Getting permission to ride in a lot?

["Dangerous" Dan K]

I've got a friend who owns a big storage place real close to my parents house, where my bike is currently stored. He owns a couple actually, but that's the only one that matters as far as this goes. He's a good guy, and has offered me many favors in the past including a free storage unit (none of which I've taken him up on). He wants some favors from me, which I'd be more than happy to hook him up with, namely some AP of his house and storage places. Thing is, he's insistant on paying me even though I want to do it as a favor.

His family owns the entire plaza the storage units are in, he's part owner in it all. I think it's him and his brother that own the joint together. They gate it during off hours, and it's empty. I'm thinking about asking him to let me play with my bikes there as "payment" for the AP stuff. It'd be more offhand, like, "You know I don't want to charge you for the AP job, but if you insist on paying me you could give me permission to ride in your lot". All in good fun type stuff. He's very interested in bikes, the racing thing, etc. My concern is liability. Obviously I'd come up with a waiver to sign that he's not responsible for anything that comes from me laying the bike down there. I wouldn't be turning laps practicing to race, but it'd be nice to have somewhere I could dial some stuff in and get used to the bike a bit.

Has anyone dealt with something like this? I know if I had written permission the police couldn't bother me, as it's private property (and gated off). I don't know if I'd have to worry about his insurance or anything like that. I'd be riding in the open part of the lot far from the buildings, so it's not like I could hurt any of his stuff. I'd just like to know as much as I can about the legal/liability aspect before I ask him. I think he'll say something along the lines of "Sure, I don't give a shit, knock yourself out - just be safe". He's that type of dude.

[crowspeed07]

When it comes to stunt riding as long as we have written permission from a higher up in the company or the land owner. were fine as long as theirs no direct route to the road. which you have the fence so your fine and in the written permission we say we hurt our self we are at fault and wont do burnouts. Is the area in a residential are or? just because if theirs some pita neighbors they may call complaining about the noise so id just stay out after 11pm or so.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

Cool, thanks. It's a big parking lot right between the highway and a few houses. My bike is pretty quiet (PTwin Shitty Mcbikefest) so I imagine the highway will mask a lot of the noise. All the same I wouldn't be there late. I don't know if it's even lit well enough to ride at night, and the bike has no lights. I'll run it by him, and make sure to mention no burnouts, clean up after myself and I'm at fault for any injuries.

[crowspeed07]

Yea the parking lots we ride in are actually kind of happy to see us. cuz before anyone rides all the junk on the lot gets blown with a leaf blower or swept. And since your alone/wont have alot of bikes i don't see to much b.s. from the police escp if the gate is closed and your vehicle is inside. I know when alot of people are their sometimes the cops like to be difficult but for the most part when they do show up its to watch then they go on their way.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

Cool. This is a small town, they don't even have their own police force, they borrow it from a neighboring town. I'd be the only bike there, maybe one other, stock pipes and whatnot. I don't see it being too much of an issue. I should also mention I'll be blowing and sweeping the lot, kind of an extra bonus. Thanks again for the info.

[noxin]

Depending on what you're doing/testing, I'd also recommend finding a Buddy to be there with you. It's after hours which means foot/car traffic is going to be minimal, if not non-existent. If something happens, it'd be nice to have someone there to assist and get help if needed.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

Yeah, I would definitely have someone around with a cell phone. I'm sure if I can get permission to ride there, I can get it for "me and a buddy of mine". I don't think I'd have trouble finding a friend who wanted to come ride in a closed lot every once in a while

[butcher bergs]

FWIW; a couple of us have used a practice spot that involves a large parking lot just off a highly traveled road. We've dragged knees for hours out there and only gained spectators from it. Haven't asked for permission and haven't gotten any harassment whatsoever from the land owners as well as law enforcement.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

FWIW; a couple of us have used a practice spot that involves a large parking lot just off a highly traveled road. We've dragged knees for hours out there and only gained spectators from it. Haven't asked for permission and haven't gotten any harassment whatsoever from the land owners as well as law enforcement.

I'm looking to do it on a track bike. No plate, no registration, no lights, etc. If I were looking to play with a street bike that's the route I would take (and have taken, in the past).

[butcher bergs]

I'm looking to do it on a track bike. No plate, no registration, no lights, etc. If I were looking to play with a street bike that's the route I would take (and have taken, in the past).

You know what they say about assuming, right?

I've been to this spot on a few non-streetable machines.

[palanon]

Just work it out with him. Give him a basic written waiver of liability for injury and damage liability. Ask him for a letter saying you have permission to use the property with a phone # in the event the local P.D. want to call.

No reason this can't be a gentleman's agreement with a note on file for his Ins. company.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

You know what they say about assuming, right?

I've been to this spot on a few non-streetable machines.

