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CCS Rule Updates for 2008

  1. #76
    Just Registered 13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Degsy View Post
    No, SMF did.
    derek
    Damn that SMF with his drunk emailing again. INTERVENTION!

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    One of the former LRRS #13's

    http://www.facebook.com/ChrisWatt762

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  2. #77
    Dic on
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Stupidhawk007 View Post
    Damn that SMF with his drunk emailing again. INTERVENTION!

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    "Too bad ponies are assholes."

    OXX

  3. #78
    Senior Member pasta-rocket's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    I have entered a stock SV, stock 1000ss, and a built 800ss in ulsb and have seen the same times out of all three. I think that if the sv's are of stock displacement it would be fair.

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  4. #79
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SVRACER01 View Post
    the only thing not legal about your suspension is the front end, im sure you could make a stock one work fine just as many do with the crappy sv front end. dont exs have 1 disc?
    Not sure if Ex's only have one disc (they may) but they only run against EX's, not SV's...

    Lets look at the lap times from October.

    The Fast guy on a Hawk is Gino with times of 1.19, with Matt Stone doing 1:20's and mere mortals like Scott and Chris do 1:22's

    With the SV's 1:14's are possible with mere mortals doing 1:18's for experts and 1:20's -1:21's for Ams.

    That is an easy second on the Hawks in BOTH classes.

    That would move Gino from 3rd in the Expert class that weekend down to like 9th in ULSB with the inclusion of the Expert SV's

    Chris the top AM Hawk would have been 6th in ULSB instead of 2nd with the inclusion of AM SV's

    Hell Oxx your race time finished 6 seconds faster in LWSB than Chris and his race time in ULSB.

    Just go and compare your times to Chris's last year. An SV will beat a Hawk anyday. Plus you make them SB spec and do 1:14's with Doucette on em the Fastest ANY Hawk has been around Loudon is what a 1:16?

    Again... I am glad I decided to go with the "Cheater" Duc 800. Maybe I will have a chance VS the SV's IF this is the way it runs at Loudon.

    Something tells me it will stay the way it is at Loudon though.

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    Last edited by Doc; 11-18-07 at 09:57 AM.
    "I'd rather ride a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow"
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  5. #80
    Goodbye Sweet Dreams BLACK SQUIRREL's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post

    Lets look at the lap times from October.

    The Fast guy on a Hawk is Gino with times of 1.19.... mere mortals like Scott and Chris do 1:22's

    With the SV's 1:14's are possible with mere mortals doing 1:18's for experts and 1:20's -1:21's far Ams.

    That is an easy second on the Hawks in BOTH classes.

    That would move Gino from 3rd in the Expert class that weekend down to like 9th in ULSB with the inclusion of the Expert SV's

    Chris the top AM Hawk would have been 6th in ULSB instead of 2nd with the inclusion of AM SV's

    Hell Oxx your race time finished 6 seconds faster in LWSB than Chris and his race time in ULSB.

    Just go and compare your times to Chris's last year. An SV will beat a Hawk anyday. Plus you make them SB spec and do 1:14's with Doucette on em the Fastest ANY Hawk has been around Loudon is what a 1:16?

    Again... I am glad I decided to go with the "Cheater" Duc 800. Maybe I will have a chance VS the SV's IF this is the way it runs at Loudon.

    Something tells me it will stay the way it is at Loudon though.


    Clean this up and send it to somebody your point is well made and correct me if I am wrong but mr Oxx #110 is down in the 1:19's on his stock motored SV?

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  6. #81
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose441 View Post
    Clean this up and send it to somebody your point is well made and correct me if I am wrong but mr Oxx #110 is down in the 1:19's on his stock motored SV?
    It isn't all about Hawks though, The Motards in ULSB should have issues here as well. You will be able to build an SV to 800cc!?! Even us Duc 800 guys should be up in arms.

    Again I can only speak from my LIMITED experience at NHIS. I have NO clue what is happening or will happen at other tracks with this change.

    Seems the SV's do well in LWSB at NHMS. Why move em?


    I see the irony too... how this is sounding like the Ptwins vs Duc 620 Argument.

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  7. #82
    Lifer Pittenger5's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    EXs only have one disk, but of course our FASTEST guy, BJ only hits 1:21s at his best (I think)

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    Zip Tie Alley #505

    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    My favorite was you going through T2 with your eyes closed.

  8. #83
    Lifer Kurlon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    I see the irony too... how this is sounding like the Ptwins vs Duc 620 Argument.
    Nah, the PTwins guys are just wierd, they argue anything. They don't want me bringing an UNDERPOWERED bike into the mix either?!

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  9. #84
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    I welcome competition when the playing field is sudo even.

