The Loudon Novice Q&A

[DZircher]

Hopefully this will be used to exchange authentic questions that Novice racers have and unsolicited advice from more experienced racers.

[DZircher]

Rolling off vs. Braking
When entering a turn similar to turn 1, do you ever consider rolling off the throttle sufficient to transfer weight to the front? is this simply an indication that you're not going fast enough to warrant need to shed that much speed fpr the turn in?

It seems much more smooth and graceful to me that way. Is there a balance of engine roll off braking and light front brake application?

Thanks in advance,

-diz

While we're learning to really develop a race pace that doesn't leave us wanting for a little extra speed (maintainence throttle) while completing the apex

[union]

There is no real roll off. Should be on the gas until you need to brake. Of course its easier said then done. You should be applying brake as youre getting off the throttle. Pretty much trading one for the other.

[CBR929RE]

the only place I do a roll off like that without touching the brakes is entering 9. but that's more because I'm just not going through 8 fast enough to have to brake for 9. simply rolling off to maintenance throttle is enough. I need to go faster so I can give the brake a little grab there and compress the front end so it turns easier.

everywhere else its one motion of closing the throttle and grabbing the brake.

[tsorfas]

Ultimately you won't no coasting at all. I can tell you with my times I coast at 1,6,9,11 during the entire first weekend.
It ll take some time but the closer you get to jumping from gas to brake the faster you ll get. But don't force it you still need to be smooth and consistant.

Pfff listen to me talk like I'm fast.

[Kurlon]

It doesn't take long to transfer weight and set the front tire. Watch the experts some time, or slowmo replays of MotoGP, they look like they are slamming the front brake but if you look at the actual telemetry you can see it's a controlled transition from throttle WFO to closing the throttle while rolling the brake on to full brake. They're just able to do it much MUCH faster.

[OreoGaborio]

To put it simply: To go fast you need to try and exploit your tires as much as you can. Accelerating, braking or cornering... as much as posslbe, as hard as possible, as often as possible.


That means MINIMIZING the amount of time that you're using neither the gas or brakes, maybe even overlapping them a little when you can to smooth out the weight transition.

[Kurlon]

Yeah, see, it's the overlapping where I really fail. MSF has it drilled into me to brake straight up and down, so I coast from my tip in to apex point typically as a result rather than trail braking in. I'm starting to improve on that in 6 thanks to Eric's track walk but I'm still throwing away time.

[CEO]

the only place I do a roll off like that without touching the brakes is entering 9.

Note to self... pass Brett on entry to 9

(assuming you are even ahead of me... ever... )

love you brett

[OreoGaborio]

Yeah, see, it's the overlapping where I really fail. MSF has it drilled into me to brake straight up and down, so I coast from my tip in to apex point typically as a result rather than trail braking in. I'm starting to improve on that in 6 thanks to Eric's track walk but I'm still throwing away time.

Dude, you should be way beyond the MSF CYA BS by now.
Do you still do a head check, mirror check and signal before entering T1?

[union]

Dude, you should be way beyond the MSF CYA BS by now.
Do you still do a head check, mirror check and signal before entering T1?

Required turn signaling would be great. Penalty for those that got caught not using them.

[GingahNinjah]

Pretty sure i beep a horn/flash high beams in my head when im trying to get by someone... lol

[Awesome]

the only place I do a roll off like that without touching the brakes is entering 9. but that's more because I'm just not going through 8 fast enough to have to brake for 9. simply rolling off to maintenance throttle is enough. I need to go faster so I can give the brake a little grab there and compress the front end so it turns easier.

everywhere else its one motion of closing the throttle and grabbing the brake.

No brakes into 9 on any decent sport bike. Needed for a motard.

[CEO]

No brakes into 9 on any decent sport bike. Needed for a motard.

Pretty sure fast guys use brakes into 9 on any bike. It's just not extremely hard braking.

[Kurlon]

Dude, you should be way beyond the MSF CYA BS by now.
Do you still do a head check, mirror check and signal before entering T1?

Hand signal, and I tootle my horn melodiously to alert any horse riders to my presence as I approach intersections with the oval.

In all seriousness, that has been the one thing that's been hard to let go of. Part of it is due to my pitbike experience, the speed at which the front will wash when trying to trailbrake is MUCH faster than on a big bike so it just reinforced staying upright for braking. I used to catch myself starting to trail brake on the GS and Motard and would scold myself for doing so, now I know better but it's going to take time to break that habit.

[jayth]

Required turn signaling would be great. Penalty for those that got caught not using them.

Idk how many times I've "cancelled" my turn signal on track...force of habit lol

[GingahNinjah]

I have definately caught myself looking for the turn signal with my thumb... most notably going into 1, 3, and 10 lol

[csmutty]

No brakes into 9 on any decent sport bike. Needed for a motard.

BS. There is no way I could make t9 without braking.

[GingahNinjah]

BS. There is no way I could make t9 without braking.

Just dont try moving ur braking point forward into 9 smutty or u will end up out by the helipad lol

[CEO]

BS. There is no way I could make t9 without braking.

Agreed. On the R6 As I finish 8 I start applying the brakes as I pick up the bike and apply them all the way through standing the bike up and laying it down to the left on the entry to 9 and then trail them off as I get to full lean and then maintenance throttle... I'm sure you're doing something similar, just better than me haha

[TheIglu]

None of my bikes have ever been fast enough to need brakes in the entrance of 9. Well, other than the ZRX, but I'd need to jettison 200lbs each lap just to make turn 8 at speed, nevermind 9.

[csmutty]

Agreed. On the R6 As I finish 8 I start applying the brakes as I pick up the bike and apply them all the way through standing the bike up and laying it down to the left on the entry to 9 and then trail them off as I get to full lean and then maintenance throttle... I'm sure you're doing something similar, just better than me haha

I had to watch a video to see what I do there haha. Yeah that sounds like exactly what I am doing. I know I have to brake there because even with braking I pushed the front there consistently last round on entry.

[jerseygirl]

One of the best pieces of advice that I received when I started racing was you are either on the brakes or on the gas......never coasting. I think about this often when out on the track.

[Awesome]

Do I need to come back to Loudon? You guys aren't novices, I shouldn't have to tell you the brakes make you go slower.

[csmutty]

Do I need to come back to Loudon? You guys aren't novices, I shouldn't have to tell you the brakes make you go slower.

Do I need to put you into the wall again at PVIK?