Go 100 MPH go to Jail?

[Pittenger5]

[Degsy]

Part I, Title XIV, Chapter 89, Section 4B

Section 4B. Upon all ways the driver of a vehicle shall drive in the lane nearest the right side of the way when such lane is available for travel, except when overtaking another vehicle or when preparing for a left turn. When the right lane has been constructed or designated for purposes other than ordinary travel, a driver shall drive his vehicle in the lane adjacent to the right lane except when overtaking another vehicle or when preparing for a left or right turn; provided, however, that a driver may drive his vehicle in such right lane if signs have been erected by the department of highways permitting the use of such lane.

interstate. 3 lanes. Both right and center lanes are "travel lanes". Ill take my chances on not getting a "travelling under the speed limit in the middle lane" ticket.

[RandyO]

interstate. 3 lanes. Both right and center lanes are "travel lanes". Ill take my chances on not getting a "travelling under the speed limit in the middle lane" ticket.

From the Massachusetts Drivers Manual http://www.massrmv.com/rmv/dmanual/index.htm

On an expressway with three or more lanes in your direction, use the far right lane for slower driving

[RandyO]

Degs, the point here is not that you won't be able to beat a ticket, but that you won't get a cops badge

[butcher bergs]

I wonder if these same conversations were taking place back when the speed limits were 50.

"You can't do 80 on public roads!!!! It's dangerous and you could kill someone!!"

Look at us now

[Degsy]

You're right randy.

[Garandman]

Gilmour has lived in Hollis NH for 41 years. The Republican she's rotated the Senate seat with, Jim Luther, has lived there 25 years.

Hollis likes them some "Mass transplants."

[SVRACER01]

Wirelessly posted (GS3)

^ This.

Some of you really should research the 85th percentile speed studies. It really clears up a lot of misconceptions regarding driver behavior regarding posted limits, both low and high.

Speed limits in the U.S. are absolutely pulled out of some bureaucrats ass.

You just contradicted yourself. Speed limits are put in place based on a formula. That formula is the 85th percentile. Not someones ass.
I did the research on this when I tried to fight a ticket for not only getting a speeding ticket for doing 65 in a 45 but for being in the left lane of a 2 lane highway.
the location of said ticket was the N bound interchange from 495 to 95. Not only is it ridiculous that the limit drops 20mph there but its probably one of the few if not only 2 lane highway in mass where trucks arent allowed in the left lane. Its stupid. The cops excuse was that there are lots of fatal crashes on that on ramp. I looked it up...theres never been one.

[PhilB]

... the speed limit is 65 so doing 10 over is 75. Raise the speed limit and you raise what speed people will think acceptable. If you traditionally drive 80 on these roads marked at 65, if they raise the limit to 75 would you continue to drive 80?

Well, yes. What traffic studies consistently show is that people drive at about whatever speed they feel is safe for that road, and they are pretty much right. Changing the speed limits doesn't change people's behavior much, except when they think they are being watched; it just lets the state gank more money out of people. Which is why the original method of determining speed limits by observing people's speeds, and setting the limit at the 85th percentile of that, worked well for rational speed laws. It just didn't work well enough for government revenue.

Some of you are just paranoid about police....
Why the hate, yes some are mean, some are by the book, welcome to life, they are people and everyone is different but to say over and over they stop you for revenue purposes... Don't give them the reason to stop you. They don't win a toaster oven for handing out more tickets than the next guy, their pay doesn't reflect tickets written, go easy
The only thing that stops someone from driving at break neck speeds all the time is the fear of getting in trouble, that sign on the side of the highway doesn't do it so that's why there are penalties
As for the revenue issue, a summons to court costs the state money while a simple infraction with a guilty plea and payment does generate some cash for the state

Police can and do fuck up your life. That's not paranoia, that's reality. Bad laws fuck up your life, and enforcement of those bad laws fucks up your life. And their job reviews, promotions, and raises DO affect their career advancement and pay.

And no, most people will not drive at "breakneck speeds" all the time; people mostly drive at speeds they feel safe at -- fear of breaking their necks does play the major factor. And the "simple infraction with a guilty plea and payment" is the vast majority, and they set it all up to very strongly encourage people to do that, for that very reason -- that's where the money is. In NH, the road fund pays the court system $2M a year to operate the traffic court system, and the traffic court system returns $7M a year to the road fund -- the great majority of that being money that has been ganked out of people who were just driving where they wanted to go in reasonable safety.

