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H-D Pan America

  1. #26
    First name on the shit list.... SVRACER01's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America


    Quote Originally Posted by Garandman View Post


    Most sales in U.S., so here’s why they are worried.

    this type of info is skewed. the powersports market as a whole is down. that means that if HDs sales are down, then so is everyone elses. year after year HD sells about 50% of all new 599cc+ bikes in the US.

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  2. #27
    First name on the shit list.... SVRACER01's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by MUZ720 View Post
    could they not have made a better looking bike? that is butt fuggily, Nice to see they moved away from the fake air cooled fins though. at least they are making an attempt to bring new people into the brand. Hope the dealers support it better they did Buell and give it a chance to grow mkt. share.
    looks are subjective. its not like ADV bikes are known for their good looks.

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  3. #28
    Posting Freak MUZ720's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    After looking at a few other makes ,your right about the class being more of a 5 then a 10 on the beauty scale... the color combo doesn't help! It does look better in black ..

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  4. #29
    Lifer typeone's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Ulysses 2.0 ... weird

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  5. #30
    Super Adventurer SRTie4k's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Looks don't matter a whole hell of a lot in the adventure segment when it's been dropped in rock gardens and covered in mud and dust. I'm no Chris Birch; the condition of my bike is proof.

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  6. #31
    First name on the shit list.... SVRACER01's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by SRTie4k View Post
    Looks don't matter a whole hell of a lot in the adventure segment when it's been dropped in rock gardens and covered in mud and dust. I'm no Chris Birch; the condition of my bike is proof.
    I havent washed my bike in 18k miles

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  7. #32
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    Ulysses 2.0 ... weird
    Butterface

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  8. #33
    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by typeone View Post
    Ulysses 2.0 ... weird
    And that’s the concern.

    Went into Manchester (NH) Harley to look at a Ulysses. The salesman saw me looking at it, and suddenly,found the conversation he was having with a coworker utterly fascinating.

    The parts guy saw me, came over, and expressed a lot of enthusiasm for the line and that bike. But it was clear they didn’t have their hearts in it.

    Few years later went to Boston HD to look at an XR1200. They had it buried in a corner behind other bikes, and the salesman professed seemingly proudly to know nothing about it. Asked if they were going to adopt the European suspension (as usual, HD fitted the bike with the absolute cheapest possible suspension, with damping in only one fork leg) and I might as well have been speaking Greek. HD did fix the suspension the next year, but killed the bike after a five year run.

    From a business perspective, I seriously question the ability of the dealer channel to adapt to the realities of any market outside their core “Lifestyle” business. It’s interesting that Polaris has taken market share from them with the Indian brand, yet even Indian hasn’t seen fit to address this market. To my mind they (HD) are far too little, far too late.

    There is a little good news in that the Street 500 and 750 have been relatively successful, and HD has succeeded in attracting new riders in a number of demographics. When you are a $6 billion Corp. (true for both HD and Polaris) you aren’t going out of business anytime soon.

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    Last edited by Garandman; 12-13-19 at 03:20 PM.

  9. #34
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    Last edited by Garandman; 12-14-19 at 04:51 AM.

  10. #35
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    I am a gen X er and have been waiting for HD to build a bike that appeals to me. Buell was close but Sportster motor. V Rod gave me hope as it was liquid cooled but Porsche built it IMO.

    Hd products have always been slow, heavy, shite brakes and worse suspension. No lean angle available. Built more for style than function. I don't understand why people want to ride them. HD riders see me on a performance bike and think it's dangerous. I would argue that HD bikes are dangerous even at low speeds as their performance is so limited. At least fast bikes are dangerous because you get to go fast.

    I have renewed hope for he Bronx and new Ulysess. They have a liquid cooled engine which lets them make decent power. I wish they had made the engine bigger than 950cc. Of course no weight has been released, they will be heavy af and probably expensive.

    C'mon HD - build something light that performs.

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  11. #36
    First name on the shit list.... SVRACER01's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by klp View Post
    I am a gen X er and have been waiting for HD to build a bike that appeals to me. Buell was close but Sportster motor. V Rod gave me hope as it was liquid cooled but Porsche built it IMO.
    the Ulysses was garbage with a crap motor. i didnt realize porsche built shitty motors. not that the vrod was a good bike but the engine isnt what made it suck. what made it suck was the 300 rear tire and 14ft wheelbase.