Yeah, I do know what they say. And with a very sketchy license due to past stupid shit I've done, I don't want to assume I'd be OK and lose my license because I got a list of tickets thrown at me that pushed me over the points limit.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

Just work it out with him. Give him a basic written waiver of liability for injury and damage liability. Ask him for a letter saying you have permission to use the property with a phone # in the event the local P.D. want to call.

No reason this can't be a gentleman's agreement with a note on file for his Ins. company.

That's exactly the kind of thing I'm hoping to do here. I'm not willing to drag lawyers and shit into it and create any tension between friends, but I want to know how other people have done similar things so that I can include the right stuff when I ask, for example "I'll of course get you a written waiver of any liability, and as a bonus you'll have me sweeping and/or blowing off your lot for you". I think I'm about ready to ask him next time I see him, which is usually a couple times a week.

[butcher bergs]

This is way too complicated.

Find an open parking lot and practice in it....simple, done.


Most the police can do is ask you to leave (the first time). They cannot ticket you for operating an unregistered vehicle on private property and that's a fact.
No matter who owns the property, you cannot be ticketed for operating a non-streetable vehicle on private land.

[palanon]

This is way too complicated.

Find an open parking lot and practice in it....simple, done.


Most the police can do is ask you to leave (the first time). They cannot ticket you for operating an unregistered vehicle on private property and that's a fact.
No matter who owns the property, you cannot be ticketed for operating a non-streetable vehicle on private land.

Yes you can. If the public has reasonable access to the property for business purposes. If the local P.D. caught you racing around on my property you would go directly to jail and not collect $200.00. Your non registered vehicle would also be impounded.

On the other hand, if you had a letter and my phone # saying it's OK, they'd probably order a pizza and watch the show.

[Big Draggo]

Here you go...


Waiver/Release Agreement
WAIVER/RELEASE AGREEMENT
I understand that there are risks and dangers inherent in participating and/or receiving instruction in Controlled Motorcycle Riding, hereinafter referred to as "Activity". I also understand that in order to be allowed to participate and/or receive instruction in Activity, I must give up my rights to hold ________________________liable for any injury or damage that I may suffer while participating and/or receiving instruction in Activity.
Knowing this, and in consideration of being permitted to participate and/or receive instruction in Activity, I hereby voluntarily release _____________________ from any and all liability resulting from or arising out of my participation and/or receipt of instruction in Activity.
I understand and agree that I am releasing not only the entities set forth in the paragraph above, but also the officers, agents, and employees of those entities.
I understand and agree that this Waiver/Release will have the effect of releasing, discharging, waiving and forever relinquishing any and all actions or causes of action that I may have or have had, whether past, present or future, whether known or unknown, and whether anticipated or unanticipated by me, arising out of my participation and/or receipt of instruction in Activity.
I understand and agree that this Waiver/Release applies to personal injury, property damage, or wrongful death which I may suffer, even if caused by the acts or omissions of others.
I understand and agree that by signing this Waiver/Release, I am assuming full responsibility for any and all risk of death or personal injury or property damage suffered by me while participating and/or receiving instruction in Activity.
I understand and agree that this Waiver/Release will be binding on me, my spouse, my heirs, my personal representatives, my assignees, my children and any guardian ad litem for said children.
I understand and agree that by signing this Waiver/Release, I am agreeing to release, indemnify and hold ____________________________, agents or employees harmless from any and all liability or costs, including attorney’s fees, associated with or arising from my participation and/or receipt of instruction in Activity.
I understand and agree that if I am signing this Waiver/Release on behalf of my minor child, that I will be giving up the same rights for said minor as I would be giving up if I signed this document of my own behalf.
I acknowledge that I have read this Waiver/Release Agreement and that I understand the words and language in it. I have been advised of the potential dangers incidental to participating and/or receiving instruction in Activity .
Dated: _________________________,20________
Print Name: ____________________________________
Sign Name: ____________________________________
Witness: ____________________________________


I acknowledge that ________________________ may deny permission to engage in Activity at any time for any reason without notification. I acknowledge________________ may choose to void this agreement at their sole discretion without reason or notification.

(Keep this part to show to the 5-0)
I ______________ give permission for joe stunna to engage in controlled motorcycle riding upon the premises of Some Warehouse. I have been given a thorough release/waiver signed by joe stunna, and my company and I am in no way responsible from actions taking place on the property.
I may deny permission to engage in Activity at any time for any reason without notification. I may choose to void this agreement at their sole discretion without reason or notification.
Dated: _________________________,20________
Print Name: ____________________________________
Sign Name: ____________________________________
Witness: ____________________________________

[Big Draggo]

Another.

Motorcycle Stunt and Practice
RELEASE AND WAIVER OF ALL CLAIMS

"Stunting" means the act of performing tricks (specifically motorcycle tricks)


Risk Warning:
Motorcycle riding has its risks, as does operating any motor vehicle. Motorcycle stunting adds the risk of using a motorcycle in ways not intended by the original manufacturer. This involves a significant risk of physical harm or personal injury including permanent disability and/or death to participants, any such injury may result not only from your actions but from the action, omission or negligence of others.

