rear shock

[SVRACER01]

im looking for some feedback from people that have put on aftermarket rear suspension. im looking at changing out the rear shock on my race bike, but with many options im confused on what i should get. i dont totally "get" all the lingo with 2,3, and 4 way adjustability from companies and what i would better off getting. the 3 major companies im looking at are Elka, Penske, and Ohlins. ive heard from some SV owners that Penske is the way to go. but how do you say that its better than someone like Ohlins?
at anywhere from $550-$1300 this will be the LARGEST purchase and upgrade for this bike. so you can understand my hesitance with just buying something. ive had some experience on the track with Elka and it was nice but im comparing it to stock SV shit.

all input would be great...especially from racers. ive got this idea in my head that something with least amount of levers to pull and knobs to twist will be in my best interest because im afraid ill fiddle with it and fuck it up.

[Awesome]

two way adjustable would be more than enough. You don't need high and low speed DAMPING adjustments. Should I asume that a 4-way is high, mid, and low? I don't know, I've never heard of a four way, except that time you, pete, and manda pants tried to slip me roofies. Anyways.....two way is fine. I got mine off the WERA board for just over $300 I think, fresh out of the box and riden for one weekend, then the guy knocked up his wife....wonder if it was at the racetrack? You see the risks us racers take on and off the track?

[GMAN226]

I would call Peter, anything you do to SV suspension will improve it 100%. Do the forks too the shock will help but doing both will be much better..

Later
G-man

[RandyO]

I am leaing towards something from Works Performance



UltraSport
5-Way adjustable shock

5-Way adjustable UltraSport shocks for high performance street and racing bikes. Adjustable for ride-height, Threaded pre-load (Tpl), rebound and high and low speed compression damping.

Available for late-model street machines including Aprilia, Ducati, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, Triumph, Yamaha and others.

[gmdboston]

I won't sell Works Performance, to date there products are not up for demands of modern sportbikes. Maybe that will change later, but right now I wouldn't take one for free. In many cases the stock shock has better damping control. With Ohlins, Penske or Elka you won't go wrong. I sell all three brands, though a lot more of the Penske and Ohlins.

Make sure you get one with a ride height adjuster, some of lower priced Ohlins don't have this feature and it is one you don't to be with out.

The "Two-way vs Three-way" thing is real simple. The manufactuers are counting the number of damping adjustments. Two way adjustable has one compression, and one rebound adjustment, both low speed. (Speed here refers to shock shaft speed as in "bump" and "squat" movements) Triple adjustable or Three-way have both high and loew speed compression adjustments, and one low speed rebound adjustments. There is a lot more than the number of adjustments that differ here. On the triple adjustables the damping control is more prescise and less prone to fade. You also get more range of adjustment and more control over the range.

All good shocks come with spring preload (Ohlins has a remote option), and length (or ride height) adjustment. Penske retails for $795 for the 8981 (Two-way) and $1170 for the 8987 (Triple Adjustable) Ohlins start at $755 and go to $1155. You, of course, get the NESR Discount of 10%.

DO NOT GET A STOCK GSXR SHOCK!!!!!! This a waste of time and money. Yes, it will fit....Yes, you can respring it....yes, you can revalve it....No it does not have a length adjusment....No, it's not the right length.....Yes, you will be at 75% of the cost of a new Penske. Fitting the wrong shock in a bike is also dangerous. This one of the great lies of the internet spread by know nothing f@*kwiths working out of their unheated garages, installing finely engineered suspension components with tire irons and bench grinders.......but I'm not bitter. Seriously, by the time you make it fit and work properly you could put in some over time and buy a new shock that fits and works correctly. (The other good one is the CBR 900 shock in Hawk....too short and 25% too soft on the spring and damping so it starts too low and gets lower as you ride...."but it has adjusters, and I got it for free out of the scrap yard!!!!!")

.....and a special thanks to gman226 for getting my new dell laptop working so now I can post from home where I can take the time to answer all your question in full, instead of teh cliff notes versions of the past several years!

Now if I can just figure out how to get this BBS to spell check, I'll be all set.......

[GMAN226]

No problem Peter, download the google tool bar. There is a spell check in there.

G-man

[Currently]

Pete also forgot to mention cutting into the battery box to make the onboard reservoir of the gixxer shocks fit ... plus you got to buy a thinner and smaller battery to make room.

Getting a Penske or Elka is painful to the wallet but if you are going to do the job, do it right the first time.

Save your stock shock, when and if you ever sell the bike, you can get some money back by selling the Penske. Time to install a shock on the SV, less than half an hour if you know what you are doing.

[richw]

I know nothing

sent stock shocke to lindeman in California

asked me my bike and weight

6 weeks later came back for 375 with new spring and old spring

I was happy but like I said I know nothing

[Tabby]

Pete, can a ride height adjuster be retrofitted to an older Ohlins shock? Say like, the one in my 86 GSX-R750.

