Sat..Riding to a CX(bicycle) race

[Pearldog]

I know that there are a couple of rides this weekend but ...I'm riding from Wellesley to Worcester on Saturday to watch a CX race. For those who don't know CX..it is a mix of road and mtb bicycle racing on a short course. Very cool to watch but you really suffer when you race. I'm planning on taking back roads up and back....Any interest?

I'm using the CX race as my excuse to ride hence the backroads...


Pearldog

[benVFR]

It ought to be amusing. I'd like to try it sometime but I really don't need a 3rd bicycle.

Ben

[Pearldog]

Everyone needs another 2 wheeled object..just consider the CX as another arrow in your quiver or U can always turn a road or MTB into a CX bike.

Have you ever been to a CX race? Generally the best cycling event to watch (aside from some of the big euro road races). It's a mix between F1, NASCAR and steeplechase. Since you are into racing you should check this out sometime...a lot of road and mtb racers do this in the off-season.

Wanna go?

Elite Women @ 1, Elite Men @ 3

[benVFR]

Maybe next year after I pay off my car and motorcycle.

I'm pretty sure I have other plans saturday although it would definitely be amusing to go watch the race so I will keep it in mind.

Ben

[Pearldog]

Cool..I will be taking off around 10..arrive by 12:30 and depart around 2ish...roughly

[KevinB]

Your talking cyclocross, 45 minutes of hell on a bicycle. If you really, I mean rally like to suffer you found your sport. I raced road and MTB for years, and nothing compares to it. I raced cross for season,in the B group, I sucked at it. It is very intense, and poor technique will cost you a ton of time each lap. The race courses are set up with barriers that force you to run with the bike,usually four or five times a lap. MTB do alright on muddy and snowy days, but most guys run purpose built road style bikes. Matter of fact I got a nice hardly ridden dust covered Litespeed CX bike hanging in basement.
Should be a great race with $3K up for grabs in the Elite races, that should hopefully draw of the top national riders and make for some great racing. If the weathers OK, I probably head up there by car, probably take the dog along.

KevinB

[Pearldog]

CX is insane...I've raced and promoted road,MTB and CX events and the hardest effort and the biggest cheers are during a CX race..

If you still follow the cycling scene...Gully is in town, Wells,etc. and rurmor has it that Pontoni is showing up...as for the ladies....Gina plus a host of others.

KevinB...so you were part of the KILLER B's...which race or races did you do?

If you go..I will be on the blue SV..walking around in my gear.

[KevinB]

I raced for Union Cycle in Attleboro, how about out you?Boston Road Club. Its got to be three years ago,maybe four since I raced seriously. Devens, Umass, Plymouth, Middleboro, that one they do the bike swap at and also Lincoln CX training series. I started racing on the road back in 1990 then switched over to racing MTB. I seemed to do it for a couple of seasons then take a season or two off, starting to get the itch again. Its a love hate thing, you love it if your in shape and hate it when your sucking wind. Looking to start racing MTB in the 35+ group in another season before I totally throw in the towel.
I'll have my German Shepard and girlfriend with me, is Mark McCormack racing cross this season?

Kevin Boyd

[Pearldog]

No..I'm not really with any club. I am the promoter of the SuperCup Series and work with some pro riders on their contracts,endorsements,etc. so I jump in now and then...but I suck wind all the time. I usually do 1 road race,1 mtb,1 cx, 1 tri each year...but I'm usually in the back of the bus...not enough time to train

Yes..Mark is racing but he has been in Japan. I do not know if he is back..btw..he's got a bike...I think it is NightHawk but I'm blanking.

Also...Travis Brown rides a Duc and Tim Johnson has an old BMW.

The one with the swap is Palmer...if you want a good one try Winding Trails in CT...Jan Bolland is the promoter.

Lyle

[KevinB]

I know of you, the Supercup was an awesome series, I was at one Devens a few times, thats what got me into it. I was at the one Pontoni (the little italian guy) rode away from the leaders like they were on a training ride. Promoting cycling events in US seems like its tough business. In my 15 years of cycling, its seems in my view to have gone downhill, at least in New England. During 88-91 the road races were held in citys downtown, not tucked away in industrial parks. Prize money is a thing the past for most races, especially in MTB.
I believe I saw Mark out riding in Norton last Wed or Thurs, you must know Butch Balzano(Pedros), great guy known him since I started riding with EBCC. He had a Duc ST2 or ST4. I thought Mark had a SV, he road it to the Providence Race one year, it was blue and naked. You need to take SV up to Loudon next season and have some real fun.

Kevin

[Pearldog]

I know Butch very well...the promotions biz is very small. Butch does a great job for Pedros..if you see him please tell him I say hi..

