Turn 9

[Ken C]

Engine braking happens whenever you are off the gas with the clutch out. So, everyone engine brakes to some degree. The time it takes to get the clutch in to downshift and to get back on the gas once the clutch is reengaged will produce engine braking. (If you don't use the clutch to downshift, then it's all engine braking).

I4 engines have very little engine braking, whereas big twins and singles (and even triples) have lots. It's the equivalent to rear wheel braking and can be every useful for settling the rear of the bike if done well.

[Pittenger5]

So, everyone engine brakes to some degree.

I agree, I was more refering to clutch completely out and on the brakes, I only do that in 3

[zx1012r]

I hope I didn't come off sounding condescending. That's kinda why I put the caveat about riding a EX and an SV. They are going to be MUCH different than other bikes through there. That area and turn 1 are my strong points.

The EX I can hold wide open through 8 (the bumps are a little freaky and do cause it to slide) in 5th gear. (It's an EX, how fast can that be?) When I approach 9 I get upright and do a (Eric's words) "Kill the Brakes" and grab a downshift and it gets all out of shape kinda swapping ends into 9 until it settles down. ( again, it's an EX, it does that in every corner). That inevitably sends me wide at the top of the hill and I gradually let the tires scrub off speed and try to pull it back to the curb.

The SV is close to topped out in 4th with stock 15/45 gearing. I definately don't get 8 right every lap so my brain tells my balls to tell my hand to back off the throttle a bit. Honestly the EX "feels" better through 8 because it is like a couch and just kinda handles those bumps better. The SV is definately affected more by the bumps, but that could be the increased speed. I definately do a "Kill the Brakes" on the SV but there is less time for that, probably because of the speed.

[zx1012r]

You will realize how much engine braking you rely on when you miss a downshift coming into a corner and get a false neutral. I have soiled a few pairs of underwear doing that!

[Paul_E_D]

I guess this shows that there's more than one way to skin a cat. 9 was/is definitely a strong point for me as well. On the EX I didn't brake at all! Just grabbed a downshift and went. the bike definitely swapped a bit going in there. On the 125, I could reel in anyone at Loudon in 9. I did the 1 finger graze just to get the downshift and tip it in. Then I cracked the gas and got on as much as half to 3/4 throttle down 9. I have had it step out on me near the tip in for 10.

I rolled off to tip it in 10 and fed it wide open before the bump. The whole bike would wind up and drift/wobble over the bump and beyond. It was the hairiest thing I've ever done on a bike.

[a13x]

Study

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CG5BZCAUdTg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ie84yXy6cNU


I don't brake so much into T9 as just let off the gas and coast her in there. I'm normally back on the throttle (maint) before the turn in cone. I do use the front brake on the way in but it's more to settle the front quickly as it turns in. It's a tricky spot because as soon as I initiate the left turn in I'm back on the gas to bring the front up and reduce chatter, at times using rear brake. I've actually been braking and throttling at the same time into T9 before... which is very odd... (motard thing)


PS: Seth, if you aren't in 4th gear on your CRF tapped out into 9 you are going too slow. I'm pretty certain I was in 5th gear into T9 when I raced JayRoots CRF. Top speeds from 7 to 9 are about the same as 2 to 3... (90-100mph'ish) you should be in the same gear accordingly.

[zx1012r]

Maybe I'm working too hard entering 9 then. I need on eof those Thursday practice days to try some stuff!

[a13x]

I guess this shows that there's more than one way to skin a cat. 9 was/is definitely a strong point for me as well. On the EX I didn't brake at all! Just grabbed a downshift and went. the bike definitely swapped a bit going in there. On the 125, I could reel in anyone at Loudon in 9. I did the 1 finger graze just to get the downshift and tip it in. Then I cracked the gas and got on as much as half to 3/4 throttle down 9. I have had it step out on me near the tip in for 10.

I rolled off to tip it in 10 and fed it wide open before the bump. The whole bike would wind up and drift/wobble over the bump and beyond. It was the hairiest thing I've ever done on a bike.

This sounds about how I ride 9 though not 3/4 throttle down/thru 9, as my motard has much more violent power than a EX. Then again I'm not going as fast thru 9 as I should be. I did scrape peg thru 9 on Saturday racing thou.. that's leaned over a bit.

[CEO]

Anyone have anything big-bike-specific to say? Mark, Paul, Alex... good tips and thanks. But anyone on big bike do differently?

I feel like I'm pretty good through the back on the tard but have been off pace on the R6 lately...

PS: Seth, if you aren't in 4th gear on your CRF tapped out into 9 you are going too slow. I'm pretty certain I was in 5th gear into T9 when I raced JayRoots CRF. Top speeds from 7 to 9 are about the same as 2 to 3... (90-100mph'ish) you should be in the same gear accordingly.

+1 I am slow and I shift into 5th on my CRF at the flip-over point of T7-T8 and am WOT until I roll off... bike almost tops out there and going into 3 as well.

