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2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

  1. #401
    Posting Freak Philkinson's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    Damnit! Things were just getting interesting. I have serious doubts if Marc will ever be dominant again.
    I have my money on him winning another championship

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  2. #402

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by Philkinson View Post
    Marc is out of this weekends race. Concussion in training. Wtf
    this makes fantasy much more interesting with two rounds to go... a lot of guys have him on there team. Can the guy just stay on two wheels!!! jeezza

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  3. #403
    Lifer union's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_E_D View Post
    Damnit! Things were just getting interesting. I have serious doubts if Marc will ever be dominant again.
    Maybe not like before but I still think he can win another couple championships. He has already shown he can win races again. With the level of riding people have elevated to I don't really think you need to dominant to get the trophy. The wins are going to a lot of people each year and the podium seems to be ever changing. Last two years have shown that. Neither Mir or Quartararo dominated. They had good results throughout the year with some really shitty races. It's almost like nascar points racing.

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  4. #404
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    It seems like Honda is full bore on developing the Honda. I have a feeling they made zero progress and maybe even went backwards with a couple newbies trying to develop a bike that was designed around Marc. Say what you want about him, Cal was the only other person that could extract anything from that bike in recent years. One (of several) problems was that he couldn't save it off his elbow like Marc, so he crashed, way way way way more.

    I don't imagine it exists, but I would love to see what the championship would be if you gave Marc 0's for all the races he should have crashed, but saved it. Even ignoring all the potential injuries and lower qualifying positions that would have come with it.

    And to beat the dead horse, I think he'll be back to winning championship if he can start saving it off his elbow again. I think that's a combo of his physical and mental strength + bike development.

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  5. #405
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    The 22 Honda is going to be very different - https://motomatters.com/node/17976. Better for both Honda and MM to be ready for testing

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  6. #406
    Posting Freak Philkinson's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Man... anyone else following Marquez this odd Marquez injury? A few strange points.
    1.) He was declared unfit to ride on Tuesday from a "slight concussion".
    2.) He's already in doubt for next round.

    This is Marquez we're talking about... not Karel Abraham. What gives?

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  7. #407
    Soul Rider Paul_E_D's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by Philkinson View Post
    Man... anyone else following Marquez this odd Marquez injury? A few strange points.
    1.) He was declared unfit to ride on Tuesday from a "slight concussion".
    2.) He's already in doubt for next round.

    This is Marquez we're talking about... not Karel Abraham. What gives?
    Head injuries are really dicey, especially for these guys who have had multiple concussions. I think Marc has been incredibly unlucky, but is finally pretty much beat to hell.

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  8. #408
    Super Moderator OreoGaborio's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    If I were HRC, I'd be playing this one very much on the safe side. There's little to no benefit in putting him out there sooner than he should... and FAR more upside to playing it safe.

    Let the man heal.

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  9. #409
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    Last edited by OreoGaborio; 11-05-21 at 01:36 PM.
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  10. #410
    Posting Freak Philkinson's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Super excited when I saw this on Rins in FP1. I hope there's an option to watch the full race from this view. So sick

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  11. #411

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Cool shoulder cam.. interesting to see how much he uses the thumb rear brake.

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  12. #412

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Honda should just call it on MM and look ahead to next year . Head injuries are nothing to mess with.

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  13. #413
    Lifer union's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    What the fuck is with the shitty feeds lately? Never had an issue until the last couple rounds. Keeps pausing and dropping on me on both my pc and my firestick

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  14. #414
    Senior Member BMMCBR's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by union View Post
    What the fuck is with the shitty feeds lately? Never had an issue until the last couple rounds. Keeps pausing and dropping on me on both my pc and my firestick
    It was doing that to me during qualifying yesterday. Pausing every few minutes. Today was fine though. But I also didn't watch it live today.

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  15. #415
    Posting Freak Philkinson's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Seriously, Fuck Darryn Binder.

