race tire advice

[orion899]

after reading RRW's article on spec tires and the differences twixt moto gp and superbike I thought about my tires and what I thought was the lack of grip. I have Bridgestone slicks on an SV. I'm a slow am. ( 125s top ) Does anybody think Im not going fast enough to keep or get any heat in the tires? Any suggestions for other tires. Peter Kates originally set bike up for Michelin power race tires and I never changed anything.
Thanks

[lrrs313]

I'm guessing there's something amiss with the chassis setup (different ride height, etc) or your tires weren't set to the proper pressures. I ran B-stones last year on a motard and had no problem with a lack of grip -- turning low 24s/high 23s on a tired motor. What did you set your pressures at?

[Chippertheripper]

[OreoGaborio]

At 1:25's on an SV, it doesn't make a ton of difference what tire you're on or what tires your bike was tuned for. Does it make SOME difference? Absolutely! But what I'm getting at is finding the right combo won't magically drop you into the teens.

I'm not sure if your grip issues have anything to do with how much heat you're getting into the tire, air pressures or suspension settings w/o actually seeing/riding the bike.... but out of curiosity, how much are you paying for those slicks?

FWIW, I did 1:18's on Pirelli Diablo SC2's.

[PPS26]

and the tire debate begins!!!
-since i started ive used dunlops because thats what im given to use and i love them, guys go real fast on michelin and dunlops from what i see first hand you cant go wrong with either, ive never ridden on pirelli so i wont say good or bad guys on here have and im sure will chime in on it

[GixerJockey]

At 1:25 I'd venture to say that any race tire from any of the top 4 manufacturers are better than you are. I know they're better than I am at 1:24s.

I'd find it hard to believe that you're having grip issues with a top of the line slick, and blaming the tire. I'll go with others and guess that you're having an issue with set-up. tire pressures would be the first thing I'd look at. Even without warmers, those tires should be fairly well up to temperature within a couple laps.

[Scottg22]

after reading RRW's article on spec tires and the differences twixt moto gp and superbike I thought about my tires and what I thought was the lack of grip. I have Bridgestone slicks on an SV. I'm a slow am. ( 125s top ) Does anybody think Im not going fast enough to keep or get any heat in the tires? Any suggestions for other tires. Peter Kates originally set bike up for Michelin power race tires and I never changed anything.
Thanks

Its not the heat or lack there of... Its bike setup and you just need to get with Mike Matire or Peter and have them check things out and offer some advice to get your setup closer.

Some brands have a softer carcass than others... thus will give off a feeling mushing and move around a bit more than the other brands of tires.

I am sure Pete/Mike can get your comfortable with a few clicks and or ride height adjustments.

[orion899]

thanks for replies. bridgestone rep recommended 28f 26r
Pete set up bike albiet for Michelin power race think its much different?
as for blaming the tires I'm thinking I'm too slow to maintain much heat in them, they get cold, I fall down
Teens!!! I'd be thrilled with 24s
Just to let you know I started racing in my late 40s and after breaking bones in 07 and 08 and only 2 races last year just would like a full season for the same reasons that most of us do, waiting for that 1 board to go sideways
Cheers, Mike

[lrrs313]

thanks for replies. bridgestone rep recommended 28f 26r

Are you setting your pressures cold or hot? Bridgestone, unlike the other tires I've tried, gives you COLD pressure recommendations. That sounds about where I was running mine, but again for the B-stones you set the pressure before you plug in the warmers, not after.

But otherwise, definitely go see Pete or Mike cause something's not right. Those tires should be good for quite a bit faster before they even think about moving around, let alone sliding to the point of putting you on the ground.

[butcher bergs]

I'll take a different route than the rest and ask if you considered how your body positioning and rider inputs are affecting your scenario? Stiff on the bars perhaps? Overloading the front? Not being smooth with brake application?

These situations (and more) at any pace is going to cause the bike to handle in less than desireable ways.

Unless I know for a fact my bike has an issue I tend to look first at what I can improve on as far as my person communicating with the bike is concerned.

FWIW; when I was on a borrowed LW bike (Duc 800SS) for a weekend I was turning 25's on slicks during the first day I rode it and didn't have any grip issues that's why I'm suggesting you consider you look at what the rider is doing first.

[Fitz]

To Bergs' point, post some pictures of yourself on the track. Some of the more experienced guys may be able to critique.

Fitz

[Awesome]

It's not the rubber, it's not the amount of heat in them, it's not the chassis setup, it's not the bike, it's not the engine.

[Degsy]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8330/4.5.0.77 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/105)

It's not the rubber, it's not the amount of heat in them, it's not the chassis setup, it's not the bike, it's not the engine.

Lol.

[Degsy]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8330/4.5.0.77 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/105)

It's not the rubber, it's not the amount of heat in them, it's not the chassis setup, it's not the bike, it's not the engine.

Is it the air filter?

[nmendell]

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8330/4.5.0.77 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/105)



Is it the air filter?

I totally did not even THINK of that. This is what I have been overlooking all this time!

[Doc]

Go DOT's... you don't need slicks.

[csmutty]

Go DOT's... you don't need slicks.

[Manny]

Go DOT's... you don't need slicks.

When I did the polen school last year one of the things he talked a lot about at lunch was tires.

His view was more grip is always better, should be running slicks if you are doing track days and have a dedicated bike or wheels to keep em on, for sure if racing.

I agree, more grip is better, cost is a bit more, but I think worth it.

I know a lot of posts in this thread direct the OP to himself and not equipment, and I agree rider of course is the most important element, but you need to have confidence in your set up. If you feel like its not working for you tweak it. Confidence in the bike pays a huge impact on the mental aspect.

My opinion of course, to each their own.

[OreoGaborio]

Manny, you could argue it either way.

Yes, grip is good and I agree with that... But on the flip side, if all you run are top of the line tires, you'll be much less likely to learn how to listen to a tire when it starts to squirm until you're going really fast & then the consequences of your mistakes are a lot greater.

It's one of the reasons why riding in the rain is so incredibly educational.

[nerijusj]

Off topic, but what times can one run on street tires at Loudon?

[Doc]

My thought has always been learn with Dot's then move up to Slicks when you are faster.

I have yet to have an issue with traction with Dot's at my measly pace on my. 1:22-1:24

I will be going to slicks this year though.

[OreoGaborio]

Off topic, but what times can one run on street tires at Loudon?

Depends on what kinda street tires you're talking about. I believe KarayaOne said that someone did 1:18's on their Pilot Powers back when they first came out.

EDIT:

30 front, 28 rear is Loudon tire pressure.

Street Pilot Powers have done 17's at Loudon last fall.

[Doc]

Off topic, but what times can one run on street tires at Loudon?

What bike?

[nerijusj]

Bike-zx10r. Tires Pirelli DCIII's. My best was 25's. Thinking that I need dot's now..for next season trackdays?
Wow, 17's ? Was that JW or SG?

[Doc]

Bike-zx10r. Tires Pirelli DCIII's. My best was 25's. Thinking that I need dot's now..for next season trackdays?
Wow, 17's ? Was that JW or SG?

I did a 1:22 on a 65hp Hawk... On Dot's