    Quote Originally Posted by klp View Post
    HD products have always been slow, heavy, shite brakes and worse suspension. No lean angle available. Built more for style than function. I don't understand why people want to ride them. HD riders see me on a performance bike and think it's dangerous. I would argue that HD bikes are dangerous even at low speeds as their performance is so limited. At least fast bikes are dangerous because you get to go fast.
    whats funny is that every other company that makes the same style of bike (like boulevard or star), and no one criticizes them for being heavy, slow, or not performing and yet they are. if youre shopping for a cruiser or touring bike and youre main focus on features is speed and handling then you arent looking for a cruiser. fast bikes are actually more dangerous at low speeds since they handle like absolute garbage at anything at or below parking lot speeds.
    fact is, they dont weigh any more than anything else in their prospective categories, they arent any slower, the brakes arent any worse, and the suspension and lean angle isnt either.



    Quote Originally Posted by klp View Post
    I have renewed hope for he Bronx and new Ulysess. They have a liquid cooled engine which lets them make decent power. I wish they had made the engine bigger than 950cc. Of course no weight has been released, they will be heavy af and probably expensive.
    the reason for the engine size is they are looking at the middle weight naked category that is so popular right now (FZ-09, 790). im am hopeful theyve kept the weight down and the price point on par

    Quote Originally Posted by klp View Post
    C'mon HD - build something light that performs.
    unlikely. closest youll get probably is the livewire. i hope im wrong, but i wouldnt hold your breath. frankly, its what polaris shouldve done with Victory. rebrand it and make naked sport standards, ADV, and some sport touring bikes. instead theyu chopped its head off and made indians.

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  12. #37
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    I don't want to derail this thread and I am truly happy that people are excited about a new HD. I am not an expert in cruisers but make a simple comparo between the Raider and a Dyna. The Yammie has upside down forks, two discs and waaaaaay more power.

    Hd's new slogan should read "All the danger, none of the thrills."

    At least you will look like a badass right before you T bone a Prius.

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  13. #38
    Posting Freak BSR6's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by klp View Post
    I am a gen X er and have been waiting for HD to build a bike that appeals to me. Buell was close but Sportster motor. V Rod gave me hope as it was liquid cooled but Porsche built it IMO.

    Hd products have always been slow, heavy, shite brakes and worse suspension. No lean angle available. Built more for style than function. I don't understand why people want to ride them. HD riders see me on a performance bike and think it's dangerous. I would argue that HD bikes are dangerous even at low speeds as their performance is so limited. At least fast bikes are dangerous because you get to go fast.

    I have renewed hope for he Bronx and new Ulysess. They have a liquid cooled engine which lets them make decent power. I wish they had made the engine bigger than 950cc. Of course no weight has been released, they will be heavy af and probably expensive.

    C'mon HD - build something light that performs.
    Judging by your description here I am guessing you have limited experience on Harleys. I thought the exact same way until I actually rode one. They do have models which are very functional and ride/handle well at street speeds. As a sport bike and track day rider, I find these models are better suited for the street than any sport bike. And they stop just fine (my FXDX has dual front discs). This is the whole reason I bought one. It's actually fun to ride at legal speeds and I've never been able to say this about my sport bikes.

    Now, don't get me wrong. What you say is true for the bigger models but if you go with a Dyna (or a new model that's designed to follow the Dyna spirit) you'll be pleasantly surprised.

    Try a 2020 FXD-R or Low Rider Sport. They both have dual front discs, inverted forks and decent geometry. I have yet to ride these models myself but my understanding is they are comparable to my FXDX in terms of handling (which handles quite well).

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  14. #39
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    Re: H-D Pan America


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  15. #40
    Member jimmycapp's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by SVRACER01 View Post
    whats funny is that every other company that makes the same style of bike (like boulevard or star), and no one criticizes them for being heavy, slow, or not performing and yet they are...fact is, they don't weigh any more than anything else in their prospective categories, they aren't any slower, the brakes aren't any worse, and the suspension and lean angle isn't either.
    But they typically cost a ton more.

