[Ćheese]

Originally Posted by Kham

sure it's safer on the track but you can find an empty corners to put in a good lean and have fun if you know what you're doing.

... and then some local calls the cops and you get bagged for 20 mph over and a $250 fine. You can do it either way 3 times for the same cost. Depending on which way you chose for the 4th time you're either loving the track or giving up your license for 6 months or more.

Oreo forgot to mention that Tony, Ken, Paul, Jamie, Oreo, etc. will teach you body positioning so that your lean angle will decrease at the speeds you're currently taking into the corners. That's a good thing for negotiating the extra hazards you may find on the street.

[akira700]

I know I learned more in a couple days at the track
then I ever did in the two years previous only riding on the street.
There's something about being able to take the same turn over
and over again that helps with the learning.

I'm a much better street rider now. Could I have learned all I know
by just riding the street? Maybe but I'd be risking alot more
than rashed body work in the process. A six inch curb may as well be
a six foot wall if you are sliding on the ground after going down.
at least at the track there are no curbs or lamp posts.

You know if you are on the fence check it out.
Tony's Day is one of the most newbie friendly days around.
I made the mistake of taking my first day at Penguin School
which was mostly for new racers, that sort of set me back a bit, but
I kept at it. And pretty soon you get addicted. Once addicted the money dont matter you'll find a way to go.

[OreoGitorio]

Originally Posted by Cheese-GSXR

Oreo forgot to mention that Tony, Ken, Paul, Jamie, etc. will teach you body positioning so that your lean angle will decrease at the speeds you're currently taking into the corners.

I instruct from time to time too ya know

[RandyO]

Originally Posted by Kham

sure it's safer on the track

don't believe that for one minute

u have better odds of surviving a crash cause there is an ambulance nearby, but you are much more likely to crash at the track in the first place


oh maybe I should revise my statement for you, cause you crash every time you ride on the street too

[Kham]

Originally Posted by RandyO

oh maybe I should revise my statement for you, cause you crash every time you ride on the street too

that was before i know any proper ride techniqu.

next plan is to go to deals gap.

[35racer]

Originally Posted by RandyO

u have better odds of surviving a crash cause there is an ambulance nearby, but you are much more likely to crash at the track in the first place

I think your odds of surviving/not getting hurt are also better because of the environment. Fewer objects to hit... and NONE of them weigh 3000 pounds and are coming at you.

As for more likely to crash, that is only if you ride over the limits. If you ride under the limit on the street and under the limit on the track... you have LESS chance of crashing at the track.

I realize some people CHOOSE to push it more on the track, but that is a different statement.

[RandyO]

Originally Posted by 35racer

I think your odds of surviving/not getting hurt are also better because of the environment. Fewer objects to hit... and NONE of them weigh 3000 pounds and are coming at you.

As for more likely to crash, that is only if you ride over the limits. If you ride under the limit on the street and under the limit on the track... you have LESS chance of crashing at the track.

I realize some people CHOOSE to push it more on the track, but that is a different statement.

I dunno, I wouldn't even suggest street riding in metropolitan massachesets, It's easy to ride 400-500 miles in a day and not see anymore cars than you can count on your hand, compared to 20 or so bikes roundy round on the same mile, I think chances of cages staying on their own side of the road are better than not getting t-boned in the bowl by a testoterone driven gixxer

if you've come the distance to the track, you've come the distance to find rural low/no traffic roads

and you don't have to do anymore bike prep than filling your tank

[35racer]

Originally Posted by RandyO

I think chances of cages staying on their own side of the road are better than not getting t-boned in the bowl by a testoterone driven gixxer ...

Wow.. I cannot agree on this statement at all. This is certainly not my experience with track days and street riding.

[RandyO]

Originally Posted by 35racer

Wow.. I cannot agree on this statement at all. This is certainly not my experience with track days and street riding.

you need to find better streets to ride on seriously

[35racer]

I do agree that you can greatly reduce the street risk by staying on the back roads.

However, by it's very nature, 2 vehicles going in OPPOSITE directions will always be more dangerous than those travelling parallel.

But... I'm willing to say that we AGREE to DISAGREE.

Have fun. Be safe.

[RandyO]

Originally Posted by 35racer

I do agree that you can greatly reduce the street risk by staying on the back roads.

However, by it's very nature, 2 vehicles going in OPPOSITE directions will always be more dangerous than those travelling parallel.

But... I'm willing to say that we AGREE to DISAGREE.

Have fun. Be safe.

more dangerous, sure I don't dispute the street has potential for greater danger, risk is not the amount of danger, when you put the odds into the equasion, your chances are better on the street


I'd much rather see a dozen or so cars during a day of riding than I would 20 bikes flogging it past me down the strait then parkin it in the corners

what would the cost of the track be, shared between no more than 6 people

[jimaug87]

I'm really trying to get out to a track day, so that I can push myself and find my limits without worrying about outside hazards interupting me. I didn't mean to create a debate. I really wanted an example of body position on the bike to get me started, then I could create my own comfortble positions with experience.