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by richw
I know nothing

sent stock shocke to lindeman in California

asked me my bike and weight

6 weeks later came back for 375 with new spring and old spring

I was happy but like I said I know nothing

You could likely have found a used Penske on ebay for around $500. And six weeks turn around seems very long....

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by Tabby
Pete, can a ride height adjuster be retrofitted to an older Ohlins shock? Say like, the one in my 86 GSX-R750.

Nope, it would cost more for parts than a new Penske and if ohlins does not have part numbers for that app. you're screwed. One of the draw backs to Ohlins is a lack of documentation and tech support. For spring rates, valving, seals etc. they do fine. If you want to put a square peg in a round hole you're out of luck...btw Fox is much worse, so bad in fact I stopped selling them years ago.

[RandyO]

Originally posted by gmdboston
I won't sell Works Performance, to date there products are not up for demands of modern sportbikes. Maybe that will change later, but right now I wouldn't take one for free. In many cases the stock shock has better damping control.

Peter,

I'm not looking to turn my SV into a track bike, the stock SV suspension is adequate for street riding I haven't found the deficiencies severe, the front dives on hard braking, so what.

where I find the SV suspension lacking is on my gravel road, fire trail riding. and of course, winter riding, frost heaves on my street grew 2" yesterday alone, due to the wet year, this may be the worse frost heave season ever

I reason I have looked towad Works Performance is that they are more dirtbike oriented

I have also spoken with the local's to me, Factory Connection, they have quoted me a price on a WhitePower shock for the rear, but haven't got back to me yet on fork work

[bump909]

white power!

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by RandyO
Peter,

I'm not looking to turn my SV into a track bike, the stock SV suspension is adequate for street riding I haven't found the deficiencies severe, the front dives on hard braking, so what.

where I find the SV suspension lacking is on my gravel road, fire trail riding. and of course, winter riding, frost heaves on my street grew 2" yesterday alone, due to the wet year, this may be the worse frost heave season ever

I reason I have looked towad Works Performance is that they are more dirtbike oriented

I have also spoken with the local's to me, Factory Connection, they have quoted me a price on a WhitePower shock for the rear, but haven't got back to me yet on fork work

You're asking too much of the SV. It was never designed to be ridden off road. I can set up the forks to be much, much better, but it will never be and XR 400. Your cost on the fork work would be $505 parts and labor. As for the shock, we don't call them Doesn't Works Performance for nothing. If you want I can get you a Penske with extra travel and set up for a more off road ride for $715.

[oreo_n2]

Or... Randyo... you could buy my XR400 and go to town on those backroads! Its almost as loud as your SV, but i am not so sure i could see you kick starting that beyotch!

[richw]

The Lindeman was a winter over rebuild so I told him no rush.

He does a lot of Cali track guys and I think a regular
turn around would be like 2 to 3 weeks.

www.le-suspension.com


I now know less then before


I do find it histerical when I see the prices of shit like
Ohlins

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by richw
I now know less then before


I do find it histerical when I see the prices of shit like
Ohlins

If you under stood how much engineering, development time and the costs of manufacturing small runs of parts you wouldn't fing it so funny. Ohlins and Penske charge a fair price for what you get. If they could make tens of thousands of shocks instaed of hundreds the pricing woud come down. I make the spanner tools for Penske, and my friend's machine shop makes most of the peices for thte motorcycle and F1 shocks, I think you would be very suprised to finf out hom few they actually sell each year.

[RandyO]

Originally posted by gmdboston
You're asking too much of the SV. It was never designed to be ridden off road. I can set up the forks to be much, much better, but it will never be and XR 400. Your cost on the fork work would be $505 parts and labor. As for the shock, we don't call them Doesn't Works Performance for nothing. If you want I can get you a Penske with extra travel and set up for a more off road ride for $715.

nor was the SV designed to be a race bike, but it's used for one enuf, the SV is just a cheap all around do what you want to do with it bargain bike it does nothing exceptionally but everything competently, the nekid SV makes a fine bike for riding gravel roads, fire trails and the like

comfort is a big part of peerformance that I am looking for

[benVFR]

Originally posted by gmdboston
You're asking too much of the SV. It was never designed to be ridden off road. I can set up the forks to be much, much better, but it will never be and XR 400. Your cost on the fork work would be $505 parts and labor. As for the shock, we don't call them Doesn't Works Performance for nothing. If you want I can get you a Penske with extra travel and set up for a more off road ride for $715.

Please tell me dealing with frost heaves and rough pavement is not asking too much.