Right here Greg. This is an example of "hating on the police". The premise is that NH LEOs are all jackbooted thugs itching to abuse their power and inflate infractions in order to arrest more people. The idea that "anything over" whatever gets "rounded up" is completely contrary to my experience in road-side interactions with NH LEOs, both local and state. It is, in my experience, far more typical for the speed to be adjusted down.

The premise is far too often correct. If the main effect of police was to handle dangerous people and protect the ordinary man, then the ordinary man would be happy to see police. Instead, when a cop appears, everyone slows down and gets fearful (often creating traffic snarls and *increasing* danger in the process), which shows that we all know, in our gut, that they are not there to help us.

closing speed?

my thought, some asshat will do 100, while texting and turning around yelling at their kids.

Yes, some asshat will do that. And it is THAT asshat who deserves punishment for actually driving dangerously. Not a bunch of other people who are paying attention to what they are doing, going to jail needlessly. I'd MUCH rather drive near people going 100+ than near a bunch of cell-phone users; the fast guys are almost always paying actual attention to what they are doing.

I agree entirely. Having that for-all-practical-purposes-volunteer arrangement will always effect the accuracy of the representation. Bunch of old fart retirees and independently wealthy types that can afford it and/or have nothing better to do.

Which is WAY better than a bunch of professional legislators who see it as their job to write ever more laws about everything under the sun.

OK, this is asinine. How ANYONE here could support jail time for goin 100mph is beyond my ability to comprehend. JAILTIME??!! Do you know that that entails? Losing your job, possibly a whole lot more. Parole is even worse that jail. With no license and heavy reporting requirements they are punishing you financially enough to push you into a life of crime! Gotta pay the bills somehow. No job, no car? Dealing drugs sounds good.

Fucking asinine.

This. That's worse than you'd probably get for actually assaulting someone.

Well this jailtime for 100mph won't effect me, because I have been broken down by the system. I give up and I am in self preservation mode. Like i said. 65 absolute MAX. Middle lane. I avoid pulling into plazas or gas stations if i see a cop car there.

And this is what I am talking about. The system should NOT be in the business of "breaking down" normal honest citizens (or non-citizens) who are just living their day-to-day lives. When the regular joe sees it as his best bet to avoid the police, the system is fucked up.

You just contradicted yourself. Speed limits are put in place based on a formula. That formula is the 85th percentile. Not someones ass.

No, he didn't. He cited the formula that once was the standard as something that worked, and noted that currently the limits are pulled out of asses *instead* of using the formula. Which is a big part of the problem.

I did the research on this when I tried to fight a ticket for not only getting a speeding ticket for doing 65 in a 45 but for being in the left lane of a 2 lane highway.
the location of said ticket was the N bound interchange from 495 to 95. Not only is it ridiculous that the limit drops 20mph there but its probably one of the few if not only 2 lane highway in mass where trucks arent allowed in the left lane. Its stupid. The cops excuse was that there are lots of fatal crashes on that on ramp. I looked it up...theres never been one.

And there you go; you cite a good example of a limit pulled out of someone's ass, and lies told to "justify" it, in order to gank your money.

PhilB

[Rosco61]

The snow is melting rapidly. In a short time riding season will be upon us again. I can hardly wait. This has been a long
Winter.

[G21forme]

it would be ok if they had a separate road

speed differential is a big deal when it comes to safety,

and I doubt you'll see the military convoy going 70, closer to 45mph, and that IS who the highways were built for

Nope, the state believes it's perfectly safe to drive 45 in a 70 so there goes your argument on speed differential. Next...

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[SVRACER01]

Wirelessly posted (GS3)

One could argue that 65 on 101 is pretty close to the 85th percentile.
Degsy, ive got a funny MSP story for you that my dad told me.
im always polite until I find out what the cause of the stop is. If its complete bullshit, then I become quite verbal and abusive.
A cop once pulled me over because I didnt let him cross 3 lanes of traffic from the breakdown lane just before a tollbooth just because he had hos turn signal on. When I pointed out that if I tried to pull that move he wouldve pulled me over. He changed his attitude after that...I got FAR more abusive though. Including but not limited to questioning his intelligence, swearing and lots of finger pointing. I refused to give him any information including my license, reg or where I was going to or coming from because there was no reason to stop me in the first place.
amanda thought I was going to jail.

