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Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

  1. #1
    Lifer Ductard's Avatar
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    Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    There are two oil screens in the KTM RFS engine (different from and in addition to the oil filters) - I have a 520 SX and the 13mm side screen bolt is seized.

    I was hoping someone might be able to help me out with getting it out.

    I've tried a breaker bar, trying to get it out with the engine hot, using the flash freeze / penetrating oil that auto zone sells, and a handheld impact driver.

    I bought some of those bolt extractors and have tried using those with the impact driver when the 6 sided socket I was using started to slip off the head of the bolt. I've pretty much given up trying to save the bolt and just need to get it out at this point.

    None of that has worked so far. I have googled the problem and it seems to be fairly common. I'm a little nervous b/c some people have cracked their cases trying to fix the same problem.

    I also saw suggestions to heat up the bolt with a torch and let it cool...I've also ordered some "blaster" penetrating catalyst which is supposed to work pretty well. I'm a little hesitant to take a propane or mapp gas torch to my engine case...

    I'm thinking that trying to hit it with a pneumatic impact driver might be the next step.

    I don't have one, nor do I have access to compressed air. Is there anybody in the Boston Metro West area that has one that I could use? I figure I could just swing by with the bike in my trailer and see if that works.

    Open to any other ideas....

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    suburban ghetto living... black's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    if you want.. i have an electric impact driver....

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    hmmmm......

  3. #3
    Lifer Ductard's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Quote Originally Posted by black View Post
    if you want.. i have an electric impact driver....
    Tried one of those at the track...I think I need more firepower....

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    Permanent N00b -Dutch-'s Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Whereabouts in the Metrowest? My buddy/neighbor works at a garage in Brockton.

    Also, any idea what the electric driver you tried was putting out?

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    Last edited by -Dutch-; 10-19-14 at 09:10 PM.

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    Lifer jasnmar's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Is the head of the bolt still good?

    If it is put a 6 point impact socket on it, use the breakover and hit it with a 3-5 pound hammer.

    The other option is a cheater pipe on the end of the breakover.

    As long as you haven't broken the head of the bolt off or rounded it off use it. You'll have more leverage than using an easy out.

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    Don't bother me! R7's Avatar
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    Can't help you until next weekend, but I have an electric that will either take it off or break the bolt head off. I had the same thing happen to me on my 525, lucky I got it free. I always used a small dab of rtv silicone on the threads after that, and never had an issue again

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  7. #7
    Lifer Ductard's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Quote Originally Posted by -Dutch- View Post
    Whereabouts in the Metrowest? My buddy/neighbor works at a garage in Brockton.

    Also, any idea what the electric driver you tried was putting out?
    Quote Originally Posted by jasnmar View Post
    Is the head of the bolt still good?

    If it is put a 6 point impact socket on it, use the breakover and hit it with a 3-5 pound hammer.

    The other option is a cheater pipe on the end of the breakover.

    As long as you haven't broken the head of the bolt off or rounded it off use it. You'll have more leverage than using an easy out.
    Quote Originally Posted by R7 View Post
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    Can't help you until next weekend, but I have an electric that will either take it off or break the bolt head off. I had the same thing happen to me on my 525, lucky I got it free. I always used a small dab of rtv silicone on the threads after that, and never had an issue again

    Quote Originally Posted by black View Post
    if you want.. i have an electric impact driver....

    I'm willing to give an electric impact driver a shot - I don't think the one I borrowed at the track was that beefy.


    I'm not really in a hurry to get this done as long as I've got it sorted before ice bike season, so I'm ok if nobody can help me immediately.

    R7 - where are you located?

    I live in Davis Square (Somerville) but I work in Littleton (where 495 meets Rt 2) so anybody close to either one of those would be awesome (Brockton's probably a little more of a trek than I'm looking to make.

    That said, there's a car garage right next to the place I store the bike...figure they probably wouldn't charge more than 10 bucks or so to take an impact wrench to this bolt, no?

    The bolt is rounded off - the 6 point socket I had on it was slipping.

    Just so we're on the same page, I wasn't using an easy out, I was using the impact grade bolt removers from sears (link below)

    They're like sockets but they grip the outside of the head of the bolt. I'm not sure they get a lot less torque than you would get on an undamaged bolt.

