Wet vs. Rain Tires for TDs

[keeena]

I'm looking at picking up some tires for trackdays when the weather goes south. Didn't know there was such thing as an intermediate wet tire; I'm thinking that may be a better choice than full out rains for TDs. I'm not going ten-tenths and may be OK to sacrifice a little grip to get better wear. Thoughts?

[Degsy]

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Wet-street tires
Really wet (raining)-rain tires.

I know pirelli for sure makes an intermediate but its probably special order. Mtag can tell you if they are available.

[Paul_E_D]

intermediates almost never work from what I understand. Full wets for trackdays is your best bet. Lots of fun getting a knee down in the lashing rain. Also fun sliding down a wet track, until it's not...so be cautious.

[xsiliconkid]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8530/5.0.0.508 Profile/MIDP-2.1 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/105)

Wet-street tires
Really wet (raining)-rain tires.

I know pirelli for sure makes an intermediate but its probably special order. Mtag can tell you if they are available.

'

Intermediate Pirelli's are available...but I would go full wet and dry set...

The logic is - if the track is wet (small trails just starting to be left on the track from the bike in front of you the full wet will work fine - up until then. hot dry tires work - Especially at the pace you are likely to be running-wets will work fine as track is starting to dry out until the need for dry tires, without burning up too much...

By the time you come in and switch tires the track will be dry… - or wet again and the cycle starts all over again!

When I was racing if the rain started I would push harder until I saw the tire trails and then back off – most would back off when their visor got wet

[keeena]

Yeah, I happened to be looking at Pirelli's site when I saw Wets vs. Rains; assumed other mfr's had similar in their lineup.

I do have a 2nd set of rims so no problem having a dedicated set of tires mounted up.

[Ken C]

What dry tires are you running? Some DOT "track day" tires are pretty good in the rain. I had some Bridgestone 016s on my bike last year and I was very impressed with how they worked.

Since you have a spare set of wheels, go with full rains and let the DOTs be your intermediates (like Derek said).

[CBR929RE]

my theory on rains is that if you're gonna spend the money on them and just use them for track days you should probably use them up in a year or 2. so full rains and even if its just a little wet and not full on pouring out you'd be better off using too much rubber than having that rubber just sit around getting hard for a few years.

if I had any desire to run on the track in the rain again I'd just get some good street tires such as DCIII (or whatever the replacement is called), Pilot Power 2CTs, BT-16s and things in that line.

[Degsy]

my theory on rains is that if you're gonna spend the money on them and just use them for track days you should probably use them up in a year or 2. so full rains and even if its just a little wet and not full on pouring out you'd be better off using too much rubber than having that rubber just sit around getting hard for a few years.

if I had any desire to run on the track in the rain again I'd just get some good street tires such as DCIII (or whatever the replacement is called), Pilot Power 2CTs, BT-16s and things in that line.

The only issue there is that rains will be ruined in just a lap or two at pace on anything but a pretty wet track.

[xsiliconkid]

Storing
Surprising, if you look after your rains they will keep fresh for many years..
I make sure they don't overheat sitting in the trailer or in sun...at the track find shade/cooler place for them.
During the off season/winter in a dark garbage bag in the basement - stable cool temp. Away from electric motors that produce ozone.

On track -
All rain tires have a higher pressure setting then dry tires.
Will last a very long time if running in real wet conditions.
Rain tire's have a low melting point to enable traction on a cool track - when the track starts to dry out there's less standing water cooling action - they will heat up quickly....(like in a couple of laps overheat - feel greasy and burn up the compound...can you say chia-pet :-)
The key to effective wet tire traction -the edges of the tread should have sharp edges - when the tire carcass 'squishes" the edges come together like a squeegee on the water and pump it away leaving solid compound on the track surface (like a slick)

There is nothing like a good rain tire in a down pour and circulating at speed...especially if mounted on a Motard....

right KEN!

[keeena]

I'm running BT016's right now (5 TDs so far). I have Pirelli Dragon Supercorsa Pro SC2's to swap in once I finish chewing up the 16s.

Thanks for all the input so far; I'm going to take everybody's advice and either stick w/ a good sport tire (non-race) or all-out rain's.

Would it make sense for me to swap out my 16's now and keep them for wet riding on a budget? I know rains are night/day difference, but sounds like good sport tires are decent enough for what I would need them for?

[xsiliconkid]

for rain you need tires in very good condition-even better then inthe dry - more tread the better... so worn BT016 might not be the best choice to keep as your wet weather tires....

the key word is "good" sports tire - good also means in "good" condition -

[CBR929RE]

The only issue there is that rains will be ruined in just a lap or two at pace on anything but a pretty wet track.

well yes. I just meant between the track being wet and REALLY wet. otherwise if it starts to dry out you'll be looking for every puddle you can find, at that point you'd be better off coming in and swapping tires.


and good info from Graham about storage. but how often do people get the chance to run track days in the wet? you have to hope over the time you have those tires for however many years that you get to use them.

to me I don't see the benefit to having them if you're just gonna be doing track days. I have 2 sets of wheels. one with race/track rubber and the other with street tires.

of course if the money is burning a hole in your pocket sure go ahead and buy them. you always want more grip in any situation.

[xsiliconkid]

all good points...
many of us raced a long time in the rain before wets came along:-)...


but it does feel sooooooo good:-)

[xsiliconkid]

The only issue there is that rains will be ruined in just a lap or two at pace on anything but a pretty wet track.

To emphasize that point
- I chewed up a perfectly good set of rains leading a 30 min follow the leader session in the dry! (Too lazy to change the tires - thought FTL should not hurt them. DOH!

[keeena]

for rain you need tires in very good condition-even better then inthe dry - more tread the better... so worn BT016 might not be the best choice to keep as your wet weather tires....

I hear you. I can't tell how many days I have left in my BT016s...don't know how to read the wear. I was going to post up a thread w/ pictures or just ask some folks in person @ my first TDs this year. They have been great so far and nothing unpredictable yet. I *think* I can easily get 2 more TDs out of them.

[CEO]

what bike is this for? I'll send you a PM

[xsiliconkid]

If they are noticeably worn……you may not pass tech......
Most track day organizers have the ability to quickly mount tires so make sure you have your new tires with you.

All I can say is.
If you are a track day beginner you need good tires/ traction to help when those bone head moves are made.

If you are advancing to the other end of the tack-day spectrum, getting quite fast - you also need the best traction your ties can give you....

Meaning there is no room for poor performing tires....
Rule of thumb - more than 50% wear, you got to start thinking - also if you’re thinking they are worn - they probably are...

Want more reasons to chuck them!

Trying to get the last mile out of tires is false economy.....

Post a pic anyway :-)

[TTD]

I obviously run a lot of trackdays, so that made my decision easy... but a second set of rims with full wets is the way to go if at all possible... and just a set of wets is the second best.

Mine are like 4? years old and still sticking great.


This year, I'm thinking of running slicks and wets.