[e30addict]

Wirelessly posted (GS3)



You just contradicted yourself. Speed limits are put in place based on a formula. That formula is the 85th percentile. Not someones ass.
I did the research on this when I tried to fight a ticket for not only getting a speeding ticket for doing 65 in a 45 but for being in the left lane of a 2 lane highway.
the location of said ticket was the N bound interchange from 495 to 95. Not only is it ridiculous that the limit drops 20mph there but its probably one of the few if not only 2 lane highway in mass where trucks arent allowed in the left lane. Its stupid. The cops excuse was that there are lots of fatal crashes on that on ramp. I looked it up...theres never been one.

As Phil mentioned I did not. There are studies regarding 85th percentile, and even recommendations from a lot of the states respective DOT's, but no requirement to set it there. They most likely SHOULD be based on formula, but they most assuredly are not.

The fact that you find more people above the posted on a regular basis than below should be proof enough of that pretty much wherever you drive.

When NH raised the limit on 93 outside of Concord it was mentioned that if you drive 65 "people pass you like you're tied to a fence post."

I wonder how many people on this forum remember why 55 was instituted in the first place? Hint, it wasn't safety.

http://www.history.com/this-day-in-h...limit-into-law

On this day in 1974, President Richard M. Nixon signs the Emergency Highway Energy Conservation Act, setting a new national maximum speed limit.

Prior to 1974, individual states set speed limits within their boundaries and highway speed limits across the country ranged from 40 mph to 80 mph. The U.S. and other industrialized nations enjoyed easy access to cheap Middle Eastern oil from 1950 to 1972, but the Arab-Israeli conflict changed that dramatically in 1973. Arab members of the Organization for Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) protested the West's support of Israel in the Yom Kippur War by stopping oil shipments to the United States, Japan and Western Europe. OPEC also flexed its new-found economic muscle by quadrupling oil prices, placing a choke-hold on America's oil-hungry consumers and industries. The embargo had a global impact, sending the U.S. and European economies into recession. As part of his response to the embargo, President Nixon signed a federal law lowering all national highway speed limits to 55 mph. The act was intended to force Americans to drive at speeds deemed more fuel-efficient, thereby curbing the U.S. appetite for foreign oil. With it, Nixon ushered in a policy of fuel conservation and rationing not seen since World War II.

The act also prohibited the Department of Transportation from approving or funding any projects within states that did not comply with the new speed limit. Most states quietly adjusted their speed limits, though Western states, home to the country's longest, straightest and most monotonous rural highways, only grudgingly complied. Even after OPEC lifted the embargo in March 1974, drivers continued to face high gas prices and attempted to conserve fuel by buying revolutionary Japanese economy cars. For many, a desire for fuel-efficient automobiles became the standard until the trend toward gas-guzzling sport-utility vehicles (SUVs) emerged in the 1990s. In 1987, Congress authorized states to reset speed limits within their borders, but proponents of the national maximum speed limit law claimed it lowered automobile-related fatalities, prompting Congress to keep it on the books until finally repealing it on November 28, 1995.

Today speed limits across the country vary between 35 and 40 mph in congested urban areas and 75 mph on long stretches of rural highway. U.S. drivers now drive almost as fast as their European counterparts, who average between 75 and 80 mph on the highway. On some roads in Italy, it is legal to drive as fast as 95 mph.

Think about some of what is said there. Prior to 1974, states had speed limits up to 80 mph. Ever drive anything that old? Most of us would shit our pants going that fast with those suspensions and brakes for any length of distance.

[e30addict]

Funny, here is some of what I said back in Sept. when we kicked around speed traps for a bit.

Jalopnik had a little writeup on the 85th percentile here: http://jalopnik.com/this-is-the-best...ium=socialflow

The State of FL recommends it: http://www.dot.state.fl.us/trafficop...03_17_2011.pdf

The State of CA says it's a good idea. http://www.dot.ca.gov/dist05/traffic...eed-Zoning.PDF

Maine says the same thing. http://www.maine.gov/mdot/csd/mlrc/t...ightyfifth.htm

The study indicated that based on the best available evidence, the speed limit should be set at the speed driven by 85 to 90 % of the free-moving vehicles rounded up to the next 5 mph increment. The method results in speed limits that are not only acceptable to a large majority of the motorists, but also fall within the speed range where the accident risk is the lowest. Allowing a 5 mph tolerance, enforcement would be targeted at drivers who are clearly at risk.