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  16. #416

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by Philkinson View Post
    Seriously, Fuck Darryn Binder.
    So you think he did it will intent? Don't disagree it was a bone head move not sure he was playing roller ball on purpose! Wonder what the Moto GP guys think? After all he will be sharing the tarmac with them next year!!

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  17. #417

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by BMMCBR View Post
    It was doing that to me during qualifying yesterday. Pausing every few minutes. Today was fine though. But I also didn't watch it live today.
    I had no issues with the feed Friday, Saturday or Sunday.

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  18. #418
    Posting Freak Philkinson's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    This just in.
    Marquez is done for 2021.
    "Marquez was then re-examined by doctors this past Monday which led to a ‘new episode of diplopia’ being found - diplopia is a result of double vision, the same issue Marquez faced in 2011 - thus leading to the Spaniard missing out this weekend."

    Rossi and Marc have raced for the last time... Who's career is over first? 🤷

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  19. #419
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by MUZ720 View Post
    Cool shoulder cam.. interesting to see how much he uses the thumb rear brake.
    If you're talking about the carbon fiber paddle below the handlebar, I'm almost 100% that was the rear ride height device as he only used it exiting corners that dumped into a long acceleration zone.

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  20. #420
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by Philkinson View Post
    Seriously, Fuck Darryn Binder.
    I looked at this incident a LOT... here's my take, (for what that's worth).

    The Timing: It can be shown that Binder committed to overtaking Garcia at almost EXACT the same moment that Acosta began overtaking Foggia. In my opinion, there's absolutely no way in hell the overtake that was about to happen in front of Binder between Acosta and Foggia would have been able to be seen, analyzed and accounted for in Binder's decision making process.

    The Acosta pass: The fact that Acosta was overtaking Foggia so deep on entry meant that both Acosta and Foggia would be on the brakes deeper into the corner than normal. Foggia was defending slightly, Accosta was entering even shallower, both hard on the brakes very deep into the turn... a classic block pass.

    Add to the fact that Foggia was positioning for a cut-back to take the position back, that meant Foggia was on the brakes even DEEPER, setting up for a very late apex and narrow exit.

    Therefore, I believe that Binder closed in on them way hotter than anyone could have reasonably predicted in his situation.


    The Binder pass: Binder's pass on Garcia was unquestionably ambitious, and it's obvious that he would have run the corner wide, but it's not as though he was completely out of control and it's not as if he was coming from wayyyyy back. He was close enough to make the attempt, it was the last lap, Garcia was almost certainly expecting something from Binder, just as Foggia was almost certainly expecting something from Acosta. You can see that Garcia and Foggia were both entering pretty far away from the curbing.


    The Decision: I'm okay with Dorna's ruling to disqualify him for irresponsible riding because Binder would have run wide and unfortunately he took out another rider in the process... but I also firmly believe that it was simply a racing incident.

    The Intent: In my opinion, Binder did not have any ill intent whatsoever going into that corner. No racer on that grid would have been oblivious to the points standings going into that penultimate race, and no racer in their right mind would want to torpedo anyone who's in the fight for a championship. NONE. Every lap leading up to that moment was intense and clean. Some passes were harsh, but fair... and it was probably the best Moto3 race we've seen so far this year. No one would have wanted to intentionally screw that up.


    Simon Crafar, who I've always considered to be very insightful, a straight shooter, and as far as I'm aware, well respected around the paddocks, had some pretty kind words post incident:

    "We all make big mistakes & spend the days after torturing ourselves. It's these hard times we learn from, not the good.
    It's also these times we get to see the true colors & class of the people around us.
    Please think about how you would like to be treated after your next f-up."
    https://twitter.com/simoncrafar/stat...rc=twsrc%5Etfw

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    Last edited by OreoGaborio; 11-09-21 at 04:39 PM.
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  21. #421

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by OreoGaborio View Post
    If you're talking about the carbon fiber paddle below the handlebar, I'm almost 100% that was the rear ride height device as he only used it exiting corners that dumped into a long acceleration zone.
    I thought that one of the announcers said it was a thumb brake? But I do remember it being used on corner exit,
    I was thinking he was using it to get the chassis settled down.. It makes more sense with your explanation... Never used a thumb rear brake would the location of it be on the clutch side or front brake side?

