? for MSF Instructors...

[benVFR]

Can anyone let me know what the dimensions of the slow speed figure-8 box are in the ERC?

Is there any document out there that gives the dimensions of all this stuff?

The figure-8 was the drill I had the most trouble with, I could only do it maybe 50% of the time, I've been practicing this stuff and I wouldn't mind putting my cones out to try it and see if I've gotten better.

[NinjaSwan]

yeah, those fukers were hard. Everything else was so easy but those 8's... I do find myself thinking about it all the time when i'm doing a uturn... slide the butt over keep the head up and ride the clutch..

and for my next trick I will ride through a ring of fire.

[benVFR]

I have noticed on my bike it helps if I move to the outside of the saddle but also crouch forward over the front end. My natural inclination in tight maneuvers is to sit up perfectly straight like the instructors do on a standard bike. No one ever told me to lean forward more. Maybe it is compressing the forks just enough to tighten the steering radius, I also trail the rear brake which on my bike activates a teeny bit of front brake due to the LBS, also probably dropping the front end.

My bike basically has to be on the steering lock to do it I think... which makes it scary as you have no room to move the handlebars, you have to trust yourself and adjust your line with the throttle.

[NinjaSwan]

did you try doing some google searches for those specs?

[slaps76]

Ben, did you take the experienced course with the VFR, or are you talking about when you took the basic?

I had no problems doing the circle with the little Nighthawk...but I don't think I'd even want to try with the "tank." Even though there are plenty of guys on Goldwings that do it with ease.

[Paul_E_D]

I'd have to check my books for the dimensions. I'll get back to you on that. Ken C. can rock the box on his VFR everytime. He goes considerably faster than you might guess so he can really lean it over. (and that's the smaller box for the BRC!)

On my Duc, the streering lock is considerably less and my thumbs hit the tank. I can't make it everytime in the small box, but I don't get to practice on the duc much. Mostly trainer bikes. Faster is definitely easier though...

[benVFR]

I took the ERC on the VFR.

I know it can be done on the VFR... when I took the ERC there was an instructor sitting in on the class on his VFR, and he was able to do it, but it was interesting, he could not turn in the same space as many of the students in the class with standard or cruising bikes. There was a pretty new rider on a GS500 and he was doing it in WAY less space then the instructor could manage with his VFR.

At one point he got the pegs down on his VFR just to get it around one of the really tight/slow drills. Sounds like the same think Ken does... get the bike going way faster then you expect so you can put it into "lean" mode. I would not say my confidence is anywhere near good enough to go to peg dragging angles at such low speeds. (Unfortunate I suppose, but no one is going to let me ride like that in their parking lot to practice!)

[union]

its two sizes. They let you practice on a 25x60 and for the test its 22x60. A lot of people have trouble with it. Bikes just arent made to turn at such a slow speed but when you see how people do it you can weed out the ones you might want to avoid in the future.

[Tabby]

A little trick for those of you who haven't tried it. Oh yeah, I used to do the box on my Gixxer, and my "G". Try dragging your rear brake while you apply the throttle. I have found at times that method to be a little easier to modulate than using your clutch. It takes all of the slack out of the driveline, and flattens out the small throttle variations that may make the bike feel unsatble at those slow speeds. Try subtle applications. It doesn't take much.

[Paul_E_D]

Actually, if you have taken the ERC lately, the box has been widened to 28' I believe, with the narrower one at 24. The beginner course is 24' and 20'. At least that's what it says in my coaching materials... what is painted on the range "should" match these numbers.

The 20' box is the only one that should really present a problem for a sportbike IMO. Goldwings are quite easy to manuever because of the wide, high bars and a wide steering lock. Some cruisers are really easy as well.

Some sportbikes are pretty good at this too. I know the Aprilia RSV handles well at low speeds.

[Stoneman]

I found the best way to navigate the tight test courses is to keep the RPM's high and use the clutch, A LOT...

[beet]

[SWEET_Z]

Yeh I had to do tight figure 8's on the 6R for my test. It was on a dead end side street with loose gravel. It's pretty hard on a sport bike as I was at full lock in both directions. No where to put the thumbs. Only put my foot down lightly once though. Never let the clutch all the way out helps.

[SVRACER01]

what if you did the figure 8 while doing a burnout? that would be stable. what if you did it in a wheelie? would they fail you for that? maybe there should be a stunters license and you have to a figure 8 burnout and a wheelie..