[nhbubba]

Which is WAY better than a bunch of professional legislators who see it as their job to write ever more laws about everything under the sun.

Eh. Both have some significant problems.

the location of said ticket was the N bound interchange from 495 to 95.

That ramp is pretty great. I hold cruise control until the last mile marker before the ramp and coast in. With a strong drive after the first left I can usually coast throught the right hander back onto 95 and be right back at cruising speed. Good fun.

I just realized I have reference points on my commute.

Bastards hide on the outside of that lefter. By the time you see them it's too late. I try to read the brake lights while crossing the overpass over 95. Plenty of red => probably a speed trap setup.

On the downside. I see deer milling about on that ramp all the time. I think they're going after trash people dump there.

[388]

PhilB,
Your as off as Degsy.
"Police can and do fuck up your life", love to hear your paranoid views on that one also
Ask around and you will see fear of a ticket or arrest is what stops people from speeding not the thought of personal injury... Now if we were riding or racing say at NHMS then speed and personal injury would be logical, riding to your limit where you fear crashing and getting hurt.
Your personal opinion does appear strong but your comments on police only lead me to believe you are not and have never been one... Until then your comments don't hold water
Specific towns that do not have much crime use motor vehicle stops as a way to show that the police did something for 8 hrs a shift, I am sure everyone can remember a town where you would say, "I am not driving into that town with this car, bike whatever, because the cops are A holes". That type of reference would be appropriate but not yours. And trust me, if your are as you appear in this post, a half asleep officer or trooper will pick up on it never mind a veteran seasoned cop.
But your ticket funding the highway system deal is about right otherwise taxes would smother you

[Degsy]

PhilB quote,
Police can and do fuck up your life. That's not paranoia, that's reality. Bad laws fuck up your life, and enforcement of those bad laws fucks up your life. And their job reviews, promotions, and raises DO affect their career advancement and pay.

And no, most people will not drive at "breakneck speeds" all the time; people mostly drive at speeds they feel safe at -- fear of breaking their necks does play the major factor. And the "simple infraction with a guilty plea and payment" is the vast majority, and they set it all up to very strongly encourage people to do that, for that very reason -- that's where the money is. In NH, the road fund pays the court system $2M a year to operate the traffic court system, and the traffic court system returns $7M a year to the road fund -- the great majority of that being money that has been ganked out of people who were just driving where they wanted to go in reasonable safety.


PhilB,
Your as off as Degsy.
"Police can and do fuck up your life", love to hear your paranoid views on that one also
Ask around and you will see fear of a ticket or arrest is what stops people from speeding not the thought of personal injury
Your personal opinion does appear strong but your comments on police only lead me to believe you are not and have never been one... Until then your comments don't hold water
But your ticket funding the highway system deal is about right otherwise taxes would smother you

i am actually laughing out loud. I cannot wait to see phil tear you apart. You are absolutely clueless to the reality of the situation.

Thank you, officer.

You see? This is the mentality of some of the people who are issuing these tickets.

[388]

Once again Degsy, you got nothin

[obsolete]

I cannot wait to see phil tear you apart.

...well that was gay.

[Degsy]

...well that was gay.

Its very easy to have your kind of take on this when you are pretty much given professional courtesy immunity.

If you take the time to read 388's post, he states that he would love to hear Phil's views on "paranoia".

[G21forme]

Its very easy to have your kind of take on this when you are pretty much given professional courtesy immunity.

This!

Anyone taking bets on 388? I'm guessing something in the line of loss prevention at target or mall ninja.

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[obsolete]

Its very easy to have your kind of take on this when you are pretty much given professional courtesy immunity.

If you take the time to read 388's post, he states that he would love to hear Phil's views on "paranoia".

I haven't always been a firefighter and have received a speeding ticket as one so, no, you are incorrect. And I was referring to the you waiting for some guy to tear up another guy. kiiiiiiiinda gay.

[388]

G21forme,
You got me good girlfriend, damn

[e30addict]

I find it hilarious that this thread here involves cop bashing, but on NES no one even brought it up. Usually those guys rip a LEO to shreds in a heartbeat over nothing at all.

[obsolete]

The comical part of this is I'm not the biggest fan of cops at all, I just find the normal public service hate and ignorance from some of you guys just dumb. Gregg and Degsy have exhibited a basic lack of knowledge on the topic but have the most outspoken anti-public services attitudes. Sorry guys, I like both of you but your uninformed ranting about the topic makes you look like asses.