100th Loudon Classic

[Jim]

one and done is what the MA riders are used to....what's the difference if this is advertised as a pro race?

[Stoneman]

More good points...

[JettaJayGLS]

I always thought one and done was very reasonable. Always shocked that a person to blame for red flag can restart the race.

But I guess this gets tricky...if you weren't to blame but got taken out in the incident, I feel like you should be able to restart. But that would mean dishing out official blame in real time. I'm guessing thats why they don't have it set this way. Basically impossible at a local org without televised/recorded races that you can replay.

More I think about it, this would never be a viable option. Maybe a quick start procedure and you need to get through tech if you went down?

[OreoGaborio]

I'm sure there are plenty exceptions to this, but in most any decent racing organization that I can think of, if you crash and it doesn't cause a red, and you're able to rejoin you can... right?

Loudon is literally an enclosure in spots.... if you crash in 2 or 12, your bike is almost certainly bouncing back onto the line... that's an immediate red flag. And it's not the riders fault, that's the track designers fault.

[Not Sure]

Rough weather obviously can't be controlled but basic & consistent communication (through an e-board and / or over the PA) can be. Very poor job done in that area. With radios and phones there is zero reason for it.

[OreoGaborio]

The scoreboard and the PA are afterthoughts that are purely for the benefit of the spectators. They have no influence on how the race itself is run or scored.

At the end of the day, this was an event run by humans and participated in by humans. Mistakes were made, lessons were learned, but I guarantee you they did the best they could in that moment and there are precious few others who I would have rather had running this event.

All in all, they were dealt a SHIT SANDWICH and ate it with grace.

[Stoneman]

Okay, question on the score board: It runs absolutely flawlessly for NASCAR from what I'm told. Are the same people running it? While it had no outcome nor influence on the race it sure made it confusing. I mean, it was comical & all. But very confusing for the casual fan.

Although it was great to see the PA system actually working in the infield! Is that a new thing?

[Not Sure]

Fair (but maybe it shouldn't be an afterthought for fans????), and I guess my point is that the communication was awful, even from what I saw down on the track with riders and crews. Just seems like there has to be a better way for people to know what is going on.

[OreoGaborio]

If memory serves me correctly, the official that I hung out with that night is responsible (in part) for running the scoreboard. There was so much other shit on that persons plate that took priority that the scoreboard was put on the backburner. It's not their only responsibility in that control tower and there were a lot more important things for everyone up there to sort out first.

In fact.... they were at one time in the not so distance past, and maybe still are, an active member here... Maybe they'll chime in to shed some more insightful light on the situation.

NASCAR has WORLDS more staff at their disposal to make sure everything runs smoothly. NEMRR is working with less than a skeleton crew in comparison.

I'm fortunate enough to say that a good number of NEMRR are personal friends of mine... and believe me when I say they're NOT THERE for the money! They work their ASSES off and they're there because they CARE. They do their best week in and week out... sometimes it doesn't go to plan, and when it doesn't, they face the nastiest shit and take it in stride. This was quite literally, in all probability, the best outcome anyone could have wished for given the weather and crash situation. I have zero doubt in my mind that they did the absolute best they could with the hand that they were dealt and they never gave up trying.

[Gecko]

The underlying cause seems to be that NHMS just isn't suited to safely hold a rain event.

I keep reading this in many places, and I really find it objectionable. People seem to conflated the lack of safety with rain conditions on our track at NHMS. No. As Paul said just below your post, "The track IS [safely] racable in the rain." Paul can correct me if I am wrong, but I think inserting the word "safely" before the word "racable" is in the realm of what he meant.

"Safe" can mean a lot of things to different people. To a newbie, "safe" likely means that his body and his bike are never supposed to touch the ground. To a racer, "safe" means something entirely different. "Safe" to a racer means I'm not likely to need a fast ambulance, or life-flight, ride to Concord to save my life or limb. I humbly submit that, in the rain, NHMS is not unsafe. Are you more likely to crash in the rain at NHMS, probably. Is the crash going to mangle your bike more than had you crashed in the dry, no. In the rain, you and the bike just slide for a bit. No grinding of parts or leathers. Plus, in rain conditions, the speeds are reduced substantially. While they still sucked, my safest crashes have happened in the rain. I believe all the crashes in the Classic, while they sucked for each rider, they were pretty much "safe" (with, I think, Tyler S. being the only person who needed to go for a ride because of his shoulder?).

As I've said elsewhere, most of the MA guys that I or others talked to seemed to like the track. Maybe they were just being respectful to our home track. Some said it reminded them of other smaller tracks they really enjoyed (one being Richie E.). They said it was fun and challenging. Others were candid and said when they first got on it (in the dry) they hated it, but then as they did more laps, and kind of figured it out, they started to really enjoy and like the track. They were really positive. Not one comment that it was too “sketchy” or way “too dangerous to ever come back.”

I guess my naive hope is that this is will be the takeaway from this Classic event. Notwithstanding the issues with the NEMRR race direction, the track is better/safer now than back when Mladdin said “its way too dangerous to ever go back there again too race.” The track continues to make improvements, and *should* continue to improve. To let a comment made over 20+ years ago define what the track is today isn’t just, fair, or accurate.
.

