Permatex Ultra Black

[j4eric]

i need to re-install the clutch cover for my F4i, can i use Permatex Ultra black for the gasket maker?

or should i go and buy that Yamabond 4?

Thanks for your help

[butcher bergs]

Yamabond.

The black stuff is okay until it comes in contact with fuel over a period of time at which point it basically deteriorates. Fuel eventually ends up mixing with the oil.

Save yourself the hassle.

[DuncanMoto]

But he doesn't have a Yamaha

[butcher bergs]

He will after using Yamabond

[joeswamp]

Using yamabond (or ThreeBond 1109 or whatever it's really called) on a clutch cover is a mechanical crime, it's a mess and a total hack job. It won't leak but will be a huge pain to get that crap off the next time you take the cover off. AFAIK that stuff is only really supposed to be used when you glue case halves together and other semi-permanant jobs.

Use a new gasket or o-ring, grease it lightly, then torque the cover down evenly and correctly.

[j4eric]

Yamabond.

The black stuff is okay until it comes in contact with fuel over a period of time at which point it basically deteriorates. Fuel eventually ends up mixing with the oil.

Save yourself the hassle.

Thanks Paul..

But he doesn't have a Yamaha

Ted, I should've grabbed that yamabond when I was there...I had it in my hands already....argggghh...

Using yamabond (or ThreeBond 1109 or whatever it's really called) on a clutch cover is a mechanical crime, it's a mess and a total hack job. It won't leak but will be a huge pain to get that crap off the next time you take the cover off. AFAIK that stuff is only really supposed to be used when you glue case halves together and other semi-permanant jobs.

Use a new gasket or o-ring, grease it lightly, then torque the cover down evenly and correctly.

Joe, I checked the micro fische for an f4i...for some reason....Honda does not sell the gasket or o-ring...

[butcher bergs]

Using yamabond (or ThreeBond 1109 or whatever it's really called) on a clutch cover is a mechanical crime, it's a mess and a total hack job. It won't leak but will be a huge pain to get that crap off the next time you take the cover off. AFAIK that stuff is only really supposed to be used when you glue case halves together and other semi-permanant jobs.

Use a new gasket or o-ring, grease it lightly, then torque the cover down evenly and correctly.

Have you actually used the product yourself? I ask because you paint this horrible picture I have never encountered after numerous times using it, peeling it off and using it again. Remove the heavy stuff by hand and clean the rest off with brake parts cleaner. Done.



Eric - I believe the gasket is sold as part of a kit. I believe you can also source a kit thru DuncanMoto from one of his disributors.

As far as application of the Yamabond, a very thin and even bead around the inner circumference of the gasket surface will take care of you. You're basically looking to make the smallest most even bead in the world if you plan on keeping the cover and surrounding areas looking clean.

[joeswamp]

Have you actually used the product yourself? I ask because you paint this horrible picture I have never encountered after numerous times using it, peeling it off and using it again. Remove the heavy stuff by hand and clean the rest off with brake parts cleaner. Done.

No doubt this stuff works and will seal anything, but it seems that every time I've had to scrape/pick it out of valve and clutch covers it breaks into tiny pencil eraser shavings that go all over the place. I guess I'm just annoyed with the few times I've had to clean it out of places that it really didn't need to be -- you should be able to just pop off a valve or clutch cover without having to degunk the surfaces every time.

[butcher bergs]

No doubt this stuff works and will seal anything, but it seems that every time I've had to scrape/pick it out of valve and clutch covers it breaks into tiny pencil eraser shavings that go all over the place. I guess I'm just annoyed with the few times I've had to clean it out of places that it really didn't need to be -- you should be able to just pop off a valve or clutch cover without having to degunk the surfaces every time.

It's a messy product, no two ways about it. However it's all in the application, IMO.

If a nice thin, clean and even bead is layed on the inner diameter of any given engine cover, that alone, from what I've seen, greatly reduces the necessary clean up and pencil shavings that generally show up as well as the "mushrooming" that occurs onto the external surfaces once the cover is hung.

Ultimately, yes, a proper gasket is the way to go if you don't plan on opening up your engine often.

[joeswamp]

Joe, I checked the micro fische for an f4i...for some reason....Honda does not sell the gasket or o-ring...

OK I did some googling and I think you're right -- the f4i has no clutch cover gasket. If so you've got to use sealant instead, so follow butcher bergs' advice to the letter...

This is news to me, I thought everyone was using crazy shaped big o-rings these days.

[DuncanMoto]

These days and f4i is a paradox.


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[CBR929RE]

The Ultra Black has been on my 929 clutch cover for a few years now (4 maybe 5 years) and haven't had any issues with it.

[butcher bergs]

That is definitely a possibility. I didn't have very good luck with it on a few occasions so I ditched the product completely.

[Sheppo]

I've had no issues with Permatex Black. I've used it on plenty of racecar motors and never had issues with it breaking down with fuel or normal engine temps.
It is all in the application that makes it not hard to clean up. Surface prep goes a long way.

[j4eric]

Thanks guys...