A few thoughts on Crashing

[Ken C]

Yeah, it sucks.
http://www.ridinginthezone.com/is-cr...ally-that-bad/

[Chippertheripper]

It is always an accepted risk.
I do what I can to mitigate...including changing bikes to something more "sensible" to commute with.
I think for most riders it's more than risk vs reward, it's a three way: cost vs risk vs reward.

[shortbus]

I'm slower on the street since riding (and crashing) on the track... Going around a corner I'm much more away of the lack of gravel and runoff to prevent me from sliding into guardrails, telephone poles, etc.

[nhbubba]

Crashing. Done it. Not a fan.

[MaRce1o]

It is always an accepted risk.
I do what I can to mitigate...including changing bikes to something more "sensible" to commute with.
I think for most riders it's more than risk vs reward, it's a three way: cost vs risk vs reward.

I would go risk vs reward...cost is a side effect lol

[Chippertheripper]

I would go risk vs reward...cost is a side effect lol

In my mind I excluded "us" from "most".
I'm talking about your casual "biker". I'm making a broad generalization.

[slowkermit]

I'm slower on the street since riding (and crashing) on the track... Going around a corner I'm much more away of the lack of gravel and runoff to prevent me from sliding into guardrails, telephone poles, etc.

absolutely. I always thought track riding would make me faster on the street. It did the exact opposite.

[MaRce1o]

In my mind I excluded "us" from "most".
I'm talking about your casual "biker". I'm making a broad generalization.

Ah, gotcha lol

[Tricky Mike]

Agreed.
What slowed me down even more was that the track showed me what the bike was capable of. As a result it showed me how completely insane it would be to attempt to get there on the street. I just stopped bothering with riding fast. The (perceived?) risk went WAAAAY up, but there was almost zero possibility (riding within reason) for the reward I got at the track.

[Garandman]

Advrider.com's famous/infamous Faceplant forum

You can learn a lot from the mishaps of others. There are some tragic stories, and some funny ones. A guy who got hit by a lawnmower. A guy riding two-up who hit a Burro at 65mph (Burro ran off). Etc.

[klp]

Advrider.com's famous/infamous Faceplant forum

Spent a few minutes looking around here... Ouch!

[Petorius]

Cost = risk

[dontpanic]

Actually, cost is negative reward. Risk is uncertainty.

Edit: Do we have a smartass icon?

[Lxpony]

I definitely keep something in reserve now when street riding after doing 3 dozen track days as I would rather much prefer to not buzz by a guardrail doing 80 mph like i used to. I also had four separate riders crash on rides I was leading this past year. That also made me tone it down some what too.

[Garandman]

Spent a few minutes looking around here... Ouch!

One of the saddest is why I don't have a top box anymore. Guy got hit from behind, broke his back on the top box, and was paralyzed. So a week or two later he started a thread. Tough to think about.

[RandyO]

I only have one thought about crashing.....

DON'T

[DZircher]

Hmm, I'm really mixed about this. My stupid lowside wasn't really very bad at all. No real damage on my leathers and yet the track kicked the shit out of my knee. When I slid in turn 1a in the beginning of the season, I was going much faster, got up dusted myself off and rode my bike back to the paddock. It pisses me off too that it's taking so long to recover from the broken patella and getting my strength back in my leg is really hard work.

but I'm 49 now not 23. And that pisses me off too!

I've been thinking about taking some dirt bike lessons in Texas which focus on learning how to control you bike at the edge of traction. Slide, fall, etc. I think they use bikes similar to my yz-125. I certainly don't want to crash but I do want to be able to minimize my injuries when it happens - it happens when you race. I know that.

What do you guys think? Ken, do you have an opinion?

Happy New Year!

-diz

[Ken C]

Hmm, I'm really mixed about this. My stupid lowside wasn't really very bad at all. No real damage on my leathers and yet the track kicked the shit out of my knee. When I slid in turn 1a in the beginning of the season, I was going much faster, got up dusted myself off and rode my bike back to the paddock. It pisses me off too that it's taking so long to recover from the broken patella and getting my strength back in my leg is really hard work.

but I'm 49 now not 23. And that pisses me off too!

I've been thinking about taking some dirt bike lessons in Texas which focus on learning how to control you bike at the edge of traction. Slide, fall, etc. I think they use bikes similar to my yz-125. I certainly don't want to crash but I do want to be able to minimize my injuries when it happens - it happens when you race. I know that.

What do you guys think? Ken, do you have an opinion?

Happy New Year!

-diz

Diz, All I believe we have is our commitment to being as skilled and knowledgeable as we can be to avoid crashing. I think dirt riding is one of the best ways to manage all sorts of control situations. I just wrote a new post about this very subject.

how-to-save-a-front-tire-slide/

[Pittenger5]

Its kind of scary how many people think Im crazy when I tell them riding at the track is infinitely safer than riding on the street.

