Am. 121 Rnd. 3 2012 Loudon Classic

Good to hear you're not crossing the line going into 3. I cringe every time I see that happening in front of me!

I'm not trying to argue "for Alex". I just want to express my understanding of his point of view so a balanced discussion on how to prevent a future incident like this can happen. The way I see it, the only real benefit of discussing an incident publicly is for it to become a learning experience for more than the people involved, so since you started this discussion, I just want to keep it as fair as possible.

Seems like a light rub on the left clip-on would be enough to counter steer his bike off the track and launch it like it did. Seems to me like he didn't realize you were there and was taking the normal outside line and you didn't realize that he didn't realize you were still there and got squeezed. Does this sound like a fair assessment of what happen? If so, how can we all learn from it?

Sounds fair... I came away from the weekend feeling like it was noone's fault. The only lesson I can see being learned is to give eachother room out there! That, and if you want to pass someone, commit and do it fast.

I'll say this as diplomatically as I can.
The lesson to be learned here is during practice (or a td) and you know someone faster is coming around you, let em go. The .2seconds it takes to back off just enough isn't worth:
A: getting hurt
B: the shitstorm that ensues afterwards.

During an actual race, keep doing your own thing.

As an outsider reading this (and based on this thread alone) coming out of 2 everyone is doing the same thing; pinning it. With a couple big bikes one isn't necessarily going to out motor the other all the time. So he might have thought he got by, maybe not...I can't speculate. But even practice should be treated differently than a race.

.02

Yeah Chip, I agree w/you... this was practice, and also the last lap of the last session. I don't think what happened was a case of 2 riders having a drag race into t3. I was already on the brakes when he rolled up beside me, so it's kind of tough to back off when you're already braking very hard. My honest opinion is that he came in too hot and couldn't move himself over to avoid me. There really is no other explanation because usually you can go inside a little to make the pass and still be on line. I know someone saw what happened, and maybe someday it can be explained by a 3rd party. It happened really fast and it's a shame about the bike, but he walked away and that is what's important. As racers, none of us wants this shit to happen, but unfortunately it can and does happen. My only problem is with people like CEO who jump to conclusions, and want to label people as being unsafe, or erratic and unpredictable, because when something like this happens, it just gives people the idea that it had to be someone's fault. We all know that sometimes shit happens that Noone can control. Just look at the start of every mw race... it's chaotic, and alot of times someone goes down. I know it's only a matter of time before it happens to me, but I. Choose to do it anyway, and I will never bitch and point the finger at someone else.

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Originally Posted by BrianC

The only lesson I can see being learned is to give each other room out there!

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Yup, especially in practice. I would also suggest that it's not the only lesson to be learned. Being a bit more diplomatic during the post-altercation discussion with the other rider would also go along way to keep the LRRS family happier in general.

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Originally Posted by BrianC

Yeah Chip, I agree w/you... this was practice, and also the last lap of the last session. I don't think what happened was a case of 2 riders having a drag race into t3. I was already on the brakes when he rolled up beside me, so it's kind of tough to back off when you're already braking very hard. My honest opinion is that he came in too hot and couldn't move himself over to avoid me. There really is no other explanation because usually you can go inside a little to make the pass and still be on line. I know someone saw what happened, and maybe someday it can be explained by a 3rd party. It happened really fast and it's a shame about the bike, but he walked away and that is what's important. As racers, none of us wants this shit to happen, but unfortunately it can and does happen. My only problem is with people like CEO who jump to conclusions, and want to label people as being unsafe, or erratic and unpredictable, because when something like this happens, it just gives people the idea that it had to be someone's fault. We all know that sometimes shit happens that Noone can control. Just look at the start of every mw race... it's chaotic, and alot of times someone goes down. I know it's only a matter of time before it happens to me, but I. Choose to do it anyway, and I will never bitch and point the finger at someone else.

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Yeah, giving some extra unexpected brake will go south too.

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Originally Posted by BrianC

Who said I think CEO is a trustworthy source? Last I heard he's a crybaby... . Noone else has ever made a complaint, and I've been complimented several times.

