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Supercross 2017

  1. #201
    Member Tom M's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017


    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    Agreed on Tomac. It was weak. The pass in the 250 race was a legit, balls out, high risk hail mary block pass and I have more respect for that.
    I had the opposite reaction. I thought Osbourne absolutely bulldozed Savatgy two turns from the finish line. I know that it was the for the championship so I get it, but I'd be pissed if I was Savatgy.

    While Tomac was clearly running slow and trying to block Dungey off the track he didn't run right into his front wheel like Osbourne did to Savatgy. He could have ridden away from Dungey but he knew that wouldn't win the championship for him so he did what he thought he had to do to win. Not real cool but not real dirty either in my book. I expect him to dominate outdoors.

    Nice to see DeCotis have another good race. His starts have been great but he seems to fade later in the races. I hope he gets a good contract and finds a good trainer in the offseason so he can improve his stamina.

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  2. #202
    Don't bother me! R7's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom M View Post
    He could have ridden away from Dungey but he knew that wouldn't win the championship for him so he did what he thought he had to do to win. Not real cool but not real dirty either in my book.
    Championships are and should be won by clean racing and consistency. ET fell short, playing games trying to take someone out to win a championship he didn't earn is a cock move. His image as a rider and true to his sport, would have been better if he just put his efforts into winning the race.

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  3. #203
    Lifer Pittenger5's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by R7 View Post
    Championships are and should be won by clean racing and consistency. ET fell short, playing games trying to take someone out to win a championship he didn't earn is a cock move. His image as a rider and true to his sport, would have been better if he just put his efforts into winning the race.
    Not sure if you follow F1, but what would be your opinion of Lewis last year trying to back Nico into the Red Bulls. I thoguht that was fair racing to try to win a championship. Anything short of taking someone out is fair game in a championship race IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    My favorite was you going through T2 with your eyes closed.

  4. #204
    Lifer
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    This season hearkened back to the '70's - with Hannah and Howerton. Drama! That is what the fans want to see. I have no problem with any of it, in fact - I love it!
    I was rooting for Tomac and Savatgy - just because.

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  5. #205
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    "For the next three years their Trans-AMA battles would be epic, with the Europeans slowly giving way to the Americans, led by the wild-riding Hannah, plus Tony DiStefano, Weinert, Howerton, and more. Hannah rattled every visitor's cage every chance he got, including calling them all “commie bastards” over the PA at the 250cc U.S. Grand Prix at Unadilla."

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  6. #206
    Don't bother me! R7's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Pittenger5 View Post
    Not sure if you follow F1, but what would be your opinion of Lewis last year trying to back Nico into the Red Bulls. I thoguht that was fair racing to try to win a championship. Anything short of taking someone out is fair game in a championship race IMO.
    I don't follow F1. Blocking is one thing, intentionally riding into someone three times in one race, is far from blocking...and far from being a good sportsman

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  7. #207
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by gregp View Post
    "For the next three years their Trans-AMA battles would be epic, with the Europeans slowly giving way to the Americans, led by the wild-riding Hannah, plus Tony DiStefano, Weinert, Howerton, and more. Hannah rattled every visitor's cage every chance he got, including calling them all “commie bastards” over the PA at the 250cc U.S. Grand Prix at Unadilla."
    LMFAO

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  8. #208
    Lifer backinthesaddle's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    A few years ago Dean Wilson (who seems like a nice enough guy) punted Tomac about 3 times in a 250 race. Tomac punted him back and Deano has been an also ran since then, until he picked him self up this year and did well enough to get a ride. Don't think i'd want to be bumping back and forth with Eli.