    I think this is a typo
    Ultra-Light Superbike
    The other bikes in this class have come up while the level of the SV650 and Ninja 650s has been eclipsed by other machines in the Lightweight classes. This places 3 models with 70hp/350lbs
    What bikes are they talking about???
    What the hell are they talking about? It has either been a Ducati or a SV in the top 2 OF LWSB. I call BULLSHIT. SV's are not being 兎clipsed". Nice try. You are telling me that an SV is not running 14's. BULL SHIT. 14's are being reached by Ricky on a SV and Todd is running 16's and better. This is telling me the organization wants all SB classes to be within 2-3 seconds of each other. Except for the people I know in tech, they ask me what I am running on the HAWK. I tell them 19's and they are shocked that the HAWK will run 19's. The fastest a HAWK has run is 19.0 by Tom Barry. That's my goal for next year. I do not think I will see a HAWK run 14-16 any time unless it Jeff, Eric or anyone of that caliber. That will still be a feat.

    Conspiracy theory: Ducati is looking to have their own LW races.

    I have always considered ULSB an arena for the mutts of the motorcycle industry to play. EX 500, GS 500, TZR250 (Kevin), Aprilia 250, MZ Scorp, Duc Monster/SS 750, Honda CB-1, Tigcrafts, Hell even Harley-Davidson Sportsters, I even welcome Motards. Yes the Hawk is a 650 twin. No denying it. You can稚 compare 4 years of production and 20 year old technology to what is being produced today. Now I am all for stock SV's running in ULSB but then that would be LWSS.
    I smell something here. Conspiracy theory: Someone痴 pockets are getting greased to eliminate all other bikes from racing forcing us to buy Suz and Kawi. Is this also another way to force Motards from being competitive in ULSB as well. I want to hear from you traded people.

    Lightweight Classes
    Request: Allow 800cc non-desmo twins
    Action: Approved
    The addition of the BMW F800 fits well with the other bikes in this class, while allowing some of the bikes that have been outclassed in Hp by newer machines to build up to the current hp levels, IE Hawk GT, SV650, Ninja 650
    WHAT THE HELL IS THIS! It is noce to see the HAWK mentioned with this group. Unfortunately, the Hawk does not fit into this category, PEOPLE.

    FYI people. A HAWK can稚 compete with the SV and EX650 in HP in stock trim and when a hawk is built you are only talking maybe 70hp.

    OH BTW THERE IS NO CONTINGENCY PAYOUT FOR ULSB. So who wants to race it now?

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    Gino
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  10. #85
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    I heard that the BMW's and another bike are what they are worried aboout in LWSB... Does anyone run a BMW at Loudon?

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  11. #86
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Sent this to Eric.

    Sir,

    I just completed my first full year of racing in the LRRS series. With that said I may not hold a lot of weight in this matter but I feel I need to voice my opinion.

    I started on a 1988 Honda Hawk GT, I stumbled on the bike but I think it made a fine starter race bike at Loudon in Superbike trim. It is not competitive in any other class.

    My issue is the recent idea that is being batted about with SV650's's being allowed in ULSB. This sir I feel would be a mistake.

    The current ULSB Amateur Achiever in the LRRS series (And Amateur ULSB National champ) is Chris Watt with race times in the 11:26 range on a Hawk GT where as the Amateur LWSB acheiver in the LRRS series is Brian Oxx with race times in the 11:21 range on an SV650.

    The Fast Experts in LWSB on SV650's at Loudon are running 10:06 race times and the Fast Experts in ULSB 10:24's on Duc 800ss.

    As you can see there is a GLARING difference in machines and times. Could you please explain how allowing SV 650's in ULSB is going to make for better racing or more entries? I believe what you will make ULSB into is a Spec SV650 class.

    I am sure there is a difference at other tracks but if this is because of faster bikes eclipsing the SV in performance we do not see that at Loudon. Could you point me towards data from other tracks? Is there a plethora of bikes annihilating the SV's?

    Thank you for your time. I look forward to hearing back from you.

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    "I'd rather ride a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow"
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  12. #87
    Just Registered smf's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Stupidhawk007 View Post
    Damn that SMF with his drunk emailing again. INTERVENTION!
    it's not a problem it's a solution!

    ...and i emailed kelcher not wood

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  13. #88
    Animal Hill Super Motard Champion Johnny B's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Wood

    The CCS proposed change to ULSB (add the SV) is a surprise to us at the LRRS.
    We have many entrants that run the smaller bikes allowed in this class
    and they do not turn near the times that the SV classes do.
    The SV now runs and wins in Four classes. LWSS, LWSB, GTL, and
    Thunderbike. The SV is also entered in large numbers in LWGP and
    finishes at or near the front there. That is five classes that the SV
    has to compete in.

    I would think that if the LRRS adopted this change that it would hurt
    some of our riders and our program.

    If you or your friends ride this class, please send your feed-back to
    CCS.

    Jerry
    The email address that Doc supplied for Eric Kelcher is correct. Eric is also on the NEAR List, so he's privy to the ongoing discussion over there.

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  14. #89
    Just Registered 13's Avatar
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    Glad to hear that us hawkers aren't the only people suprised and disappointed at this proposed rule change.

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    One of the former LRRS #13's

    http://www.facebook.com/ChrisWatt762

    JT42

  15. #90
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    Sounds like it isn't gonna happen at NHMS.