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Originally Posted by BrianC

Despite what CEO might think, I was very open minded about what my role was...

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Originally Posted by BrianC

My only problem is with people like CEO who jump to conclusions, and want to label people as being unsafe, or erratic and unpredictable

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I did not jump to any conclusions, I have tried to give you advice and help you, directly based on my experience. This includes racing and practicing with you, watching you race from the bowl (with a lot of other people who also saw various close calls) for a couple race weekends now during the dash, and then hearing about this incident and seeing you in the first post hand the blame off.

You want to get defensive and dismiss it, ignore it, dislike me, call me a crybaby for whatever unknown reason, etc., that's totally your call man.

Otherwise, you can PM me or find me next weekend and I'd be happy to talk to you. I'm sorry you seem to have taken this all personally.

My only question is . . .

Did you win the practice?

Wirelessly posted (Blackberry Bold 9930)

As an outsider looking in, with no race experience I can say I have no valid input on what took place on the track. From all I can tell it was an accident that occurred, was unintentional and nobody was really injured.

What I AM absolutely shocked by is that there has not been a single comment up to this point on the part of the story where Brian states not only was he screamed at by Alex's father at the track, but then (supposedly) nearly run off the road by someone him on the way home for a fight. And Brian I say (supposedly) not in a manner suggesting that I don't believe you, but simply to illustrate up to this point that it is your side and the only account of what happened.

I really don't understand what your getting at. It's totally plausible that they were absolutely ripshit if they thought they were wronged, and smashed up a very expensive racebike. The kid who crashed is a young gun...and it's possible he has what I would refer to as a motocross or hockey dad. I don't know this to be true at all, but if it were, I could very easily see both those things taking place.
Aside from kicking a hornets nest, what are you getting at?

Wirelessly posted (Blackberry Bold 9930)

I didn't feel that I was kicking a hornets nest, but merely stating that what I saw to be a fairly significant part of the story has not yet been spoken of since the original post.

As I stated, I am no racer and am unfamiliar with the environment at the track. Therefore if I am making an issue of something insignificant and common I apologize. I would just be a bit suprised that if the events off-track by Brian truly took place as described, these actions days later, would be seen as understandable, acceptable or otherwise justified.

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Originally Posted by BrianC

I agree 100%... and that is what other reputable sources have told me... that I'm leaving too much room coming out of 6. It really comes down to me being a little shy turning in after I lowsided over there and trashed my paintjob.

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stop thinking about it. my 2 crashes last year on my bike were in 1 and 1a. had Narbonne practically laying on top of me last round in 1 and had to ride with my tires on the curbing this past weekend when Killmeier nearly took out my front wheel. next lap I didn't even think about it. talked about it in the garage but on the track it never ran through my head again. the Narbonne one was actually really cool.

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Originally Posted by BrianC

My honest opinion is that he came in too hot and couldn't move himself over to avoid me. There really is no other explanation...

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This is just an outsider looking in and I have noticed a few things throughout the thread.

The first thing I noticed is that Brian stated that it was nobody's fault at the beginning but he clearly blames the other rider by saying that he came in too hot and couldn't avoid Brian. I just think it's funny that the story changes through out so obviously it can't be the complete truth.

The second thing I noticed is that everyone is calling Alex's Dad the "motocross parent" saying that he is a hot head but Brian has told a couple people off right here in the thread so who's to say that he's not the one with a hot head.

I'm not calling you a liar Brian but there are things throughout the thread that just make me question what actually happened during the crash and after the crash.


Just my 2 cents
Kawi Man

Hey kawi man, read post 35 again and edit your post. Way to join a forum and almost call someone a liar immediately only AFTER misrepresenting what others have posted.
I hope you don't get off on the wrong foot here. It's a great resource with some fantastic people.

This thread needs to Dianna Fire.

you are the one that said he may have a hockey/motocross dad but don't know if it's true. I did not direct that at you but other people have referred to his dad as a hot head. that's all I was trying to point out.

Welcome to the forum. Seriously.


Pete, go shave your nipple goatees, sexy man.

:lmao: Yeah, my nip hair DOES need a little trim :naughty