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  22. #422
    Super Moderator OreoGaborio's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    Quote Originally Posted by MUZ720 View Post
    Never used a thumb rear brake would the location of it be on the clutch side or front brake side?
    Yeah it's quite possible they said that, but the context in which he used it that wouldn't make much sense unless he was using it as supplemental wheelie/traction control?

    The location makes sense, a left thumb is a typical placement for it. But it all depends on the rider and whatever other controls they have. I believe some riders even run two levers on the left side, one for rear brake and one for the clutch? Can't confirm that though.

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  23. #423
    Super Moderator OreoGaborio's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    This article was pretty good and has a transcript of a lot of GP racers' ractions. (Pecco, Jack, Mir and others.

    https://www.crash.net/motogp/feature...r-foggia-clash

    Francesco Bagnaia: "I think that like in the car championship we need a super license, only if you are doing something [good] in your championship can you move up to the next level.

    "Today what we saw is the normality I think because we have seen a lot of crashes like this from him [Binder]. I know that it’s not correct to say it about another rider, but this rider next year will be with us and with MotoGP we are faster and I hope that will not happen."

    Joan Mir: "Difficult to say something. For sure, this rider [Binder] is not the first time that makes some manoeuvre like this one. What is so important is that now this type of manoeuvre you have to penalise. This is the most important thing. Penalise but I say not for the race, maybe one race out or something like this, or even more. Because if not, it will happen again something.

    "Hopefully today nothing happened [injury] to Foggia and Garcia. But [incidents like that] can happen, especially in Moto3. It’s always happening things like this when they are young. I don't know about the super license because normally this is something difficult, but it’s not a bad idea."

    Jack Miller: "What can I say? I did the same thing like Darryn."

    Francesco Bagnaia: "You were not doing the same things."

    Jack Miller: "Yes, I know, but mistakes can happen. Incidents happen, I think as you know. You speak about incidents and this and that. How many times we [Miller and Mir] have hit each other this year?

    Joan Mir: "But contact [not causing a crash]…

    Jack Miller: "Contact is one thing, I understand. There has to be a margin, for sure. I 100% agree. I think Moto3 and what happened today was not nice for all areas. For Foggia of course because he lost, but also for Pedro because I think it takes away from what he has done this season as a rookie, putting together the season that he has done.

    "I felt like he had a lot of margin towards the end of the race and this robbed him of the feeling of fighting really for his championship. It was a strange act today. These things can happen, but am I nervous or am I worried [about Binder in MotoGP next year]? I don't think so.

    "It’s a whole different kettle of fish. MotoGP is another level and I don't think we need to be worried about that because today Daz might need to check his eyesight because he went in there a lot quicker than he should have. But I think I can speak on behalf of everybody and say we all make mistakes. We have to wait and see how it is.

    Joan Mir: "I agree about what Jack said. It can be also a racing incident, something that can happen of course, but there is also something related and not everything is the fault of Darryn, I think.

    "The pressure Darryn has now is unbelievable because he has to show why he’s going to MotoGP next year. For sure, this pressure is something that is not helping him to take good decisions. Under pressure, we all make mistakes like this. For sure, I think that it’s not easy to manage a situation like this one.

    "But if you are a MotoGP rider or if you are racing in the world championship, you are supposed to do the right things in the right moment, and if you want to go to MotoGP you probably should also have the level and the capability of making the right choices.

    "Don’t you think that they gave two races suspension to Oncu, he [Binder] should have also received some suspension just to make him understand? Because it’s not the first time that he’s been doing this."

    Francesco Bagnaia: "I don't know. I’m lucky I'm not the FIM Stewards that decide this type of thing."

    Joan Mir: "In a normal situation, this action doesn’t deserve two races out [ban] because what happened today is a mistake that a rider can do. I don’t think that Darryn deserves this. Also, because it was deciding the championship in that moment, we are making it a bit bigger than what happened that was a mistake.

