Newbies w/ literbikes...

[unionjackass]

>What you want is what is used in
>Japan and the UK - tiered licencing.

It would help.

>Does it work - debatable.

I do not agree.

What is needed here is to make the business of acquiring a motorcycle license sufficiently "involved" that only people who really want to do it will have the commitment to succeed.

This alone would rule out a large proportion of the casual fortysomething drinking population, and a good number of litersquids.

It would also result in a higher level of skill in a licensed rider.

Real motorcyclists won't see it as a problem and will enjoy their year on a smaller-output bike regardless.

What we have in the moment, like the driving license in general, is the absolute reverse of the "it's a privilege not a right" argument that the state claims to apply. If it was not for the saints of the MSF there would be no viable learning path whatsoever.

We as motorcycle enthusiasts can either propose our own set of rules and attempt to self-regulate, or we can wait for them to be imposed upon us. I guarantee the latter case will involve much more draconian measures.

[SWEET_Z]

It's not the bike, it's the rider.

[OreoGaborio]

Originally posted by SWEET_Z
It's not the bike, it's the rider.

well if that's the case, what did you say the last time someone asked you the question "what's a good starter bike?".... did you say "GSX-r 1000" or "go for the Hyabusa"?

[unionjackass]

>"GSX-r 1000" or "go for the Hyabusa"?

Sounds like a salesman at GBM!!!

[benVFR]

My squid stage was pretty much contained in my first month... I bought the SV-650 which was way more bike than I could handle at that time.

I rode with full gear the very first time I swung my leg over the bike. I even had all the gear for the MSF class. I'd dropped my dad's cruiser in the driveway a few years before after he pestered me to try it and didn't tell me anything about the controls, so I was a pretty scared beginner. That was super squidly, but I never let the bike fall all the way over, it just scared the living crap out of me, cause I didn't even know to hit the kill switch when it started to go over, and the engine raced when I tried to pick it back up.

To this day I've only rode without full gear maybe 4-5 times. Basically riding 3 miles to Verizon in jeans/jacket/gloves/helmet instead of full gear. I've gone across the paddock at the track without a helmet, and I've moved the bike to wash it without a helmet, but that's it.

I think I had gone to the track 2x before I ever popped the front wheel up, which I still have probably done less than 5x not including having it come up 2" or so coming out first gear corners.

I go over 100 regularly but I've only gone over 120 2-3 times on the street and over 130 once on a bike.

But the squid definitely lives within... just like everyone else.

[Kham]

Originally posted by OreoGaborio
well if that's the case, what did you say the last time someone asked you the question "what's a good starter bike?".... did you say "GSX-r 1000" or "go for the Hyabusa"?

i'd say get whatever the hell you want but make sure you pass MSF first.

[R7]

Originally posted by ZX-12R
I'm with you 100%.

While I agree that sportbikes are not the best choice for a new rider, what you spend your money on is no one's business but your own. Along the same lines, dealers should be able to sell any motorcycle they want to whomever walks through their door.

BRILLIANT !!!

I'm still somewhat squidly and i'm pretty proud of it as well While i do beleive in full gear for sportriding, i've been known to take a ride to the beach or to Thayer St in shorts and a Tshirt 99.99% of the time, i do at least wear my helmet though

When i first started riding, i was without a doubt a full on squid. My very first ride ever on a streetbike was when i unloaded my brandy spanking new 1994 purple FZR600 (the R6 of 1994) after driving 200 miles with it in the back of my truck up to Laconia bike week I learned a lot that weekend, not only did i learn how to do a burnout, but i learnt how to shift gears at the same time Ahhhh yes the good ole memories

[13]

My cousin's kind of tall, so they used that as a bargaining point. But mostly he says they said he'd get used to the power quickly. I told him, if I ever see him doing anything ridiculous on it, I'll punch him right in the crotch. He plans to bring it down to my work when he picks it up. He wants me to put some accessories on it. Maybe I'll disable it. Right after I get out and test it out a little.

[OreoGaborio]

pull a spark plug or two, make that R1 a 500

[Rhonda66]

I was almost a squid - when my husband first got his bike, I ragged on him for wanting gear. I had absolutely no clue when I first started thinking about getting a bike! All the guys I knew who rode bikes in high school were squids so I didn't know any better!

My husband told me to take the MSF and to get a Ninja 250 to learn on. He taught me the basics on an old 500 we have in the garage and all I did was roll up and down the driveway on it to get the feel for the clutch. I bought my bike before I took the MSF, but didn't ride it until afterwards. I always wear my Joe Rocket suit - I feel like a flamer when I go anywhere cuz all the little kids stare and point at me and I feel like I stick out like a sore thumb, but I feel better knowing I have it on in case I wipe out.

They *should* require some sort of training for everyone before getting a mc, but this is America and America is about freedom and rights so I really don't think we want to put limits on what people can/can't choose to buy.

[Rhonda66]

I know someone's probably gonna flame me for this too, but I have a question for you guys - this has been confusing me for some time since I started perusing NESR. We all talk about safety and then in the Rules for Group Riding post, it says...