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  16. #41
    Burns retinas nhbubba's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    The more I ride my FLHP, the more I like it.

    I wish it were a bit better on shitty roads. But honestly that's not a rational ask on a full-size touring bike. I borrowed a Gold Wing GL1800 for a weekend not long ago and it was similar on those roads. Both are fantastic on the interstate. And both were much better than one would expect in the twisties.

    The metric tourers from Star, etc are garbage. Lots of fake plastic chrome. Terrible controls. I remember demoing a Star that had cruise control and it was a chinzy little switch tacked onto the left control pod, so very obviously an afterthought. Kind of like KTM has done with the heated grips kit on the 790 ADV.

    Last I looked Indians offerings were more expensive than Harleys in most cases. Indian hasn't got a single bagger or touring model under $22,000!


    I don't like the styling on this Pan America much. But I have no doubt that HD can make a quality motorbike.

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  17. #42
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by SVRACER01 View Post
    ..
    closest youll get probably is the livewire....

    Speaking of the live wire, Did anyone else do the demo at Seacoast in September? The future is almost here.

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  18. #43
    Lifer Garandman's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by bassomatic View Post
    Speaking of the live wire, Did anyone else do the demo at Seacoast in September? The future is almost here.
    Think Live Wire is going to be road kill, for a simple reason: there are minimal barriers to entry.

    There are guys building some incredible rides on Advrider, and builders who will put together anything you want from kits. Our eBike is virtually one of a kind, built to our [very mainstream] specs from completely stock components.

    Blurring the line between bicycles and motorcycles.

    Segway dirt eBike 47mph top speed, 75 mile range, swappable battery pack, starting at $4,500.

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    Last edited by Garandman; 12-16-19 at 04:46 AM.

  19. #44
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by Garandman View Post
    Think Live Wire is going to be road kill, for a simple reason: there are minimal barriers to entry.

    There are guys building some incredible rides on Advrider, and builders who will put together anything you want from kits. Our eBike is virtually one of a kind, built to our [very mainstream] specs from completely stock components.

    Blurring the line between bicycles and motorcycles.

    Segway dirt eBike 47mph top speed, 75 mile range, swappable battery pack, starting at $4,500.
    --- The livewire may end up as roadkill but after riding one, I'm sold... except for the price. and the aesthetics..... Lightning's offering seems like pretty good specs/components for an under 20k bike. If this could charge up enough between track day sessions and during lunch to be able to go all day, it might be my next new bike (2 years from now).

    https://lightningmotorcycle.com/stri...pecifications/

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  20. #45
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by Garandman View Post
    Segway dirt eBike 47mph top speed, 75 mile range, swappable battery pack, starting at $4,500.
    122 lbs? Fuck I want to try that.

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  21. #46
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by Garandman View Post
    Think Live Wire is going to be road kill, for a simple reason: there are minimal barriers to entry.

    There are guys building some incredible rides on Advrider, and builders who will put together anything you want from kits. Our eBike is virtually one of a kind, built to our [very mainstream] specs from completely stock components.

    Blurring the line between bicycles and motorcycles.

    Segway dirt eBike 47mph top speed, 75 mile range, swappable battery pack, starting at $4,500.
    Oh, you mean a Sur Ron?

    NO! It's a Segway! We put a Segway sticker on a Sur Ron! That makes it a Segway!


    Ridden one. It's fun.

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  22. #47
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Quote Originally Posted by TheIglu View Post
    Oh, you mean a Sur Ron?

    NO! It's a Segway! We put a Segway sticker on a Sur Ron! That makes it a Segway!


    Ridden one. It's fun.
    LOL. I just ordered a 10 pack on alibaba...

    Where did you ride it?

    https://www.alibaba.com/product-deta...255347918.html

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  23. #48
    Super Moderator TheIglu's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    NYST. TTD customer has one and is fairly generous with allowing people to flog it.

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  24. #49
    Member jimmycapp's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    Nice. Looks like a blast. Colorado trails look awesome, too.


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  25. #50
    Posting Freak MUZ720's Avatar
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    Re: H-D Pan America

    This is kinda cool a little fluffy piece , but nice to see manufactures are trying!
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/moto...cid=spartandhp

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