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  9. #209
    First name on the shit list.... SVRACER01's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom M View Post
    I had the opposite reaction. I thought Osbourne absolutely bulldozed Savatgy two turns from the finish line. I know that it was the for the championship so I get it, but I'd be pissed if I was Savatgy.
    agree to disagree. ZO came in hot. real hot. but had the line. he banged into JS, no denying that, but even with as aggressive as it was it was "clean". by that i mean he didnt T bone JS off the track, he came in and made (hard) contact in the turn. it was racing. with winning comes losing. had JS ridden better the ZO wouldnt have had that opportunity to begin with. JS went backwards and was barely treading water. had ZO not been taken out in turn 1 or even not had his bike stuck under the other bike, then this wouldnt even had been a race. ZO was the fastest man out there. period. he wanted it more.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom M View Post
    While Tomac was clearly running slow and trying to block Dungey off the track he didn't run right into his front wheel like Osbourne did to Savatgy. He could have ridden away from Dungey but he knew that wouldn't win the championship for him so he did what he thought he had to do to win. Not real cool but not real dirty either in my book. I expect him to dominate outdoors.
    2 turns from the end and ET drove across 5 ruts specifically to t bone RD in an attempt to take him out. not just take a position, but put him on the ground. the first pass in the race was aggressive but "clean". the 2nd incident was frustration that ET couldnt keep RD at bay. the 3rd time was pure desperation. im not being a RD fanboi because seeing ET win wouldve been cool. did ET deserve a title with 9 (couldve been 10) wins this year? sure. doesnt mean you take out your competition to do it. he shouldve rode better early in the season. RD was proving that the 3 points he gained in the MM fiasco werent even gonna matter and ET couldnt handle it.

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    Last edited by SVRACER01; 05-09-17 at 12:06 PM.
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  10. #210
    Lifer backinthesaddle's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    [QUOTE=gregp;1495326]"For the next three years their Trans-AMA battles would be epic, with the Europeans slowly giving way to the Americans, led by the wild-riding Hannah, plus Tony DiStefano, Weinert, Howerton, and more. Hannah rattled every visitor's cage every chance he got, including calling them all “commie bastards” over the PA at the 250cc U.S. Grand Prix at Unadilla."[/QUOTE

    I think it was in the Massacre at Saddleback DVD where Hannah says "if Howerton left me alone that day he could have won but the silly bastard messed with me". something to that effect.

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    Last edited by backinthesaddle; 05-09-17 at 12:25 PM.
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  11. #211
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Mx could use another Hannah...its got healthy, exciting competition now, no complaints. But it could ALWAYS use another Hannah

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  12. #212
    Member Tom M's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by SVRACER01 View Post
    agree to disagree.
    Yup. I'm fine with the way everything worked out. I was actually rooting for Smith but he ate it big time while he was briefly in the lead for the series. Awesome ride by Osbourne and not quite good enough by Savatgy.

    It could certainly be argued that Tomac could have wrapped up the series if he had an electric start on his KX in New Jersey. I was rooting him at Vegas but I'm fine with Dungey winning one more before he retires.

    Let's hope that the outdoor season is half as good as SX was.

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  13. #213
    Lifer backinthesaddle's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Imbeek View Post
    Mx could use another Hannah...its got healthy, exciting competition now, no complaints. But it could ALWAYS use another Hannah
    Hannah would have punted anyone in his way. Coolest thing for me was the one year I raced the Winter-AMA. I was in the Amateur B but there was Hannah, his RM, a box van and one mechanic, parked right in the field with the rest of us. All the other factory pros were racing in Cali for the winter but Hannah, being Hannah raced florida. When he wheelied his "production" RM250 through the pits it didn't sound like any other bike there.

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  14. #214
    ^ It's my bike and my car tls25rs's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by SVRACER01 View Post
    ZO came in hot. real hot. but had the line. he banged into JS, no denying that, but even with as aggressive as it was it was "clean". by that i mean he didnt T bone JS off the track, he came in and made (hard) contact in the turn. it was racing. with winning comes losing.
    I am fine with the way both 250 and 450 classes worked out.