[MaRce1o]

Its kind of scary how many people think Im crazy when I tell them riding at the track is infinitely safer than riding on the street.

Happens all the time to me too

[DucDave]

Wirelessly posted (iPhone)

Great article Ken. My experience has been similar to yours. I was pondering why so many of my track offs have resulted in mostly no injurys. (Highside on 7 at VIR being the exception - call me BatMan!)

The rest have been low sides and I wasn't injured because I was already so close to the ground that there wasn't much of a 'fall' and I mostly slid rather than tumbled! I don't mind crashing as long as I am able to take some sort of lesson away. The only one that still baffles me was a fairly low speed low side in 1a. I am guessing there was something on track but don't know for sure.

And as others have said, my track experience has slowed me down on the street...!

[travisb]

I've been thinking about taking some dirt bike lessons in Texas which focus on learning how to control you bike at the edge of traction. Slide, fall, etc. I think they use bikes similar to my yz-125. I certainly don't want to crash but I do want to be able to minimize my injuries when it happens - it happens when you race. I know that.

What do you guys think? Ken, do you have an opinion?

Happy New Year!

-diz

You might look into American Supercamp and/or Rich Oliver's Mystery School. I have been to both and found them to be great. These schools are based on training Kenny Roberts, Sr did on his ranch using Honda XR100s in the 70s and later. You ride a 9HP Yamaha TTR125 along with 10 other students learning throttle control, braking and cornering in very low traction situations. It can be loads of fun and you can develop reflexes that might prevent a throttle-chop-causing-high-side when the rear loses grip, for example, on a wet track. With these small bikes, the consequences of crashing are low and bike feedback to the rider is high.

Ben

[nhbubba]

You ride a 9HP Yamaha TTR125 along with 10 other students learning throttle control, braking and cornering in very low traction situations. It can be loads of fun and you can develop reflexes that might prevent a throttle-chop-causing-high-side when the rear loses grip, for example, on a wet track. With these small bikes, the consequences of crashing are low and bike feedback to the rider is high.

Sounds a little like what Penguin did in the side lot at NHMS during their 2-day school last summer. The bike was something like that and fitted with an underinflated, shitty old dirt track tire. Bad body position or abrupt with the throttle and you WOULD go down.

Unfortunately it started to rain before I got my turn. Wound up being my 1st ever motorcycle crash... and my 2nd.

Nice getting to dump someone else's hardware.

[tls25rs]

Hmm, I'm really mixed about this. My stupid lowside wasn't really very bad at all. No real damage on my leathers and yet the track kicked the shit out of my knee. When I slid in turn 1a in the beginning of the season, I was going much faster, got up dusted myself off and rode my bike back to the paddock. It pisses me off too that it's taking so long to recover from the broken patella and getting my strength back in my leg is really hard work.

but I'm 49 now not 23. And that pisses me off too!

I've been thinking about taking some dirt bike lessons in Texas which focus on learning how to control you bike at the edge of traction. Slide, fall, etc. I think they use bikes similar to my yz-125. I certainly don't want to crash but I do want to be able to minimize my injuries when it happens - it happens when you race. I know that.

What do you guys think? Ken, do you have an opinion?

Happy New Year!

-diz

You might look into American Supercamp and/or Rich Oliver's Mystery School. I have been to both and found them to be great. These schools are based on training Kenny Roberts, Sr did on his ranch using Honda XR100s in the 70s and later. You ride a 9HP Yamaha TTR125 along with 10 other students learning throttle control, braking and cornering in very low traction situations. It can be loads of fun and you can develop reflexes that might prevent a throttle-chop-causing-high-side when the rear loses grip, for example, on a wet track. With these small bikes, the consequences of crashing are low and bike feedback to the rider is high.

Ben

Sounds a little like what Penguin did in the side lot at NHMS during their 2-day school last summer. The bike was something like that and fitted with an underinflated, shitty old dirt track tire. Bad body position or abrupt with the throttle and you WOULD go down.

Unfortunately it started to rain before I got my turn. Wound up being my 1st ever motorcycle crash... and my 2nd.

Nice getting to dump someone else's hardware.

Guessing what she is talking about is the Texas Tornado Bootcamp which would be very similar to American Supercamp just a little longer and taught by Colin Edwards etc. rather than Danny Walker

[DZircher]

Yes, I guess my fingers got way ahead of my brain. http://texastornadobootcamp.com/
I am a street rider/racer, will a dirt camp really help me?

• A majority of our clients are road racers. Having a full understanding of just what the motorcycle is doing underneath you is a skill all riders look for. At our camp you will be experiencing slick dirt tracks which are meant for truly finding the limit of grip. When grip is lost and then gained, we as a rider find the true understanding of bike control, throttle control and proper inputs for the motorcycle. Riding a motorcycle that is constantly moving around underneath you is “feeling” we want you to experience and get a grasp of at the camp. It is all about “feel” and all of this immediately transfers to the pavement.

Thanks,
diz