I am not going to really be expecting anything of my VFR in terms of fire roads and it definitely isn't going to be doing any off-roading, but I would certainly hope you could fix it up to deal with frost heaves. (My understanding is it has too much high speed damping)

If/When my stock suspension starts to feel shagged out I was probably going to ask you what you could do with the bike.. please tell me you can make the bikes handle our rough roads better the stock without saying we should all get dirt bikes or adventure-tourers, etc..

edit: regarding prices they are not bad... You can spend $2000 for a sick set of forks + shock for a mountain bike. And that is a much bigger market then sportbikes if I understand correctly.

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by RandyO
nor was the SV designed to be a race bike, but it's used for one enuf, the SV is just a cheap all around do what you want to do with it bargain bike it does nothing exceptionally but everything competently, the nekid SV makes a fine bike for riding gravel roads, fire trails and the like

comfort is a big part of peerformance that I am looking for

The SV fork just barely has enough stroke for that even, My data has shown that most sportbikes need 120-125mm on the track and the SV has 110, as do many of the KYB forks. Its one of the reasons that the KYB's are reguarded as stiff or harsh. If you make them firm enough so you don't bottom hard they're stiff, if you run them soft, they bottom hard. You're right about the SV being a great all arounder, but when the whole bike retails for $6500 how much can a manufacturer spend on suspension?

I can make the stock suspension components work as good as they can, but no one can make a street bike fork suck up a 2", square edge frost heave like it running over a pencil. I give a money back guarantee on all my work, so there is no risk in trying, just don't expect more that any one can deliver. We are limited by the design parmeters of the machine.

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by benVFR
Please tell me dealing with frost heaves and rough pavement is not asking too much.

I am not going to really be expecting anything of my VFR in terms of fire roads and it definitely isn't going to be doing any off-roading, but I would certainly hope you could fix it up to deal with frost heaves. (My understanding is it has too much high speed damping)

If/When my stock suspension starts to feel shagged out I was probably going to ask you what you could do with the bike.. please tell me you can make the bikes handle our rough roads better the stock without saying we should all get dirt bikes or adventure-tourers, etc..

edit: regarding prices they are not bad... You can spend $2000 for a sick set of forks + shock for a mountain bike. And that is a much bigger market then sportbikes if I understand correctly.

I can definately make it way better. I have set up suspension for many VFR customers, but like the reply above, don't expect more than what I can humanly do. If you think you can hit a 2" sqaure edge frost heave at a 45 deg. angle and not have the bars ripped out of your hands, you'll be very disapointed. If you fing a company that says they can, talk to the tech dept, not sales. If you find some one that can do it, let me know, I'll send them my suspension.......

[benVFR]

I don't need to be able to hit a 2" frost heave at a 45 degree angle at knee-dragging lean angles...

Just a question of whether or not the harshness of a frost heave can be tuned out. It's a street bike.

I think what Randy and I are getting at is just being able to ride over bumps like that without getting tossed out of the seat and/or really getting pounded over a long day. NOT being able to haul ass over that kind of pavement.

I'm pretty much cool with how my suspension works.. except for those frost heaves.. even if I'm just riding up Rt. 89 to VT and the bike is not leaned over at all the suspension has a really hard time dealing with the frost heaves.

I have not rode a Tiger, 1200GS, Multistrada, etc.. enough to really know how they handle on a rough road, but if they can deal with the frost heaves and there is no way to get my bike to, I will eventually end up on a bike in that class.

[gmdboston]

Originally posted by benVFR
I don't need to be able to hit a 2" frost heave at a 45 degree angle at knee-dragging lean angles...

Just a question of whether or not the harshness of a frost heave can be tuned out. It's a street bike.

I think what Randy and I are getting at is just being able to ride over bumps like that without getting tossed out of the seat and/or really getting pounded over a long day. NOT being able to haul ass over that kind of pavement.

I'm pretty much cool with how my suspension works.. except for those frost heaves.. even if I'm just riding up Rt. 89 to VT and the bike is not leaned over at all the suspension has a really hard time dealing with the frost heaves.

I meant with the frost heave at 45 deg, not lean angle, but yes, I can absolutely make the suspension 100 times better. You just can't make the frost heaves go away. The bigger the bump the more you'll feel it. The stock shocks on most bikes are not worth revalving though. There are some I'll do, but not many. Both the SV and the VFR should be replaced. Both of the forks repond well to revalving and proper spring rates. How about you both send them in and I'll give you both 15% off the fork Work?

[benVFR]

Thanks.. gotta check the budget and it depends on the price but if Randy is interested I'm definitely interested.

I had originally wanted to wait till the bike needed routine suspension maintenance anyway but if the price is right I'm sure I'd thoroughly enjoy having the work done.

Ben

[richw]

Lower tire pressure 3 to 4 psi

not to ding the rims