    If Savatgy wasn't there, for Osborne to hit, Osbourne never would have made that corner with the line he was on and the speed he was at. That is usually something I take into account when trying to decide if I think a pass is dirty or aggressive. Aggressive = the rider making the pass could have made the corner whether the other person was there or not. Dirty = if the rider being passed wasn't there than the rider making the pass would have launched themselves over the berm and landed in the middle of nowhere. There were a few incidents a couple of years back where people that did what Osborne did wound up fined, probation and/or suspended in the middle of the season. That being said, it was two turns from the end of the last race of the year with the championship on the line, you do what you need to do to win the championship and hope the governing body doesn't penalize you after the race. They didn't, Osborne is champ and did what he needed to do to get there.

    Tomac slowing down the race to see if he could get other riders in the way for points purposes is all well and good. Intentionally trying to drive Dungey off the race track is not very sportsmanlike and I like to think Tomac is better than that. If he and the team had just gotten things figured out one or two races earlier it wouldn't have been an issue. He should be that much better next SX season and we'll see if he can pull it off then.

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  15. #215
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Osborne was fimed 7500 for the agressive pass, but the result stands? That's odd

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  16. #216
    ^ It's my bike and my car tls25rs's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    Osborne was fimed 7500 for the agressive pass, but the result stands? That's odd
    Agreed on some level but how would they commemorate Savatgy winning down the line and what promo photos would they have of the event after the plate was given to Osborne and all the victory celebrations have already happened? One of the less desirable parts of having the trophy presentation immediately after the race, no time for protests to be made and decided upon without coloring the decision process.

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  17. #217
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    I don't even approve of the fine nevermind a points penalty

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  18. #218
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Me either. It was interesting when they asked Osbourne about it in the post race press conference...he was kinda befuddled by the question, even. Said something like, "yeah, it was the last corner of the championship, so...what's the question?"

    I don't really think too many people who have raced moto for any amount of time were the least bit surprised by that move. If he didn't try to force the issue, and lost the championship, I don't even think any of the manufacturers would like it. They'd say he didn't have enough heart, or wasn't willing to do whatever was necessary to win. It's totally different from road racing (not that they don't do the exact same thing cough Rossi)...not too many people get seriously hurt from "hard passes" in motocross.

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  19. #219
    ^ It's my bike and my car tls25rs's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    I don't even approve of the fine nevermind a points penalty
    Misread what you intended.....thought your comment was more towards wondering why one punishment came without the other.

    Personally not a fan of the aggressive block passes in any type of racing but understand that it is part of the culture of SX/MX today so don't see anything wrong with what Osborne did to win the title.

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  20. #220
    First name on the shit list.... SVRACER01's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by tls25rs View Post
    Aggressive = the rider making the pass could have made the corner whether the other person was there or not. Dirty = if the rider being passed wasn't there than the rider making the pass would have launched themselves over the berm and landed in the middle of nowhere.
    the argument could be made that he wouldnt have been on that line if JS wasnt there.
    its all karma. JS caused the pile up T1 that sent ZO over the side.

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  21. #221
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017


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  22. #222
    Lifer Imbeek's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    Wow, congrats on a great career to him. Class act going out on top.

    Some great columns written at that link, thanks for posting

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  23. #223
    Member Tom M's Avatar
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    Re: Supercross 2017

    Update on local guy Jimmy Decotis. He found out he had Lyme disease last year and thinks that is why he was fading late in his races. If that was the problem I expect he'll be on the podium this season.

    Jimmy Decotis On His Battle with Lyme Disease - Racer X Online

    From the article:
    "Coulda shoulda woulda Rippah. That was Jimmy Decotis during Monster Energy Supercross in 2017, as the GEICO Honda mounted rider would routinely pull starts, lead laps, battle for his first-ever podium, only to fade out of the top three through much of the 250SX West Region. Turns out something was very wrong with the popular New Englander, and as he started to feel worse and worse—and develop some strange symptoms—he knew he needed to get a real diagnosis. Jimmy dropped out of Lucas Oil Pro Motocross to do some exploring, and found out he had Lyme disease. Since then, it’s been a rough road back, but he’s feeling healthy again and has a new ride with Autotrader.com/Yoshimura Suzuki (JGR). "

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