    "For sure, if we talk about safety, Darryn must be the [example] for the other riders so that it doesn't happen again. So, I think that he has to be penalised because if we are talking about being more strict about safety, it’s the first step to make the change, I think."

    Jack Miller: "It takes more than a Moto3 rider I think to make this mistake. I think everybody can make this mistake. Yes, Darryn is a bit wild or whatever, but like Joan said, and I can say from first-hand experience, the pressure of going from Moto3 to MotoGP directly and how much it puts on you and to be honest, he’s just scratching the surface of what’s to come when it comes to taking on that challenge. I can tell him first hand.

    "But we have seen the GOAT, Valentino Rossi, do the same mistake after nine world titles. So, everybody can do it. This is racing. Accidents happen. You need to understand that. Like Joan said, everybody is putting it on him because it’s the championship, but this happens week in, week out with Moto3.

    "Something needs to be done. Yes, Oncu, he got sent home for two weeks, for two races, but I don’t agree with that also because I don't think he was the main offender. I think there should have been a couple of them sent home, but that’s another story. If you look to Masia and Migno’s stories and stuff like that on social media, you will understand what is really happening in this lower category.

    "I don't think the age rule [being increased from 16 to 18 in 2023] is going to change it because a lot of the guys that are doing the mistakes are well over 18. It’s a matter of common sense and how much you respect the person you’re on track with.

    "I think Joan and I have a good relationship. At the end, he’s never knocked me off. We’ve rubbed, we’ve said our pieces but at the end I’m able to sit here and be friendly with him and be cordial. At the end of the day, it’s racing.

    "I understand his point of view because I’ve hit plenty of people in my life. So, I’m not going to sit there and batter him because I’ve made mistakes. We’ve all made mistakes. Mistakes happen. It’s life."

    Fabio Quartararo: "It's difficult, but you need to be really careful when two guys are playing for the championship, you always keep a little bit of margin. There was no margin there. But it's a shame that it finished like that, also on the last lap. But yeah, I don't really have a clear opinion about that. A big shame, but it's not the first time.

    "For me, more than the super licence, Deniz Öncü had two races penalty for what happened in Austin. OK, was a really scary crash, but it's also something similar. So I think they need to be really careful with Moto3."

    Valentino Rossi: "What happened in the race I think is not fair for Foggia, because to finish the championship like this is difficult.

    "I don’t know for the super license but I think have some riders like for example Binder that are always very, very, very aggressive and sometimes they make some mistakes like this and it's not fair for the others.

    "For me it's rider-by-rider more than a super license. For the super license I don’t know sincerely."

    Franco Morbidelli: "An unfortunate incident for Foggia. He didn't deserve that for sure, he deserved to fight for the championship until the end of the race. But Moto3 is a crazy category, there are some riders more crazy than others, and sometimes these silly things happen. I mean, last lap, normal Moto3 craziness. Which is not normal, but normal for Moto3.

    "[A super licence] might be a good thing, to step up to MotoGP you should have at least some kind of results or some kind of pedigree. That's for sure a good thought and a good point of view that I agree with. Why not?

    "But also sometimes, some riders that number-wise don't have a good pedigree or are not on top, can reach MotoGP and do well. We have to look at Fabio for example. He wasn't doing mint when he was in Moto3 and Moto2, and then he steps up to MotoGP and did very well.

    "So I wouldn't certainly say that Darryn would be the same rider he is now in Moto3 when he gets to MotoGP. I wouldn't give that for certain."

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    Last edited by OreoGaborio; 11-09-21 at 04:47 PM.
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  24. #424
    Lifer jimmycapp's Avatar
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    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    What a mess. They need all the testing they can get to figure out a completely new bike. https://the-race.com/motogp/honda-mo...z-eye-problem/

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  25. #425

    Re: 2021 MotoGP Discussion (Spoilers)

    No HRC bikes on the grid and now whos going to test?

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