WTB - Vanson or Heroic leathers - 44 or 46?

[Ductard]

After popping a zipper on my leathers and getting some road rash on my shoulder this weekend, I think I'm ready to make the investment for a good set of leathers.

I'm 6'0 and 200-205lbs. I rented some 44 Vanson's off of Eric Wood - it fit but was pretty snug with the internal back protector, but I'm also thinking about getting a spine protector that also has shoulder / chest guards (not sure what to call that) vs. the spine protector I have - in which case I'd almost definitely need a 46.

Feel free to jump in with opinions on Vanson vs. Heroic - or any others that people think are of that caliber.

My current perception is that Vanson's are heavier / bulkier (but not too noticeable when you're riding per my experience on Sunday), whereas Heroics are lighter and more form-fitting but *may* not last quite as long (although still more durable than most things out there).

As far as color options - Vanson's "economy" color seems to be black (hotter) whereas heroic's seems to be white (arguably cooler but abrasions stand out more).

Was totally happy with the Vansons this weekend, but in all fairness I have never worn Heroics.

[Jim]

i have a Heroic custom suit. fits nice, and has taken a beating. their gloves hold up nicely too.

from what i've heard over the years...you want to race in Heroic, but crash in Vanson.
Personally, i'm looking to give Pilot my business next year. Vanson's customer service is pretty bad.

[burnham]

Very happy with the custom Vanson I bought last year. Used it twice Saturday, suit held up great and did its job.

[Ductard]

Personally, i'm looking to give Pilot my business next year.

Really? I haven't really heard of them...not that I'm well versed. But it does look like they have some sample suits for about half price to the regular ones, as long as you're not picky on color / customization (which I'm not.)

http://www.pilotmotosport.com/evo-fit-sample-suits/

Vanson's customer service is pretty bad.

I've heard similar about Heroic's customer service. Still haven't delivered suits for people that ordered this winter type of thing is the only specific thing I've heard. Could be that they're just growing faster than they are prepared to, which more power to them, but I've gotta look out for me. :-)

To paraphrase one person - "I don't like dealing with Heroic, but I'll be damned if I'm going to crash in anybody else's leathers"

[Jim]

i'm actually one of those complaints too. took like 3 months to get my suit. still need adjustments, but i dont have enough down time to ship it to NY for final touches.

[tsorfas]

Personally, i'm looking to give Pilot my business next year.

That's a great lead! Investing all my money there! I'll be rich, son!

[Ductard]

i'm actually one of those complaints too. took like 3 months to get my suit. still need adjustments, but i dont have enough down time to ship it to NY for final touches.

Any idea why Todd wasn't at Loudon this weekend? I'm not in the loop enough to know if there was another event going on last weekend. I could have thrown some repair business his way - and it didn't seem like there were other options...

Either way, I guess he doesn't *have* to be at every event, but I've come to expect him to be there so I guess I might have to scramble for small repairs instead of showing up at the track with a stitch or to for him.

That's sort of a high risk strategy anyways, but the one cobbler I found that did a repair or two for me has apparently decided that leathers are too much of a PITA (and he won't touch gloves). He was good though, very cost effective and used top-knotch leathers. Not necessarily the exotic rattlesnake's ball-sack leather that Todd would use, but good stuff.

Anybody know any reliable, cost effective leather repair options near Boston?

[WinVT]

Has Todd been at LRRS at all this year? I haven't seen him, but I haven't been at every event.

[CBR929RE]

Pilot FTW. It fit perfect the first time with no adjustments needed, as a custom suit should be imo. I've crashed mine at least 6 times. I had 1 repair done because a small hole wore through over the armor in the shoulder (I have an older Alpha suit that doesn't have shoulder armor). 5 of the 6 crashes were on the right side. 3 of them lowsides in 1a so they slid on the same areas each time. I'm gonna look into sponsorship from them next year for a new suit.

my Heroic took 1 crash at 100mph and slid forever. it needed a new shoulder armor because the plastic wore away and popped the metal up and it got a cut about 1/2" long in the stretch fabric on the hip. otherwise it was good. the vinyl printed patches wore through very quickly but they aren't really part of the protection anyway.

[MattR302]

This guy is a site sponsor on the other forum and has made custom suits for some of the LRRS racers. I haven't had any experience with him, but people say his leathers are comparable to Heroic's and his customer service has been great. http://lionheartmoto.com/

[Kurlon]

Todd's been traveling to AMA events as well as hitting other series, I know prior weekends there were multiple conflicts with LRRS which is why we haven't seen him this year. I'm hoping he'll make at least one round, it isn't as fun harassing him online only.

I can't compare my Vanson to a Heroic suit, mine's from 2009 and is built like a tank. It is heavy and restrictive but as noted, it crashes like a tank in bubblewrap. I guess the newer ones are switching to thinner leather trying to match the lighter, less restrictive builds Heroic and others do but I don't have first hand experience with them. I'm starting to get to the point where I think I want to move to a Heroic suit just so I don't get so cramped up on the bike, as I'm moving more my times are dropping but damn am I fighting my suit more and more. I know the lighter suits CAN be built to hold up as my old AGV Sport has shown, but I don't have first hand experience with Todd's suits so I can't speak authoritatively on them yet.

On the glove front, I love my Heroics, switched from Held Titans and haven't regretted the swap yet.

[Jim]

Todd was at NJMP last weekend and he hasn't been at many CCS rounds this year. Like previously mentioned, he's been targeting AMA this year.

[Ductard]

Ok - this has all been useful, but I don't want to lose sight of the purpose of the thread. If you're selling size 44-46 used Vanson or Heroic leathers (or something that people on here would agree is of equivalent quality) then please let me know.