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  16. #91
    Senior Member jtaylor719's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Stupidhawk007 View Post
    Glad to hear that us hawkers aren't the only people suprised and disappointed at this proposed rule change.
    Yeah, I'm really fired up about it...if they go through with it, I might be just a track day guy.
    Running even stock SVs in that class will ruin the reason I had so much fun last year. My bike won't even keep up with a stock SV on the straights.

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  17. #92
    Lifer GMAN226's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by nt650hawk View Post
    I welcome competition when the playing field is sudo even.

    I think this is a typo

    What bikes are they talking about???
    What the hell are they talking about? It has either been a Ducati or a SV in the top 2 OF LWSB. I call BULLSHIT. SV's are not being 兎clipsed". Nice try. You are telling me that an SV is not running 14's. BULL SHIT. 14's are being reached by Ricky on a SV and Todd is running 16's and better. This is telling me the organization wants all SB classes to be within 2-3 seconds of each other. Except for the people I know in tech, they ask me what I am running on the HAWK. I tell them 19's and they are shocked that the HAWK will run 19's. The fastest a HAWK has run is 19.0 by Tom Barry. That's my goal for next year. I do not think I will see a HAWK run 14-16 any time unless it Jeff, Eric or anyone of that caliber. That will still be a feat.

    Conspiracy theory: Ducati is looking to have their own LW races.

    I have always considered ULSB an arena for the mutts of the motorcycle industry to play. EX 500, GS 500, TZR250 (Kevin), Aprilia 250, MZ Scorp, Duc Monster/SS 750, Honda CB-1, Tigcrafts, Hell even Harley-Davidson Sportsters, I even welcome Motards. Yes the Hawk is a 650 twin. No denying it. You can稚 compare 4 years of production and 20 year old technology to what is being produced today. Now I am all for stock SV's running in ULSB but then that would be LWSS.
    I smell something here. Conspiracy theory: Someone痴 pockets are getting greased to eliminate all other bikes from racing forcing us to buy Suz and Kawi. Is this also another way to force Motards from being competitive in ULSB as well. I want to hear from you traded people.


    WHAT THE HELL IS THIS! It is noce to see the HAWK mentioned with this group. Unfortunately, the Hawk does not fit into this category, PEOPLE.

    FYI people. A HAWK can稚 compete with the SV and EX650 in HP in stock trim and when a hawk is built you are only talking maybe 70hp.

    OH BTW THERE IS NO CONTINGENCY PAYOUT FOR ULSB. So who wants to race it now?

    There was for '07.. Ducati paid every weekend and the championship..

    G-man

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    Gerard

  18. #93
    Lifer nt650hawk's Avatar
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    :

    Thanks for rubbing it in.

    I guess you will be sticking with the Duc... Maybe with more power.. Do I hear 15's

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    Gino
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  19. #94
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMAN226 View Post
    There was for '07.. Ducati paid every weekend and the championship..IF you have a NEW Duc

    G-man
    Fixed it for ya.

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  20. #95
    Lifer a13x's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nt650hawk View Post

    Conspiracy theory: Ducati is looking to have their own LW races.
    Incorrect.

    Heck, Ducati doesn't even make a LW 'racebike' anymore. Also, again, outside of LRRS about 10 people race Ducati Supersports.



    Great thread!

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    Boston --> San Diego

  21. #96
    Lifer a13x's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Fixed it for ya.
    Doc, all OEM's only pay Contingency for model year current and previous bikes. IE: 2007 and 2006 were eligible for 2007 race contingincy.

    Ducati actually pays back 3 years so quit your gooning!

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    Boston --> San Diego

  22. #97
    Lifer Pittenger5's Avatar
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    Wait, Kawasaki doesnt pay contingency on 16 year old ex500s? Christ, why am I racing Shitty McBikefest then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    My favorite was you going through T2 with your eyes closed.

  23. #98
    Just Registered Doc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by a13x View Post
    Doc, all OEM's only pay Contingency for model year current and previous bikes. IE: 2007 and 2006 were eligible for 2007 race contingincy.

    Ducati actually pays back 3 years so quit your gooning!
    Just beacuse I have a 92/99 hybrid.... doesn't matter as I am too slow anyway.

    I'm just saying... A duc is a duc... why do you have to be Mr. Moneybags and race a NEW bike to get ANY rewards

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    "I'd rather ride a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow"
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  24. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Just beacuse I have a 92/99 hybrid.... doesn't matter as I am too slow anyway.

    I'm just saying... A duc is a duc... why do you have to be Mr. Moneybags and race a NEW bike to get ANY rewards
    Little league games don't sell 100,000 pairs of Nikes, you want to give them pro salaries?

    You really need to grasp the concept 'CLUB racing'.

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    It's all water under the bridge, and we do enter the next round-robin. Am I wrong?

  25. #100
    Just Registered Crash Dummy Denno's Avatar
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    CCS Rule Updates for 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Just beacuse I have a 92/99 hybrid.... doesn't matter as I am too slow anyway.

    I'm just saying... A duc is a duc... why do you have to be Mr. Moneybags and race a NEW bike to get ANY rewards
    its to promote their new bikes that are being sold now i would think - why encourage people to never upgrade?

    but what do i know

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