[jimmycapp]

I'm glad they opened the T3 pass through more. I know it's not ideal to go through there, but braking hard into that corner facing tires/air fence is kind of sketchy.

[Gecko]

. . . the only way to guarantee that the race runs to the finish is to make the rules such that if you crash and or cause a red flag, you are out. Period.

Paul, I couldn't agree with you more . . . and, in fact, that's what I *thought* the rule was . . . until it wasn't anymore. Just like the new'ish rule that says the Classic cannot end on a red flag . . . that's what I *thought* the rule was . . . until it wasn't anymore.
.

[JettaJayGLS]

I haven't raced in over 10 years and ridden NHMS in like 7 or 8, so I gladly defer to your view and Paul's view on what is safe. And maybe I mispoke using the word safe...I think its equally as safe in wet/dry. To your point, you are still sliding the same places - one is slower speeds less friction, the other is higher speeds more friction. You could make a case its actually safer in the rain.

I think my point is that rain results in more crashes, and NHMS isn't conducive to handling lots of crashes. I think I could argue that more crashes = less safe, but I don't think thats important.

Looking back, I have been part of a red-flag and regridded. Someone ran over the T2 curb and stood the bike up. I had to hit the front brake hard enough to not hit them, which lifted the rear and when it came back down I highsided into the middle of the track. Got back up and restarted the race. Motards bounce well.

[Gecko]

I highsided . . . [g]ot back up and restarted the race. Motards bounce well.

Great, now for some reason I have that Winnie the Pooh song "The Wonderful Thing About Tiggers" going through my head ... except the word "Tiggers" is replace with "Motards":

The wonderful thing about Motards
Is Motards are wonderful things!
Their bottoms are made out of rubber
Their tops are made out of springs!
They're bouncy, trouncy, flouncy, pouncy
Fun, fun, fun, fun, fun!

But I digress ... let see, where were we ... oh, that's right, nuh-uh I'm right you're wrong.....

Its all good dude.
.

[OreoGaborio]

"but the unfortunate thing about motards is there's always more than one!!!!"

[csmutty]

Great, now for some reason I have that Winnie the Pooh song "The Wonderful Thing About Tiggers" going through my head ... except the word "Tiggers" is replace with "Motards":

The wonderful thing about Motards
Is Motards are wonderful things!
Their bottoms don't catch any oil!
Their valves have very stiff springs!
They're bouncy, trouncy, flouncy, pouncy
Fun, fun, fun, fun, fun!

But I digress ... let see, where were we ... oh, that's right, nuh-uh I'm right you're wrong.....

Its all good dude.
.

Fixed.

[tsorfas]

Tyler Scott banged our numerous 20s in the rain with no crash. First year ever at NHMS.
Eli clicked a 19.3 in the rain with no crashes.

NHMS iSnOt SaFe iN tHe RaIn…

[Paul_E_D]

Eli crashed. So did Scott...

Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

[butcher bergs]

Every time there is a rain race at NHMS, baby seals are murdered, an old lady get robbed and a kindergarten class is told Santa isn't real.


I mean, since we're freely saying dumb shit and all...

[MUZ720]

Every time there is a rain race at NHMS, baby seals are murdered, an old lady get robbed and a kindergarten class is told Santa isn't real.

You might be on to something.

[sdog30]

I wouldn't classify Loudon as being dangerous in the wet. Tricky and surprising are more like it.

I do agree surg Paul and thought I said it here, but I guess it was in the other thread. It's ridiculous to let people cause red flag after red flag without, at some point say that if you cause a red flag, you are out of the race.

[MUZ720]

With hindsight being what it is. there's a whole lot of things they could have done.
Why all the crashing who knows, but guys like Eric Wood don't crash a lot and for him to go down twice?
just was a weird day. still think the grid needed to be shortened as well as the laps cut. lapping started after 5 laps when they ran that many, so no gaps to clean up a crash. pay the guys who qualified in the back and run 20 guys less riders would give time to pick up the fallen. and you need to finish the race under green!

[sdog30]

Easy to play Monday morning quarterback. I think we all agree it's a damn shame how it turned out. I think the intentions were great. I don't see a $250k purse for next year.

[sdog30]

With hindsight being what it is. there's a whole lot of things they could have done.
Why all the crashing who knows, but guys like Eric Wood don't crash a lot and for him to go down twice?
just was a weird day. still think the grid needed to be shortened as well as the laps cut. lapping started after 5 laps when they ran that many, so no gaps to clear up a crash. pay the guys who qualified in the back and run 20 guys less riders would give time to pick up the fallen. and you need to finish the race under green!

I was surprised to see riders with slower times in the race. I thought there was a percentage cutoff?

[sdog30]

Also, disappointing nemrr couldn't get a deal with TV production to televise it, even on a smaller level. A dude live streaming from the pits with little info on the race and identifying the same riders wrong over and over again did not do it. Lol