[zx1012r]

This sounds about how I ride 9 though not 3/4 throttle down/thru 9, as my motard has much more violent power than a EX. Then again I'm not going as fast thru 9 as I should be. I did scrape peg thru 9 on Saturday racing thou.. that's leaned over a bit.

You wonder how it is even possible to drag a peg on a motard the way they are setup for roadracing. But watching Jeff and Doug Henry at the national years ago i was flagging in 11, and their pegs were literally folding up to the frame dragging, sparking all the way through there. (their legs were out dirt bike style).

Just for fun try leaning your bikes over in the garage until they hit their footpegs. That's a long way over!

[seth399]

well damn, I only carry 4th gear into 3 and into 9. I mentioned 3rd gear for when I fuck up and am in 3rd, I would hit the limiter.I don't think I've ever tried clicking into 5th into 9. I think it all starts with my slow entry into 6
I am always up peoples butts (not experts) out of 6 though

[Paul_E_D]

You wonder how it is even possible to drag a peg on a motard the way they are setup for roadracing. But watching Jeff and Doug Henry at the national years ago i was flagging in 11, and their pegs were literally folding up to the frame dragging, sparking all the way through there. (their legs were out dirt bike style).

Just for fun try leaning your bikes over in the garage until they hit their footpegs. That's a long way over!

I was out there taking a shower of molten titanium in the face following Doug. It was going down the neck of my leathers!

[TheIglu]

I love that video of Charlie on his EX. He moves quite a bit better than two years ago when I was racing him. Got some fast now!

[a13x]

You wonder how it is even possible to drag a peg on a motard the way they are setup for roadracing. But watching Jeff and Doug Henry at the national years ago i was flagging in 11, and their pegs were literally folding up to the frame dragging, sparking all the way through there. (their legs were out dirt bike style).

Just for fun try leaning your bikes over in the garage until they hit their footpegs. That's a long way over!

Yea, it's just silly to think about. Doug and his "Footdown" and Jeff "Kneedown" both dragging pegs into T1 spraying sparks was a unforgettable sight!.

I normally drag motard peg in T1, 11 sometimes, 12A (onto front straight), and 6 (thou six doesn't count, it's banked and easy there). T9 the other day was a first thou!

[zx1012r]

Yea, it's just silly to think about. Doug and his "Footdown" and Jeff "Kneedown" both dragging pegs into T1 spraying sparks was a unforgettable sight!.

I normally drag motard peg in T1, 11 sometimes, 12A (onto front straight), and 6 (thou six doesn't count, it's banked and easy there). T9 the other day was a first thou!

All right, that's getting me psyched out to try a motard!

[GixerJockey]

All right, that's getting me psyched out to try a motard!

Don't do it!!!!





(I rode Richie's and Denno's and havn't slept since... Anyone need a well cared for kidney? Never stunted or wheelied?)

[GixerJockey]

Alright... Dumb novice chiming in...


I was told "no brakes into 9". Was this just to get me comfortable with the speed that it takes to get through 9 effectively? I tried it and it worked. I used to grab a fist full of brake and lose all my momentum...

Now, I'm holding it WFO, in 4th, until just before the tree house, rolling off, tapping the front brakes and tossing it into 9. It seems to be working since I'm now very comfortable through there and seem to be making ground on the rest of the NV LW field through there.

[RyanNicholson]

I was told "no brakes into 9".

People tell new racers that basically just to get them to take their skirt off, you appear to be a prime example. A lot of people think "WHOAMYGODCORNER!" when they come around the tree house cuz you can't see all the way around T9, when in actuality you can haul ass through there.

[BMFR6]

Alright... Dumb novice chiming in...


I was told "no brakes into 9". Was this just to get me comfortable with the speed that it takes to get through 9 effectively? I tried it and it worked. I used to grab a fist full of brake and lose all my momentum...

Now, I'm holding it WFO, in 4th, until just before the tree house, rolling off, tapping the front brakes and tossing it into 9. It seems to be working since I'm now very comfortable through there and seem to be making ground on the rest of the NV LW field through there.

stop rolling off so early

[GixerJockey]

People tell new racers that basically just to get them to take their skirt off, you appear to be a prime example. A lot of people think "WHOAMYGODCORNER!" when they come around the tree house cuz you can't see all the way around T9, when in actuality you can haul ass through there.

Alright, so now that I've gotten well past WHOAMYGODCORNER, I can apply the rest of the great advise in this thread?

It never fails. Just when you think you've got a spot on the track alllll figured out...

[BMFR6]

Alright, so now that I've gotten well past WHOAMYGODCORNER, I can apply the rest of the great advise in this thread?

It never fails. Just when you think you've got a spot on the track alllll figured out...

you should be destroying your pucks past the treehouse.

[McBiggity]

you should be destroying your pucks past the treehouse.

[Pittenger5]

you should be destroying your pucks past the treehouse.

Are you for shizzling me? Im not even remotely close.

[eboos]

Are you for shizzling me? Im not even remotely close.

Word.

[Paul_E_D]

Absolutely. I needed a second puck placed above my normal one cause I was getting so far forward to keep the front planted at WOT over the rise at the treehouse. I was dragging my leathers on TOP of my knee.