Tire Life at the Track

[bostongixxer]

This issue was touched on in the TTD thread "yellow group video"...but I need more info. I'm running Pirelli Corsa IIIs on my gixxer. They were new in July when I had one good TTD. I then hit Penguin with them last Friday. Couldn't work the rookie race in my schedule and plan to hit it on 10/6. Between now and then, I'd like to hit a couple more track days...at least one. Not knowing how my tire life will be, and how the heat cycles work on these tires, I'm wondering if I'll have enough tire left to hit two track days (or one) and still do a race or two on 10/6. That would mean 3 to 4 track days in advance of 10/6. There is plenty of tread, but isn't it heat cycles over time that will affect grip? Thanks for any input.

[RyanNicholson]

thats a street tire right? (i dont know pirelli models) i dont think heat cycles are as big of a deal with street tires as they are with race rubber. For the track, maybe run these for the TD's....then maybe think about picking up a decent set of takeoffs before your rookie race?

the thing i always say about tires...they're like cheap insurance, they may cost you a little to get a new set, but its almost always cheaper than crashing because you ran them too long y'know?

as far as tire life in general....it really depends on your bike, riding style, suspension settings, lap times, track conditions, etc. some people go through multiple sets in a weekend, some people get away w/ one set for a full season...

[bostongixxer]

thats a street tire right? (i dont know pirelli models) i dont think heat cycles are as big of a deal with street tires as they are with race rubber. For the track, maybe run these for the TD's....then maybe think about picking up a decent set of takeoffs before your rookie race?

Thanks. That's what I'm thinking also, but I don't know enough about this subject. The Corsa IIIs are generally a street tire, designed for track days also.

[RyanNicholson]

getting the feel for tire wear is a learning process... just kinda go by ear and see how the tires feel....if they start to feel like they want to let go, its probably time to look into a new set.


are you planning on racing regularly next season?

[TTD]

Lap times are a big factor in tire wear.

Any idea what you are running? (from the Penguin day?)

[bostongixxer]

getting the feel for tire wear is a learning process... just kinda go by ear and see how the tires feel....if they start to feel like they want to let go, its probably time to look into a new set.


are you planning on racing regularly next season?

Not planning on racing regularly, unfortunately. I don't think that I can swing the time. Wife (who isn't a fan of motorcycles) and two young kids cut too far into my weekend.

[bostongixxer]

Lap times are a big factor in tire wear.

Any idea what you are running? (from the Penguin day?)

No idea, unfortunately. I ran the advanced group and was probably somewhere in the middle on pace. I was running better into the afternoon. Definitely running faster than when we were out in the blue group on 7/23 (I think that was the day). The break pads were not so good and I changed them for Penguin. Big difference.

[TTD]

So you're running fast Blue group times?

If so, then I think 4 trackdays worth is about the norm.

Naturally, you can't ride the same on the end of the 4th day as you do on the first day, but learning how to deal with worn tires is an important lesson.

[bostongixxer]

So you're running fast Blue group times?

If so, then I think 4 trackdays worth is about the norm.

Naturally, you can't ride the same on the end of the 4th day as you do on the first day, but learning how to deal with worn tires is an important lesson.

Ok...good point. I'll have to go by feel, but this info is a good guage. Thanks.

[RyanNicholson]

learning how to deal with worn tires is an important lesson.

and can be kinda of a fun one once you get used to your rear sliding around on ya and controlling it haha

[bostongixxer]

and can be kinda of a fun one once you get used to your rear sliding around on ya and controlling it haha

Someday I'll get to that point.

[TTD]

Also, as I posted in a couple of other threads, remember that YOU can cause slides just as easy as worn tires.

I was taking off tires after 2 or 3 events earlier in the year.

Figured out that I wasn't fully relaxed on the bars in some corners and was actually causing the slides.

[bostongixxer]

Also, as I posted in a couple of other threads, remember that YOU can cause slides just as easy as worn tires.

I was taking off tires after 2 or 3 events earlier in the year.

Figured out that I wasn't fully relaxed on the bars in some corners and was actually causing the slides.

Yes...Peter Kates talked a lot about that in the Penguin class. I try to keep that in mind (along with the 7 million other points he made) when I'm in a turn.

[OreoGaborio]

I've got the Diablo Supercorsa Pro's on my track day/street bike (basically the whole tire is equivilant to the edges of the Corsa III's) & i think they've got about 6 or 7 track days on them (purchased LAST SPRING believe it or not... did two days at VIR, a bunch of TTD's last year, plus a couple TTD's this year), plus a couple thousand street miles.... the tread is JUST into the wear bars on the rear, a little more meat up front but not much, yet I haven't felt any sliding from them.

I normally ride around 90-95% of my ability at track days though so despite the fact that I'm running blue group pace, there's just something about my riding style that's easy on my tires.

Hell, even the race tires on my EX500 have been on there since the 2005 season

[TTD]

Wow... that's a lot of use.

But something tells me they will fail tech on Sept 18th now.

[OreoGaborio]

not if I have a different bike by then

[Ken C]

I did 5 track days on Corsa IIIs and they would have done at least one more. I had a slip only once, but tother than that, they were fine.

Now, none of this means anything unless you know the pace and how many laps I did. I instruct for Tony and I usually do around 1.5 times the amount of riding a typical customer does. Also, I run all the groups, which means the tires have done many laps at fast blue group times as well as many slower laps.

What this means is that the Corsa IIIs tires rocked! Yes, race tires are preferred, but not necessary, IMO.

[Doc]

I have had my Michelin PP Race tires on the Hawk all this season. 9 races and 2 trackdays. I use tire warmers and they still have alot of tread left. I am thinking I will need a new set for next season though.

I started in the 138 range and I am down to 127's for lap times on the Hawk.

[Paul_E_D]

It's been my experience that tires don't take much damage from heat until you push the pace below 23 on a low power bike, or below 20 on a 600. Once you dip into these time zones, tread wear is no longer the indicator of tire life. They wil heat cycle out before the tread wears down.

At this point it's up to the rider to "feel" the performance drop off. The only way to develop this feel is to run the tires long past their prime in practice and watch your laptimes.

[Degsy]

I have 900 track miles (yes, 900) on the medium compound slicks on my CBR600RR and they show no signs of slipping at all. Still have plenty of wear left.

derek

[Paul_E_D]

See above...

[Degsy]

See above...

Yep, I'm running no better than 1:23 or so at trackdays and I'll use the tires until they literally wear past the markers.

derek

[Karaya One]

And I have slicks on sale.....

[march686]

I have piles of Dunlop 209 Sportmax DOT take-offs for sale. 120/70-17 fronts and 190/60-17 rears. If anyone is interested in a set just let me know.