I have made leaps and bounds in my comfort levels recently, and I am doing my best to get the experience that I desperatly need.

If any of you guys that are extremly experienced and knowlegable riders want to help out shoot me a PM

Thanks for the replies that answered my question

[35racer]

I think the track day recommendations were trying to answer the original questions, because we teach you proper riding position at the event.

We have not put it on Video, however, so you have to see it LIVE.

Actually, if you're free Monday Night and can make it to the track, we'll be having a body position seminar there as well.

Other than that I would just suggest picking up a copy of Road Racing World and looking closely at the photos of top racers. However, you will also find there are different styles, so you have to use the one that works with your body style.

For instance, If I try to hang way off like some people, I feel very uncomfortable and go slower. I hang off just enough to keep my body weight inside the CoG.

Good luck,

[ChR1s]

I know of more people that have crashed at the track than on the street, but that doesn't have shit to do with shit. Just like how many miles you put in doesn't define anything.

For my money, the ERC is the best street survival toolset enhancer.

As far as turning technique goes, you can a lot out of riding the track but it helps tol have to have some fundamental skills. I've seen riders out there that seem to be learning all about their bike for the first time, as if they've not put any brisk miles in at all. But hey, that's what the Red Group is for.

IMO, everyone should put in at least one track day before they put it down as unuseable. One of the most fun days I've had riding was my first track day. And the way Tony runs his show now, you can't not get a good day of riding in.

[CMG241]

Originally Posted by 35racer

I think the track day recommendations were trying to answer the original questions, because we teach you proper riding position at the event.
We have not put it on Video, however, so you have to see it LIVE.
Actually, if you're free Monday Night and can make it to the track, we'll be having a body position seminar there as well.
,

Tony, any chance of showing up for the seminar if we do not have the time for the track days? Pay a fee? If so what time would it happen?
Thanks,

[vaa]

Originally Posted by CMG41

Tony, any chance of showing up for the seminar if we do not have the time for the track days? Pay a fee? If so what time would it happen?
Thanks,

+1 I'm interested in this as well.s I haven't been able to attend a track day yet but would love to learn from the seminars if it's possible to attend.

Thanks

[Ćheese]

Originally Posted by ChR1s

I know of more people that have crashed at the track than on the street, but that doesn't have shit to do with shit. Just like how many miles you put in doesn't define anything.

For my money, the ERC is the best street survival toolset enhancer.

As far as turning technique goes, you can a lot out of riding the track but it helps tol have to have some fundamental skills. I've seen riders out there that seem to be learning all about their bike for the first time, as if they've not put any brisk miles in at all. But hey, that's what the Red Group is for.

IMO, everyone should put in at least one track day before they put it down as unuseable. One of the most fun days I've had riding was my first track day. And the way Tony runs his show now, you can't not get a good day of riding in.

I've gotta agree with Chris on this one. The key to riding safe on the track and the street is not to get too focused. You have to keep practicing a broad range of skills in a mixed environment to be prepared for everything.

I've spent a good deal of time on the road and the track working on turning skills. I know I'm not the fastest on the street or the track but I'm much more comfortable in corners than I ever was before. I credit that to reading, watching, riding the street and riding the track. Is it a good thing? Sure, but unfortunately when I came ripping around a corner into stopped traffic I realized very quickly that I should have also been working on emergency braking skills. That lapse in training cost me a low side. Luck was with me that day so I got up to ride another day. I was offered the chance to continue practicing increased corner speeds but also to work on slowing down fast.

After my bike was repaired I was back out there. This time in parking lots and uncrowded roads stopping hard. A week later I'm in turn 3 at Loudon and a rider has a get off in front of me. This time I'm able to keep my bike under control while leaned over and braking.

There are plenty of other skills to make safer riders but this is one example of how a narrow minded approach could end your life. I wouldn't discard any kind of experience whether it's a street, track, parking lot or whatever else. The more skills in your toolbox, the better your chances of keeping the sticky side down.

[Kham]

Originally Posted by Cheese-GSXR

I've gotta agree with Chris on this one. The key to riding safe on the track and the street is not to get too focused. You have to keep practicing a broad range of skills in a mixed environment to be prepared for everything.

I've spent a good deal of time on the road and the track working on turning skills. I know I'm not the fastest on the street or the track but I'm much more comfortable in corners than I ever was before. I credit that to reading, watching, riding the street and riding the track. Is it a good thing? Sure, but unfortunately when I came ripping around a corner into stopped traffic I realized very quickly that I should have also been working on emergency braking skills.

i try not to put myself in emergency situation in the first place. i don't wanna be the fastest on the street. i wanna feel comfortable.

