ultra light class and 1999 sv650 question ??

[Roland]

Ok im confused. I thought according to rule book 650cc liquid cool manufactured 1998 and earlier are allowed into ultra light classes. So how do i see "1999" SV650's in race results for Ultra light classes last race weekend? I'm assuming 1999 sv650s are ultra light legale or else someone would have yelled foul at the start line but could someone explain to me what i'm not getting or miss understanding please?

[Trouble]

LRRS excludes SV's from the Ultralight races. You may see some sprinkled in the novice classes as they don't really monitor who is running what in those races. Once you get above novice you won't see any.

[Roland]

LRRS excludes SV's from the Ultralight races. You may see some sprinkled in the novice classes as they don't really monitor who is running what in those races. Once you get above novice you won't see any.

# 116 Cull,Ray Placed 6th in AM ultra light super bike on 99 sv650 right in front of Roland A. last race weekend.

[Trouble]

Nobody contested him so he got away with it.

[jasnmar]

If he runs it in the next event file a protest if you don't want him doing it in the future. That's the purpose of protests.

[kumpy]

I think LRRS has a soft spot for SVs and put them in a lightweight class. Was told because it was such a popular bike here at Loudon. Everywhere else in the country, its considered an ultra-lightweight bike.

[nhbubba]

How is bumping it 'up' a class having a "soft spot" for the machine? Seems like a penalty.

[Kurlon]

SVs were allowed into UL with restrictions a few years ago by CCS as they were getting beat up in LW by Ducs and other machines, plus elsewhere UL was a dying class. They basically aged them out into UL to keep them around as well as inject some life into the class. LRRS meanwhile had a sizable Hawk population, along with motards running UL making it a popular class but allowing SVs in would have put all but the 'tards out of the running. So LRRS put in a rule to block them.

I actually saw the SV in question on the grid and joked about it with Roland. Looks like that was Mr Cull's only event this year, he may have been visiting from another region and not realized LRRS had slightly different rules for UL.

[GingahNinjah]

The registration software allows the SV to be registered for LW races also

[Kurlon]

Yeah, SV in LW is normal. The system shouldn't allow it for UL but that can be checked.

Original discussion: http://www.nestreetriders.com/forum/...dates-for-2008
UL used to ban post 98 liquid twins, CCS lifted the restriction, LRRS kept it.

[Jim]

SV's aren't ULW legal for CCS North East, but are for all other CCS regions.
why? because LRRS makes their own rules.

like it's been mentioned, protest it or say something to the rider in the pits. chances are he might not know. there's been some new CCS riders that have been doing LRRS events lately.

[Roland]

If he runs it in the next event file a protest if you don't want him doing it in the future. That's the purpose of protests.

I have no reason to protest. It wasn't my race. If the guys and gals in that race don't mind i don't. I just saw something that i didn't understand and wanted information on it. Brain munchies. Thanks

[jasnmar]

I have no reason to protest. It wasn't my race.

Sorry, I confused Roland (you) with Roland A (rolker) and believed this was "your race".

As a spectator, me protesting, would likely be "frowned upon" .

[tsorfas]

Kurlon described it perfect. Hawks and Motards are the reason why SV are not in UL. And it's fine because it allows us to keep hawks racing and we have so many motards out.
Lrrs did a great call with that one IMO.

[Jim]

they're not legal at LRRS because Hawks and Motards can run at a smaller track like NHMS. the little 2-stroke bikes have their own CCS class (moto2 i think), so that leaves ULW open for SV's and other twins in the 70hp range.

[tsorfas]

But we don't have a lot of small 2 stroke bikes at nhms. I think total of 4?

[nt650hawk]

LRRS..

it is a matter of what a bike does. and is HP really needed at Loudon?


Riddle me this. What bike is winning all the LW classes?
follow up question.
Why woud you allow a bike that is winning all the LW classes to ride down in a class?

Provide a class for vintage machinary, and slow tards to battle = ULSB

[Pigman]

Riddle me this...who really cares its for FUN@##!$)(@)(@)

[nt650hawk]

Then allow all classes to be open classes. ;-)

[Kurlon]

At the end of the day, if it's going to potentially threaten me points wise in the class, I care. Yes, it's club racing, it's for fun but I'm putting enough effort into it following the rules that I'm not going to allow someone to beat me by cheating.

[nt650hawk]

Run what you brung

[Jim]

SV's are ULW legal for every other CCS region....except North East. You don't see the smaller twins (except 250 and 500 class) run anywhere but Loudon.

[Kurlon]

SV's are ULW legal for every other CCS region....except North East. You don't see the smaller twins (except 250 and 500 class) run anywhere but Loudon.

Which is why my UL machine is built to go toe to toe with a SB SV for when I eventually travel.

[Roland]

After thinking about it i think I (we) may be missing the obvious. the rule states

"Liquid-cooled machines up to 650cc manufactured after 1998 are excluded from this class."

would it be safe to assume that a 99 sv was manufactured in 1998 and not after. Also the my.nhms web site will let you sign a 99 sv650 up for ultralight classes.

[Kurlon]

Ignore what the website will let you sign up for, that's not considered authoritative. As per the rule book:

9.1.9 It is the responsibility of the rider to assure that
he or she is entered in the correct class and on
the correct motorcycle.

9.1.9.1 Any rider improperly entered will be
disqualified from that class and be
subject to a fine.

9.1.9.2 A rider will not receive any
contingency monies if not listed on
the proper machine.

...and...

15.1.4 If it is found that a machine was ineligible for a
class in which it was entered the rider may be
disqualified.

Finally, how to protest - Within 60 minutes of the race finish, a rider from that race must submit a written protest to an LRRS Official, noting rule book page number(s) and rule number(s). Given this would be a protest based on the type of bike and nothing internal, IE bodywork wouldn't need to come off to confirm it's an SV there would be no protest fee required.

As far as the date of mfg, according to Suzuki the SV650 didn't go into production until 1999. Everywhere else in the rule book references model year, including the limit on non-desmo liquid twins for pre 1999 model year being allowed more than 650cc. I would anticipate this rule would be enforced by the model year as well. If going by actual date it rolled into a crate out of the factory than any 1st Gen SV would be legal via the 'like construction' path.

That said, he's not threatening the podium yet, and a non-factor in AM ULSB points overall currently. I'd rather just chat with him at the track if I see he's running the class again before anyone pulls out a formal protest.

Good eye though, it's the lil details like that in the rulebook that can be game changers. There *IS* a way to run an SV in ULSB, punched out even...