In consideration for, and as a condition of my involvement in said stunting I:

1. warrant that I am medically fit (including physically and mentally) to participate in said stunting;
2. acknowledge the risk warning set out above and I agree that I assume all risks in connection with my participation in the activities and acknowledge that High Velocity Cycles is not liable for any damage or injury which occurs during any stunt practice;
3. waive, release and discharge all and any claim, right, or cause of action however arising including from any negligent act or omission of any person, whether or not presently ascertained, immediate, future or contingent which I may have for or arising out of loss of my life or injury, damage or loss of any description whatsoever and howsoever caused which I may suffer or sustain in the course of or consequent upon my participation in said stunting;
4. indemnify against any claim, right, or cause of action however arising including from any negligent act or omission of any person, whether or not presently ascertained, immediate, future or contingent which I may have for or arising out of loss of my life or injury, damage or loss of any description whatsoever and howsoever caused which I may suffer or sustain in the course of or consequent upon my participation in said stunting;
5. agree that the waiver, release and discharge contained in paragraph 3 above and the indemnity contained in paragraph 4 shall operate in favor of High Velocity Cycles and it employees and customers and shall so operate whether or not the loss, injury or damage is due or attributable to and act, neglect or omission of any one or more of the Released Persons;
6. agree and acknowledge by my participation in said stunting that many stunts are inherently dangerous and involve a high risk of serious injury, illness, permanent disability and/or death which may or will result in sever economic and /or property loss and damage and I fully recognize and accept those risks.

By checking this box I indicate that I am at least 18 years of age and have read and fully understand this release and waiver.


Please Print Name: ____________________________________ DOB: ________________________
(date of birth)

Signature of Participant: __________________________________ Date: ________________________

__________________________________________________ ____________________________________------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I agree that any and all audio, audio visual, and/or photographic recording(s) of me taken by High Velocity Cycles may be used for publicity and promotion purposes.


Signature of Participant: ____________________________________

[crowspeed07]

This is way too complicated.

Find an open parking lot and practice in it....simple, done.


Most the police can do is ask you to leave (the first time). They cannot ticket you for operating an unregistered vehicle on private property and that's a fact.
No matter who owns the property, you cannot be ticketed for operating a non-streetable vehicle on private land.

bwhahahahahahahaha. yes you can. thats like saying you cant get into trouble for smoking weed in a wal mart parking lot because its a private lot.

[NeverlosT]

and then big draggo just straight up killed it! Man, if i have any legal questions, im asking you about what forms to use...

I really want to find an abandoned lot to race around in down here... there is a middle school across the street, but thats public methinks and I'd get pinched in a hurry...

Good luck!

[butcher bergs]

Yes you can. If the public has reasonable access to the property for business purposes. If the local P.D. caught you racing around on my property you would go directly to jail and not collect $200.00. Your non registered vehicle would also be impounded.

On the other hand, if you had a letter and my phone # saying it's OK, they'd probably order a pizza and watch the show.

You used the word "racing" which is not what we're doing here.

Obviously there's a certain amount of discretion that needs to be considered with my comment. If you're weaving in and out of parked vehicles that's different.
If you're all alone in the middle of a lot, the policia can't do a damned thing without a formal complaint from the land owner.....either that or I've been absurdly lucky with police driving by our practice spot and not stopping all of us.

Only reason I'd "go directly to jail and not collect $200.00. Your non registered vehicle would also be impounded." is if you (the land owner) wanted that to occur.

Trust me on this one.

I have a private cul-de-sac that I do wheelies on (unfinished development). Cops stopped by one day because someone down the street called them. I told the officer straight up what I was doing. He told me about the complaint, said "be careful" and drove off.

And it's nothing like smoking weed in Walmart parking lot.....not even remotely the same thing.

["Dangerous" Dan K]

Draggo,

Thanks! I'd need to modify a touch, remove instruction and stunting, etc but I can easily make what I need from those. Very cool, thank you very much!

[6 Fingered Man]

Depending on what you're doing/testing, I'd also recommend finding a Buddy to be there with you. It's after hours which means foot/car traffic is going to be minimal, if not non-existent. If something happens, it'd be nice to have someone there to assist and get help if needed.

Ill do it

["Dangerous" Dan K]

Ill do it

I had a feeling you & your CB might be a primary candidate. We'd better make sure to keep the crash record of you & I riding together and on each others shit under wraps

[6 Fingered Man]

The crash book needs no new pictures.... unless they are of your bike.

[Big Draggo]

Draggo,

Thanks! I'd need to modify a touch, remove instruction and stunting, etc but I can easily make what I need from those. Very cool, thank you very much!