As for Mark...my road bike is a Hot Tubes (Toby Stanton). Hot Tubes is owned in part by Frank M..well like an idiot I let my seat post seize up and left it with Toby to fix..I also had him paint a bellypan and seat cowl for the SV (he hates to do stuff like that)..when I picked up the parts and bike Frank was there and started talking about bikes (I've known Frankie and Mark for a couple of years) so Frank told me about Mark's bike..I did drop Mark an email about it and I think he said it was a Hawk (but the one that looks like an SV).

Thanks for coming out to the races...we tried to put on a good event. Devens was a good event. Was that the one that Pontoni raced? Beer tent? And yes the promotions biz is hard...I'd be happy to give you the details sometime.

As for the bike...I'm thinking about some trackdays next year. I went to the STAR school this year and had a blast..2 days of riding around Loudon...and riding 2 up on the back of a Gixxer with Jason Pridemore.....Holy Shit!!

Now of course..as a promoter I'm like...hmmm motorcycles..what can I do here

[benVFR]

I did 3 criteriums this year, I did some EFTA X/C races in past years and I did Mt. Washington in 01. I got 3rd my final one (it was just the Well's Ave crit) which was totally cool. I'm sure I'll move out of Cat 5 next spring. I just can't decide if I'm going to join a team or something. If I manage to be in awesome shape and everything comes together I think I could maybe win the C race without being on a team, but forget it in the B race.

I would really like a new road bike so I can keep my Trek 2200 as a rainy day bike and keep the new bike in perfect shape without having to work on it so much. I've got about 10,000 miles on my Trek and it still works really well but it seems like I have to work at maintaining it more. I had to get the freewheel rebuilt this year. Plus it is so hard to go to a race and beat 90% of the guys who have $5k bikes. Even though you beat them you still want the nice shiny bike like they have.

I can see CX being nasty, especially if you're new at it. In any discipline if you lose your mental focus for a second it seems very easy to let your heart rate blow up. Being on a road bike in the dirt and then having to jump off and carry it over something would be exactly the kind of thing to break your concentration, and then you run over the obstacle way too fast and spike your HR.

I don't quite get it, what is the deal with the mountain bikes? Most of the course is non-technical so a road bike with knobbies is faster, and the obstacles are so extreme that the mountain bike can't ride over it?

I just see myself wanting a purpose built extreme road bike for racing, and a dual-suspension MTB before I would get a CX bike. (I have a Giant Iguana with a bunch of upgrades, nothing special, it has nice components now but it still has a fairly shitty fork.) And realistically I'm not going to be that insane with the bicycles unless I got rid of my motorcycle.

If you want it bad enough, you shouldn't be slowing down at 35. You can keep it up well into your 40s. I used to work with a guy who came in 5th in the 40-50 group at Mt. Washington when he was 41. Bicycling is by far his main thing and he rides probably 28 days out of a month, and he still hauls ass. He would easily keep up on a Cat 2/3 group ride around here, and drop people if there was a big enough climb.

Ben

[Pearldog]

Well..I have to chime in a bit.

If I were to have one bike..it would be a 'cross bike. It can do everything pretty darn well.

Most guys will ride a 'cross bike in the spring/fall on the road for training. The gearing is such that you really have to spin. As a commuter/rain bike..it is awesome..b/c of the canti brakes you can run wider tires. As a mt. bike..short story..

I was in VT with Tim Johnson (many years ago) at the Pedros festival. I was riding a FS GT and Tim rode a rigid CX bike..now I am not the fastest guy and Tim even at that age had talent..but OMG he was ripping down some of the nastiest single track and riding alot of climbs.

The point.. a CX covers all the bases. Would I race Wells Ave in May on a CX bike.?.nope. But I would certainly consider it for the first or last race of the season.

As for people riding MTB @ races...it really is just a way to get out and ride. In the Elite Cats (UCI rules) you must ride a cx bike..but for most of the others..a mtb w/skinny knobbieswill work pretty well.

I find that I actually ride my 'cross bike a great deal..a commuter, training rides, some mtb rides and certainly a coffee bike.

[KevinB]

Yes the beer tent, that would be the one. Neil Hall introduced me to Mark, don't know Frankie really.

KevinB

[KevinB]

Ben

As far as bikes go it comes down to the rider, $1500-2000 gets you plenty of bike these days. Training and racing will do more for your riding then spending $5K. Trust me I know, $3k for CX bike,$5K for road and $3K mountain. Wells is a great place to start racing, and early season training but remember the fast guys are at the races. Roadracing was never my strong point, it usually came down to the final corner and sprint to the line,lack of balls on my part (crashed a few times and just isn't worth it). I always did well MTB races and never really crashed that often or hard. CX just insanely painful experience, fine if your doing well but not fun if racing to keep the leaders from lapping you. As far slowing down at 35, comes down to time and $$$. I'm getting married and kids maybe a year two after that. My has goal has been to win Mt Snow in the sport class. Fifth is my best finish,in 2001 some dude from England won, 2nd and 3rd California, 4th was from NY. 2nd for local guys but still fifth. I also did Mt Washington in 01, rode in the low 1:20-24, Tim Johnson won like, 53 mins I believe.