    Sears.com

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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ductard View Post
    That said, there's a car garage right next to the place I store the bike...figure they probably wouldn't charge more than 10 bucks or so to take an impact wrench to this bolt, no?
    R7's pretty far from both of your locations...if you can't find someone more local with a beefy enough impact, I'd just use that shop or a moto shop. When I couldn't get a clutch basket nut off, I brought the bike to performance cycles in shrewsbury, ma once, and they didn't even charge me to pull the nut off. I dropped off beer regardless

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    Lifer LuvDog's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    If the bolt is too rounded, then my suggestion would be to crank on a set of vise grips. Then get a 3 foot section of pipe that will fit over the vise grips and use that as your breaker.

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    Lifer Rosco61's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    If you want I can help you. I'm in Peabody and have a half descent impact driver with a compressor.
    We could at least give it a shot.

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  11. #11
    KNEE DRAGGING BAGGER sedanman's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    I'm too far away to help but I have a thought. If the 6 point socket slips with a ratchet it will do no better with gun on it. There are tools out there that a lot of people dismiss as junk or gimmicks without ever using them firsthand. Try to fine either a Metrinch or grip-tite socket and use a breaker bar with an extension. Both of these sockets take Snap-on's flank drive concept to the extreme by putting pressure on the sides of the fastner and not the corners. If you can't find either of these than go to Sears and get their "universal" sockets in the appropriate size. These are 12 point spline sockets that also take pressure off of the corners of the bolt. Good luck.

    Btw, Sears Craftsman universal wrenches are THE STRONGEST wrenches I've ever used. Tougher than Snap-on, Mac, Matco etc.

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  12. #12
    KNEE DRAGGING BAGGER sedanman's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    If everything else fails and there's room the you could find a scrap of steel bar, drill a hole just large enough to fit over the head of the bolt and weld it in place. Even if you can't get 360 degrees of rotation, if it breaks free then you cut/grind the steel back off and spin the bolt out. Really wish you were closer, I'm fairly confident I could get this out.

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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ductard View Post
    That said, there's a car garage right next to the place I store the bike...figure they probably wouldn't charge more than 10 bucks or so to take an impact wrench to this bolt, no?
    The bolt is rounded off - the 6 point socket I had on it was slipping.
    Just so we're on the same page, I wasn't using an easy out, I was using the impact grade bolt removers from sears (link below)
    They're like sockets but they grip the outside of the head of the bolt.
    I would definitely take the bike over to the shop next door. The mechanic will probably do it for free. It should take just a minute. Have him use that Sears impact grade socket designed for stripped heads. If you want, ask what his fav beer is and drop off a 6 pk.

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  14. #14
    suburban ghetto living... black's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    get a couple of guys and just move the hot tub.... oh wait.. wrong thread

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    hmmmm......

  15. #15
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    I did not notice in the posts but have you tried tapping directly on the head of the bolt in all this? I have, on several occasions, been able to break hardware free by giving the head of a bolt a good wrap with nothing more than a flat punch and a hammer. What you are essentially doing is "unseating" the threads across the entire length on the bolt.

    I would advise against heating the bolt itself as the heat should be concentrated on the surrounding area since you want the threads in the case to expand, not the bolt. Heating the bolt will only serve to expand the bolt in the thread holes and..well...bad things can happen when heating the wrong surface area then applying torque to the hardware.

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  16. #16
    its in my blood caloots's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Right.. don't heat the bolt.. if the head Is aluminum. Then use low heat like a propane torch and heat the head were the bolt threads are.. Then try impact if you can. I'd be careful with crazy power cuz if you break the bolt head off. You r screwed.. if it's seized in there, an easy out won't work. You would have to drill and tap or helicoil
    Can you post a pic?

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  17. #17
    Backwoods lobster boy number9's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Yeah, a picture would be great.

