel like it'll collect dust. Any thoughts on the above bikes?

[Jim]

Let me ride the DRZ before you get rid of it, or I'm gonna pee on your Triumph.

[Garandman]

The usual suspects: DRZ400, CRF250L, and Yamaha WR250R. Theothersean said I should buy a Yamaha WR250R, so that's what I did, at least as of this weekend. It's got a skid plate and soft bags, it will need springs for my immense mass.

[maxim_X]

How new of a dirt rider are you? Like was that your first time riding off-road? Do you plan on riding motox or trails? Usually I would advise the smallest motor full size 2 stroke machine that you can find.

[loudbeard]

Not my first time, just first time in many years. I'm 30 and I haven't ride consistently since I was about 15. Between then and now I've taken some friend's bikes out on some quick rides but that's about it. As far as whether I'd like it, no doubt. Goes hand in hand with my jeeping hobby. Things like picking a line and dealing with poor traction I already understand, just applied differently here. As of now I'd say the majority of the riding will be woods. I haven't done MX before but I would like to give it a shot - pretty sure I'd enjoy it and it always guarantees somewhere to ride. I have no doubt trail closures have been effecting the moto community the same way they have the jeep community.

So I'm backing off the stupid sauce. I'll keep the drz and just put some better tires, go +2 rear, and add a skid. I can do that for short money. There is a bunch of stuff that I know of near my Dad's place in the Swanzey area that would be great on a plated dirt bike. Mostly Class VI stuff and a few private property spots I have access to.

On the hunt for a nice used MX bike, somewhere in the $2-3k range would be ideal. I'm thinking almost any of the ones I listed above would work well provided they're in good shape.

[loudbeard]

Just to add, I had originally thought I would get a complete set of tires, wheels, rotors, hubs, ect for the drz so I could make a quick change from aggressive to street friendly. I think the best bet is to just grab a set of DOT knobbies like the Teraflex's and replace as needed. If they get chewed up quick from too much asphalt oh well, dirt tires are cheap. The bike is a lot of fun but Mark is definitely right, $1700 is way too much of a hit to take on impulsiveness.

[gregp]

My initial response is that the 250 will be much better for woods riding. The 450 will be a lot to handle in the woods. The hard off-idle hit of a 450 will make slick rock riding very difficult. Your size makes the 450 the better overall candidate, though. FWIW - I weigh about 205, and I have a 350F - the best of both worlds, IMO, but I almost never find myself on a MX track.
Put simply - In the woods, smaller/lighter is always better.

[JettaJayGLS]

I say get a set of dirt wheels and tires for easy changes for dirt/street OR get a set of trials tires and do it all on one set.

Or pick up one of the 250s or a KDX for that $1,700 hit you would be taking

[loudbeard]

Put simply - In the woods, smaller/lighter is always better.

This is what started this whole thought process. Following Jay last weekend I quickly realized I was working a whole lot harder than he had to. Plenty of that is rider skill, but a plenty is also attributed to having a bike almost 100 pounds heavier in street trim. It was a blast watching him flick that 250 around so effortlessly.

Jay, I don't think I want to bother investing in a new set of wheels, ect. Short money to swap some better tires and ride it as is, put some cash into a good dedicated dirt machine. My biggest concern is the drz will sit in the garage too much. If I'm street riding, I'll pick the keys to my triple every time. If I'm going dirt, it'll easily be whatever 250 I end up getting.

[gregp]

Have you ever ridden a 125 2-stroke in the woods (or on a track, for that matter)? They are the most fun you can have on 2-wheels. Even more fun than a 250F!
Larry Roeseler once put a KX80 motor in a KX125 frame, and competed in the ISDE on it. Small motors = Big fun!

[loudbeard]

It's been a long time but I have rode some 2 strokes. I'm not opposed to the platform, they're just too noisy IMO for something that'll see a lot of woods time, gotta stay stealthy in there.

[gixxer72]

My 450 with stock pipe was louder than my CR125 with an FMF...I did not think I would ever switch back to a 2T but the 125 has been huge fun, for cheap.

[nhbubba]

Interested in what you pick for tires. I need tires for my newly acquired KLX/DRZ. I think our goals are different. But I'm still interested in what you pick.

Teraflex is a pretty aggressive DOT knobbie? Google doesn't return a lot of info.

I'm leaning Perelli MT21. But I really have barely any idea wtf I am doing selecting off-road (even off-road-ish) tires.

[Kurlon]

It's been a long time but I have rode some 2 strokes. I'm not opposed to the platform, they're just too noisy IMO for something that'll see a lot of woods time, gotta stay stealthy in there.

A two stroke may be perceived as louder in your helmet as you work the throttle, but the higher frequency of the exhaust doesn't carry anywhere NEAR as far as the booming of a thumper.

[gregp]

And now we have come full circle - If you want to have stealthy, quiet fun in the woods - get a stock KDX200. There is nothing as quiet, and as capable as a stock KDX (except, maybe KTM's new Freeride-E). Second choice would be to find a very nice, old XR200.

[Chippertheripper]

A two stroke may be perceived as louder in your helmet as you work the throttle, but the higher frequency of the exhaust doesn't carry anywhere NEAR as far as the booming of a thumper.

Either with a aftermarket hi-flo (not quiet) can is audible for quite a distance.

My 300 with an oem can is quiet as a mouse. Well, at least you can ride it quietly because it makes power everywhere and doesn't NEED to be wound up like a smaller 2t.
A 4t with a reasonable exhaust is probably about the same.

[typeone]

+1, i'm always amazed how loud CRFs are. those things BARK.

another vote for small 2T here my 165 is magical in the woods. mountain bike with a motor. i only weigh ~163 though.

a buddy of mine rode my 250F and felt it didn't have enough power for him (~215lbs) so he bought a 450F. way too much power, he sold it. now he's got a CR250R and still feels it's a little overpowered in the wrong situations (rocky hills) but otherwise loves it. i loved my CR250R, real versatile bike.

[typeone]

And now we have come full circle - If you want to have stealthy, quiet fun in the woods - get a stock KDX200. There is nothing as quiet, and as capable as a stock KDX (except, maybe KTM's new Freeride-E). Second choice would be to find a very nice, old XR200.

find a Hybrid... KDX220 motor, KX125 chassis, KX250 suspenders. weeee!

[loudbeard]

Decision: made







2010 CRF250R, all it needs is a heat gun and sum stickahs. Graphics package on there makes me want to go get a tribal tattoo. Again.

Seriously though, I'm happy with the deal I worked out on it. A bit sketched out buying a CL bike not knowing the owner, from a dealer at least I have someone I can go choke if something goes wrong. Found this one at Parkway in Revere for $3500 which was the low end of the book on the bike, they had it listed at just under $4k. After looking over the bike it doesn't apear to have been down real hard at any point. I was a bit nervous of the aftermarket plastics thinking it could have meant hard wreck but nothing else on the bike indicated it. I think young MC just wanted some bling. Went hunting some factory plastics and graphics when I got home and they'll be shipped to the house for under $200 - not to mention I'll have decreasing urges to get some fresh ink. Only other aftermarket bit on the bike were some sunline unbreakable levers. I'm sure I'll need them.

Needless to say, I'm pretty happy. It's a bit on the new side, and about $500 more than I really wanted to spend. I also wasn't real excited about the $2-2.5k ~8 year old offerings on CL so eff it.

[typeone]

congrats! i would have just removed the graphics and ran it... they get destroyed in the woods anyway

throw some cash at real handguards (Enduro Engineering or Cycra), unbreakables or not, they're good for saving your fingers!

[nhbubba]

Biiiiitchin'