Originally Posted by Cheese-GSXR

This time I'm able to keep my bike under control while leaned over and braking.

what's the name of the technique?

Originally Posted by Cheese-GSXR

There are plenty of other skills to make safer riders but this is one example of how a narrow minded approach could end your life. I wouldn't discard any kind of experience whether it's a street, track, parking lot or whatever else. The more skills in your toolbox, the better your chances of keeping the sticky side down.

yep... keep open mind but you still have to recognize the good and the bad.

[virtualbong]

I know track days will make me a better rider on and off the street. After going down last year, I don't care for taking risks on the street anymore. Not worth my life.

[ku996r]

Originally Posted by virtualbong

I know track days will make me a better rider on and off the street. After going down last year, I don't care for taking risks on the street anymore. Not worth my life.

not that I ride fast, but after doing track days, I ride even slower on the street. If there is a place to crash I would take track over street.

Its fun to go into blind turns, but you never know what is waiting for you in the blinds. as least for track, its one way traffic, with way more run off space and they also have corner workers to warn you whats up ahead.

I'm thinking to turn my 636 to track only bike and get something more of a commuter.

[35racer]

Originally Posted by CMG41

Tony, any chance of showing up for the seminar if we do not have the time for the track days? Pay a fee? If so what time would it happen?
Thanks,

Obviously... I never saw this post in time. Sorry about that.

The answer was YES, anyone could have shown up for the party and seminars for $20... and you would have instantly gotten $50 back in the form of a Track Day Gift Certificate, along with lots of other goodies

.... not a bad deal.

[Ćheese]

Originally Posted by 35racer

Obviously... I never saw this post in time. Sorry about that.

The answer was YES, anyone could have shown up for the party and seminars for $20... and you would have instantly gotten $50 back in the form of a Track Day Gift Certificate, along with lots of other goodies

.... not a bad deal.

Tony,

You forgot to mention a certain party attendee that scored two free track days for the price of a $20 admission and maybe another $10 in raffle tickets. No, it wasn't me but damn I gotta give that lucky bastid props!

[35racer]

Yep, there were some lucky winners that's for sure.

And consider this like the 10th reminder, but those BLUE papers everyone got with the party registration were worth $50 off a trackday this year, not to mention other discounts off stuff from the PHOTO GUY (John Owens) and GMD Computrack.

Just cut up the paper into 3 certs and you have 3 coupons.

For mine, just mail it in with the balance to the address listed on the CHECK PAYMENT button of the TTD website.

Thanks,

[duey]

here's my .o2

Trackday is a controlled environment, corner workers, control riders, instructors, and strict rules. In return we get to hone our riding skills, learn a few things (for some teach), and have fun. Granted the track can't teach us everything regarding potential hazards on the track, but control and concentration it does and to me helps me do so on the streets as well.

I've done a good amount of trackdays in the last 2 years and i myself have not seen another rider's mistake cause another rider to go down. Because of all the rules that are set in place I will always trust the trackdays over the street. TTD's has plenty of riders that take bikes that are not exactly ideal for the track and ride perfectly fine at their own pace, so just because your on a racetrack does NOT mean you must go at breakneck speeds at all. Six years of riding on my belt and about 5-10k mi's a year, and i've had more accidents on the street than the track (some my own stupidity, some others fault)..... so i'll continue to do trackdays rather than ride on the street (because if i go down, i'd rather it be my own damn fault than someone in the street not paying attention).

With great, knowledgeable guys at the track who have years of expirience your riding skills will always rise. Street riding..., depending on the person will only teach you so much before you plateau your skill level unless you have someone to help teach/guide you.


$250 or so bucks for me to go at my own pace, learn alot, and meet great people? Sure why not?

$250 bucks to ride fast without the fuzz "bothering" me? fuck yeah.

All the money i've spent on trackdays, i don't regret a single penny. Guys like Tony, Pete, Ken, Jamie, Graham, and many other fellow trackday riders have taught me more than I would ever have learned on the street by myself.

[Paul_E_D]

Randy doesn't listen, so arguements are pointless, but getting hit head on by a car on my rural farm road last november certainly woke me up to the fact that the street is FAAAAR more dangerous than pretty much any other place you can ride. What happened to me would be like riding into the wall at turn three without turning or braking at 80 mph. (40+40 hit)

Guardrails that cut you in half from a simple lowside are not re-assuring either.

You can get killed at the track too, so any arguement may be a complete sham.

Riding is a cult, and like all cults, we convince ourselves of many "truths" Sometimes, the only way to see the light is to quit and look at it from the outside. Fact is, it's dangerous!