    I owned several Ducatis and am restoring a 60s muscle car, so I have plenty of experience with ruining fasteners. This is the order I tend to approach things:

    1. Not stripping it in the first place
    2. Spray it with WD40. Just kidding, that stuff is for pussies
    3. Spray it PB Blaster penetrating oil and let it soak overnight
    4. Use a breaker bar
    5. Realize you need a bigger breaker bar. Because I am a cheap cunt, I get sections of black iron pipe from Lowe's or HD and put them over my breaker bar. Bingo, 3' or 6' breaker bar
    6. If that fails I try heating it with propane
    7. Just kidding, propane is fucking useless. Now I heat it with MAPP gas instead, and become mildly amused when the PB Blaster catches fire a little
    8. If it's a bolt/screw, grind off material to make flat edges thus making the bolt/screw smaller. So your 15mm bolt becomes a retarded 14mm, then you can undo it with a 14mm wrench
    9. If it's a socket-headed screw (e.g. that takes an Allen key), this is much harder. I would grind a little bit of the head to make the hole bigger, then take a hammer and pound in the next bigger size hex key
    10. If it's still suck, I say "fuck this piece of shit, I'm fucking selling it as-is to some idiot cunt"
    11. Cry
    12. Drink a beer
    13. If it's a bolt/screw, weld a wrench to it. If it's a socket-head screw, weld an allen key in it
    14. Succeed, and thank God that you bought a welder months ago and lie to the wife about how much you paid for it
    15. Feel like a man
    16. Go take a shit and drink a beer
    17. Post on NESR about how fucking awesome I am

    Any questions? I'm basically the Doug Mirabelli of fastener removal. Seriously though I'm not far from Somerville and can help you out if the shop next door can't/won't.

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    Last edited by number9; 10-20-14 at 06:20 PM.

  18. #18
    Senior Member MarkMarine's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    I live in brighton and have a 1/2" impact and a portable compressor that will happily snap that bolt head off for you
    I'd try heat and rapping on it a lot lot lot before you get out the impact, but I'm close by if you want to use it.

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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Only 1 thumb on my previous post? What the fuck is wrong with you people?

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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Not everybody can be as cool as me.

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    Lifer Ductard's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Quote Originally Posted by black View Post
    get a couple of guys and just move the hot tub.... oh wait.. wrong thread
    But who's gonna bury the dead hooke....I mean...nevermind.

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  22. #22
    Resident Turkey Tricky Mike's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    That thing has always been a bitch, but the good news is it's probably not seized. Just stuck, as usual.
    I used to use the impact gun on it every time, but it never took more than a tiny bump of the button and it would break loose.
    Since the head is fucked I might take a cutoff wheel and cut a groove into the head of the bolt and either whack the edge with a hammer and sharp punch or use the flathead from one of these (in the gun, though... never had much luck using these with a hammer):
    Bet it pops loose and spins out by hand.
    Have a pneumatic impact wrench?  Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)-kle-70229_xl-jpg

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  23. #23
    Backwoods lobster boy number9's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Quote Originally Posted by Tricky Mike View Post
    That thing has always been a bitch, but the good news is it's probably not seized. Just stuck, as usual.
    I used to use the impact gun on it every time, but it never took more than a tiny bump of the button and it would break loose.
    Since the head is fucked I might take a cutoff wheel and cut a groove into the head of the bolt and either whack the edge with a hammer and sharp punch or use the flathead from one of these (in the gun, though... never had much luck using these with a hammer):
    Bet it pops loose and spins out by hand.
    Have a pneumatic impact wrench?  Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)-kle-70229_xl-jpg
    I have one of these if Ductard wants to borrow it. I've only used it once but it worked. Honestly I tend to use that where the fasteners are more fragile than engine bolts. Never thought to hit it with an impact gun!

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  24. #24
    Lifer Ductard's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    I picked one of these up at Sears, hit it a couple of times, but with the odd position, I couldn't hold it and give it a solid whack - and those destroy the bolt remover type sockets I have wouldn't stay on good enough for a solid whack. Gonna try some things, maybe take up one of these offers this weekend. Not sure if that garage next door is open on Saturdays, but they're closed up by the time I get home.

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  25. #25
    Resident Turkey Tricky Mike's Avatar
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    Re: Have a pneumatic impact wrench? Need help with a stuck oil screen bolt (KTM RFS)

    Another option is to drill straight through the center and tap the hole with left-hand threads, followed by a left-hand threaded bolt. You may bugger the screen up in the process, though.

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