Input on pros / cons of those brands would be helpful too. Stories about epic crashes in any brand of leathers and how they held up would be awesome. Pictures are a bonus.

[Jim]

I had a 100 MPH crash into T3 on my heroic suit with 5 laps. I can post up videos and pictures if you really care. Suit held up. Needed work after the crash. Elbow was slightly too large so I got rug burn from the friction on my arm. It's about the size of a quarter. That's all that happened to me.

[Roland]

I have never wore a heroic suit. I have rented Vanson from Penguin before and it was heavy, restrictive, and very noticable to me on bike. Im sure both are top of the line. But If i may offer my 2 cent. You can buy a new AXO suit for the same price as a used Vanson or Heroic. There track day / entry level race suit is 800$ Pro race suit 1000$. http://www.axo.com/us/collection/street/suits I have raced in this suit all of last year an this year. suit is hard for my fat but to get in but i don't notice it at all on bike. It gets plenty of air at pace but hot as hell when in pit. Last year was my first real year racing I crashed every round in it. Its still my primary suit and i haven't had to get one repair! I went down in t1 bad at about 100 mph broke my ankle suit just got road rash, I went down in t3 bad again went into tires and re-broke ankle, suit just rash. Solid Seems and quality material. I did acquire a sponsorship from AXO but if they was a POS suit i would still say it. They are not. If you choose to go this way send me an IM I should be able to get you a GOOD deal on a new AXO instead of some ones used, (funky, rashed, sweated in) Vanson or Heroic. Again i know that both those brands are top of the line but I would personally feel better in a new suit that is of good quality, and never crashed, than i would in the best suit, that has been crashed.

[Ductard]

I had a 100 MPH crash into T3 on my heroic suit with 5 laps. I can post up videos and pictures if you really care. Suit held up. Needed work after the crash. Elbow was slightly too large so I got rug burn from the friction on my arm. It's about the size of a quarter. That's all that happened to me.

Dude, who wouldn't want to see footage of a 100MPH crash into T3 that the guy walks away from?

I just threw some popcorn in the microwave, send the link!

[Ductard]

I had a 100 MPH crash into T3 on my heroic suit with 5 laps. I can post up videos and pictures if you really care. Suit held up. Needed work after the crash. Elbow was slightly too large so I got rug burn from the friction on my arm. It's about the size of a quarter. That's all that happened to me.

Bump. Still looking for a suit. Definitely a 46.

Jim, are you going to put that video up?

BTW - Todd was at NYST last weekend. I get the feel that any customer service issues have been more issues with growing pains than anything. It's hard to get your suppliers and CM's to keep the pace sometimes as you go from being a small deal to being a big deal. That time in-between sometimes you need more product than usual and you're not important enough to them for them to pull out all the stops (ask me how I know). I know that might be little comfort to anyone waiting for a suit, but to me there's a big difference in somebody having short term issues and other companies that might not give a shit about customer service.

[GingahNinjah]

Check out Lionheartmoto.com I had one custom made over the winter for this season and its amazing. aside from some measurement screwups on my part on the lower legs which I had fixed eventually at my cost the suit is great. they do also have off the rack suits. The customer service has been spot on in my experience Scott is the owner and calls and emails go right through him. I havnt crash tested my suit yet and Id rather not since its so pretty but from reports I have heard and read about some of their AMA sponsored racer crashes in them they have held up very well. They also have full roo gloves for $250!

[drinkingmymilk]

Another vote for Pilot. I have a 5-6 year old two piece that I've crashed 2 times with no issues. I bought it used though, so I can't comment on customer service.

[Ductard]

So I see on Heroic's website that they don't repair suits that they consider to be knock-offs of their own.

Does anybody know if Pilot is considered one of those? Setting aside whether knocking off somebody's leathers is a little messed up, I'd hate to be stuck at the track needing leather repair and have Todd refuse to do it (assuming he starts making a presence at LRRS events again - I think he said he'd be at the next round).

From the pics below, the two suits sure do look similar....

All else being equal, I'd probably go with Heroics, but the currently don't have size 46 in stock and I sure wouldn't mind saving $250 by going with one of Pilot's sample fit suits.

[Jim]

Pilot's are not Heroic knock-offs.

[GingahNinjah]

My guess is that that comment was directed at Lionheart because they are made in the same factory however the materials used are totally different. the leather for Lionheart suits comes from the same tannery that supplies Dainese and the stitching is 100% kevlar at no extra cost.

[Ductard]

Pilot's are not Heroic knock-offs.

All due respect, that's your opinion however right or wrong it may be - but the only opinion that matters here is Todd's.

I was hoping someone has heard him talk about what he does consider to be a Heroic knock-off (doesn't seem to be as obvious as the "Brombo" master cylinders flooding eBay).

It's a little awkward asking him "if I buy this suit will you repair it?" - Especially after talking to him a bunch last weekend and telling him I'd buy a suit when his next shipment arrives (I even offered to put something down, but he didn't want to hang onto my money).

[drinkingmymilk]

Jim and GingahNinjah are both 100% correct. Todd let out my Pilot pants with no issue when I went and got fat.

[Jim]

Lion Heart, and whatever they were called before....Speed 21 or something like that.
they're the knock off suits from the same manufacturer in Pakastan, just like Heroic leathers.

I spoke to someone recently who was contacted from their factory asking if they wanted to be a leather retailer. they just use the same templates to make the suit & slap on your own brand logo.

Pilot Leathers (correct me if i'm wrong) is made in the USA, and they've been around WAY longer than Heroic.