Decreasing radius turn. What is your technique?

[Karate.Snoopy]

I practice late/delayed apex, try to go in slow in unknown turns, try to give my self enough room to maneuver.Stay wide on entering the turn and until it begins to tighten up. look through the turn, and begin to accelerate when you can see the apex, which is quite late in the turn.

I have heard different things about how to further turn/lean the bike; in case you went in too hot into a decreasing radius turn

1) Roll off a bit so the front becomes more responsive to steering, and get back on the gas as soon as you have further turned the bike in. But wouldn't this would further take away from ground clearance in case the turn got tighter and you need to lean more?

OR
2) REAR wheel that turns a tighter radii. Use the rear brake slightly to make a tighter turn.

I couldn't find much on this in several books such as Sport bike riding techniques or Proficient motorcycling.

Your input is appreciated.Thanks

[Awesome]

Throw that bitch into the ground and hammer the gas. Don't be a pussy.

[Pittenger5]

More lean angle

[Tricky Mike]

What's a rear brake? Do you mean the anti-loop lever?

[OreoGaborio]

Look, press, lean.

If that isn't working, look more, press harder, lean further.

[SwiftTone]

Downshift, rev match, apply front and drag the rear brakes while applying gas, slide out the rear Rossi style, and drift to setup for the turn. Works every time.

[yzedf]

If you're not dragging hard parts on the ground you can push harder and lean over farther. Look at the white line to the right side off your lane, not the double yellow.

[SRTie4k]

And don't look at that SUV that just crossed into your lane traveling the opposite direction.

[Awesome]

The worse you crash the more you're learning.

[G21forme]

+1 for Lean more

[scottieducati]

Two words: trail braking. If your bike is set up properly, front brake application or adding a little front brake should yield a bike that drops the front end and tightens its turn. The key is smooth and steady application and not "stabbing" the brake lever.

[Garandman]

This is one of those "DDT" tips.




* DDT means "Don't Do This."

[Karate.Snoopy]

Two words: trail braking. If your bike is set up properly, front brake application or adding a little front brake should yield a bike that drops the front end and tightens its turn. The key is smooth and steady application and not "stabbing" the brake lever.

Do you guys trail brake with both the front and rear brakes or do you favor one over the other. Also what is the throttle doing whilst trail braking, completely closed, maintenance throttle?

Some points I have heard

"the rear brake won't upset the balance of the bike like the front will. It is still trail braking, but a more forgiving form of it." I kind of 'lean' toward this because it sheds off some speed and coupled with a nice lean/counter steer might do the job.

"if i am too hot in a turn, I am gonna use the front brake, and steepen the steering geometry. I sure in the hell aint gonna use the rear unless i was ALREADY trailing it toward the apex". If one is not smooth with the brakes this might wash out the front. I wouldn't try this on the street unless I get schooled on the track first.
I know I need to get my a$$ educated at a track school (might do that at some point later this year, have a little one on the way; life is getting way too busy)

[Degsy]

Wirelessly posted

No comment. I would make one particular comment but 2 or 3 people will explain why I'm wrong and equate it to turn 1 at Loudon.

[Awesome]

Wirelessly posted

No comment. I would make one particular comment but 2 or 3 people will explain why I'm wrong and equate it to turn 1 at Loudon.

No shit? Welcome to becoming me 5 years ago.

[JettaJayGLS]

To be honest...from how you're posing your questions and answers you are way over thinking this, especially for street riding. You should not be worried about trail breaking with your rear brake for any sort of street riding. To be honest, short of being a high performing expert racer I doubt anyone is touching their rear break except for Wheelie Control.

If you want to learn this skill in anticipation of an "oh shit" moment, I would put in more lean before touching the rear brake. If you think you have maxed out your front brake potential and you're at a lean angle that is enough to scare you, there is going to be so little grip on the rear tire that anything more than a super light touch of the rear break is probably gonna put you on your ass.

My thought process: using the rear brake to assist in a decreasing radius turn is such a refined and high level skill that if you were up to the level of using it and being able to use it correctly than you would not be posing these questions on an internet forum. Practice trail breaking, practice looking through the corner, practice keeping composure and staying smooth.

[nhbubba]

I agree. If you're doing this kind of stuff on the street, you are probably over-riding. At least in my view.

Although I do use my rear brake all the time at low speeds. Hugely useful for U-turns and in parking lots.

[yzedf]

You should be riding at a pace on the street that anything could happen and you should be safe. This time of year; lots of sandy corners, water runoff, sun in your eyes, cars pulling out and who knows what else. I never use rear for trail braking, I use the front as it helps get a quicker initial turn in. My old cbr600rr was slow turning so its something I used a lot. Don't practice this around other bikes or cars as people will not be expecting it. This is all instinctual stuff that I rarely use on the street unless I've done something stupid, I'm talking only 2 or 3 times a year, usually because I'm going faster than I should be.

What rider training do you have? Have you done a track day?

[TTD]

***I know I need to get my a$$ educated at a track school (might do that at some point later this year, have a little one on the way; life is getting way too busy)***

I understand how life can get in the way, but acquiring skills BEFORE you need them is a beautiful thing. Getting them after the crash... not so impressive.

[RandyO]

I encountered a decreasing radius curve a little hot once when leading a ride with my SV, I counter steered till I had hard parts dragging, kept on looking where I wanted to go, at the end of the curve I was upright and accelerating out.

I still think I crashed and miraculously recovered, Degsy went wide

[Degsy]

Wirelessly posted

I encountered a decreasing radius curve a little hot once when leading a ride with my SV, I counter steered till I had hard parts dragging, kept on looking where I wanted to go, at the end of the curve I was upright and accelerating out.

I still think I crashed and miraculously recovered, Degsy went wide

I did?

[Awesome]

Wirelessly posted



I did?

Just like turn 1 Loudon when you tried to do that thing.

[golden chicken]

I found this article to be quite helpful:

http://www.svrider.com/forum/showthread.php?t=160570

[KillahTillah]

Throw that bitch into the ground and hammer the gas. Don't be a pussy.

lol....yeah baby

[Karate.Snoopy]

***I know I need to get my a$$ educated at a track school (might do that at some point later this year, have a little one on the way; life is getting way too busy)***

I understand how life can get in the way, but acquiring skills BEFORE you need them is a beautiful thing. Getting them after the crash... not so impressive.

I do agree that there is no substitute for learning first hand from the pro's and we have plenty of those here.

Might I dare to steer the conversation toward "path to improve my riding"

Since I only have a couple of seasons of riding under my belt I was thinking about taking the

MSF ERC or the Total Control Clinic ARC1 with Lee Parks and crew

followed by a couple of track days at some point.