"This one's open for debate, but if someone deliberately runs from the cops on a group ride, I probably won't be riding with them again. I wouldn't run from the cops even if I was alone...but in a group I think it's especially bad. Like I said, this one's open for debate."

Is it like generally accepted in the sportbike community to run from the cops or what? I would think it would be a definite no/no with how you guys preach safety -

[Suf Daddy]

Simply put Biking is an exposed sport where its you vs. the ground, car bumper or tree.

Gear and speed (25mph vs 90 mph) may help you in an accident, but being out on the road whether its 250 cc vs 1300 cc's isn't going to make that much of a difference.

Its not comparible to a Chevy sprint vs a Chevy Suburban..........

Originally posted by Honclfibr
I've heard this stated as fact a million times and I don't believe that it's even remotely true.

[Suf Daddy]

VTEC = slow..........
No civic is going to do 200 MPH, and incase you find some Bonneville salt flats guy who mods one to do 200, its still an anomily.
-Suf Daddy no spell checker.

Originally posted by Kham
teenager is the problem. im telling you. not all of them but that's rare case. put them on a honda civic and they can do 200mph. you mix this with cell phone use, soccer mom, DUI, etc. = disaster. then everyone pays the insurance height.

[Kham]

Originally posted by Suf Daddy
VTEC = slow..........
No civic is going to do 200 MPH, and incase you find some Bonneville salt falts guy who mods one to do 200, its still an anomily.
-Suf Daddy no spell checker.

i know but i didn't mean that litterally.

[Suf Daddy]

LOL
-Suf Daddy

Originally posted by bigred875
you also voted for Kerry and thought he'd win

[OreoGaborio]

Originally posted by Rhonda66
Is it like generally accepted in the sportbike community to run from the cops or what?

not in THIS community

[Suf Daddy]

While you might want to make the guy work for the ticket, weaving in and out of traffic is just endangering yourself more than its worth......

I think they call it driving to endanger and at that stage 7/8 people are going to take someone out with them in the felony run.....
-Suf Daddy

Originally posted by OreoGaborio
not in THIS community

[ChrisNoF4i]

Originally posted by Rhonda66
They *should* require some sort of training for everyone before getting a mc, but this is America and America is about freedom and rights so I really don't think we want to put limits on what people can/can't choose to buy.

Amen.

Pete should worry about Pete. Not Tom, Dick & Larry.
If you really want to help people, join the Peace Corp or something.

[patricia929]

i hate putting more restrictions on motorcyclist but i don't think a tiered licensing system is a bad idea. that said, it's almost impossible to protect stupid people from themselves. when i was learning to ride i took the msf course. one of the questions that they asked us was what are you currently riding or what were you planning to get for a bike. the responses were interesting. most of the women wanted harleys and a good percentage of the young guys wanted a hyabusa or an r1. i have to admit i got a good laugh watching the hyabusa wannbe guy wobbling around on the nighthawk 250

[ancosta]

How about a tiered model where you must show x amount of training + time in order to move into an open class of bike?

Starter bike limited to a limited hp/weight ratio and a max dry weight of say x lbs?

Once person has logged x hrs and attended x,y,z classes or 'tests out' with x hrs of riding signed off by a fellow licensed rider.

You can call it too expensive, too intrusive, etc. but IMHO if you make a tiered model that requires people to actually work at it rather than just have an idle license for x months before taking off the restrictor plate, etc. then it isn't doing a whole lot.

I could be wrong, but where I live in RI there's a high concentration of new/untrained riders that pose a safety risk to themselves & more importantly others.

Under 35 = new rider on GSXR, etc. with snapped brake levers and rashed plastics to see a trend. Size of engine displacement directly related to rider's credit score.

Over 35 = new rider on an HD, etc. HELOC funds bike and Viagra costs along with recent divorce settlement. Size of penis directly related to engine CCs.

I park on Thayer street and get a bite at the Syrian place, and sit outside. Last week it was a bunch of cruiser guys bashing my chick/fag/loser/poor man's crotch rocket while I was (unbeknownst to them) sitting down about 10' away. The time before that it was a bunch of 20 year old's bashing it as a chick/fag/loser/poor man's cruiser.

That's what you get for buying a sensible first bike under your own personal accord, I suppose

Edit/PS: The beginner MSF class is IMHO about as much training you need to be able to ride with a PERMIT, if that. Great class but no way does a looping cones in a parking lot on a 250 equal riding down 93 on a 800# full dresser HD. And there were several guys in the class who bought just that, and tried just that, and under their own common sense, put away the bike until they took the course. (After they realized they might die if they didn't)

[ZX-12R]

Originally posted by ancosta
Over 35 = new rider on an HD, etc. HELOC funds bike and Viagra costs along with recent divorce settlement. Size of penis directly related to engine CCs.

I think you mean "inversely proportional"

[ancosta]

Originally posted by ZX-12R
I think you mean "inversely proportional"

Something like this:

[HBerry]

Originally posted by ancosta
Something like this:

That would be inverse my friend!

[HBerry]

Originally posted by ancosta
Something like this:

It should have a downward slope, You always start from a center point of 0,0 and number upwards, therefore this would have a downward slope concave to the origin.

[R7]

So what's that saying about me sence i only ride a 450cc bike?