KevinB

[Pearldog]

Kevin is right..

At some level and for some events..the type and quality of the bike can be a factor. That said..today's bikes in the 1k-3k range are as good as more expensive bikes. All you really get is lighter. An example would be Dura Ace v. Ultegra...Ultegra is just as good as Dura Ace but it is slightly heavier..but that means it's more durable. Sure..if you have $$ to burn get a DeRosa King or a Parlee but if you want/need to be frugal...Trek, Specialized,Cdale,etc. all make fantastic bikes in the mid-range. Watch for the SuperSale @ Wheelworks or go down into the basement area and look for older highend models...Ben..from some of your photos you look pretty tall..so you might be able to find a really good deal on an older model.

Everything else is up to the rider and the quality of your training. It really is not how much you train but rather the type of training you do...in fact if your bike is in decent shape spend the $$ on a HRM or even better a Power meter. These will force you to focus your training or at least tell you when you are being bad....

Wells Ave is a great training series (watch out for the last turn..been there) but consider it a training race..if you go early season before the Marblehead Race you are likely to see most of the local pros but as the season wears on...their racing season is in full swing.


Hey Kevin-that's great about Mt Snow...that is a tough course and the sport field has gotten very deep.

[benVFR]

I only did Well's in July and August. It's not like pros, etc.. are going to be in the beginner race anyway.

I was always scared to do crits, etc.. thinking they were crash fests but it isn't that bad.

Partly due to motorcycles and mountainbikes, I didn't feel terribly nervous. My handling was way better than a lot of the other people. A lot of people seem scared to haul ass through the corners. The few times I went off the front I usually tried to time it so I had the benefit of going through a corner right after I jumped. I actually crashed a lot when I did MTB races, I was a little too gung-ho. That was quite a while ago though, my MTB skills have gotten a lot better. Maybe I'll do it again next year. I actually really hate having to drive the car to the far away races though. From the sound of it I have no desire to do NORBA races either, it really sounds like they've degenerated into non-technical road races on dirt.

I know the bike doesn't make that much of a difference.. I just meant it gets awful tempting when you're surrounded by people dropping mad cash on their bikes.

Ben

[Pearldog]

Trust me..I know how you feel...

most of the people I ride with are on Carbon or Ti...I am one of the "steel is real" holdouts..that said always take pleasure in dropping their sorry asses on a climb or decent...

Wells is a great place to practice racing tactics,etc...I always tend to be the sucker who pulls down the backside. In fact we will ride over, race, ride home the long way..this is logged as training.

As for area races..check out www.ridezine.com and www.ne-bra.org.

As for NORBA...things are changing..back to grassroots. U already know about the EFTA races.

BTW..if your frame is good and fits U well...a short $$ fix is to get better wheels/tires and upgrade your gruppo. Better wheels will instantly make the bike better..less rolling weight,stiffer,etc. Mavic Kysrium SSC....

[benVFR]

Yah my road bike fits me perfectly. I'm almost reluctant to change, or I'll stick with another Trek with similar geometry.

I came really close to getting a trick set of wheels this summer. I have 2 sets for my mountain bike. I have 2 sets for my road bike as well but they are both pretty basic. The 2nd set is off my brother's Cannondale that he bought and never rode. When I f*cked up my freehub I borrowed his wheels and never gave them back.

I don't get a lot of the steel is real stuff... especially since they tend to be at least as expensive as trick Aluminum or CF frames.

Ben

[Pearldog]

"Steel is real" is an old school concept. First of all, it has been the traditonal and still favored material used to build bikes. The riding characteristics are such that bikes can be built that are comfortable,stable yet stiff for racing. Alu came onto the scene due to the fact that it is cheaper to build an ALU bike than a steel one. Remember..the top pros ride what they are told (to some degree). Plus the oversized Alu is really stiff. Ti and carbon and all of the other funky materials are still pretty expensive and the riding characterisitcs are different.

A quick example-

I ride w/ 2 guys..they each wanted to upgrade their bikes (both steel)..having ridden w/ both I knew what they would choose but kept my mouth shut. 1 guy likes to hammer and then he blows up..he is also looking to jump..the other guy is more long,hard ride. The first guy will like the feel of Alu..the 2nd guy will like the feel of steel (keeping in a 1k-2k range). Sure enough, we all went to Wheelworks and they each test rode several different bikes. The first guy bought a Cdale and the second guy bought a steel Lemond.

I can go on all day with this stuff

[Pearldog]

Follow up..

I have 4 bikes..2 are steel and 2 are ALu. My road bike and 'cross bike are steel and both MTBikes are ALu (although one is FS). For the road I like the feel of steel (although my next one will probably be a carbon). For MTbikes..I like Alu b/c it feels lighter and has a snap.

My 'cross bike is made out of Reynolds 853...this has similar characteristics as TI.