[Kham]

"..and believe me from the 21yrs of riding; skill comes from constant riding.."

[SprintPoser]

Bullshit!

I know riders on Harleys who have 30+ years of riding under their belts, and still can't ride for shit. They've got 30+ years of luck, much of it generated by riding around at a snails pace, holding up Granny in her Toyota Corolla in the corners.

Where does skill come from? Well, IMO, a select few people, perhaps 5% of riders, have it natural-born. The rest of us, it's a developed trait. Skill for the masses comes from a number of sources, but the best ones are:

* MSF training
* Track day experince
* Professional rider courses (CA Superbike School, CLASS, etc.)
* Riding with higher-skilled riders than you, and OBSERVING

That last one can be tricky. If the "fast guy" you're following has crappy lines, you may not know it until you follow him into the woods. OTOH, if he/she knows the roads you're on well, and is exceptionally smooth without running a "race pace", you can really learn a LOT. I sure have.

My 2 cents worth.

[Kham]

.. pull it from some website.

I think it comes down to what level skill we're talking about. I totally agree that at pro level you can't skip tracks.

I thought the general bikers agree that track is a safer environment for practice while pushing your bike to the limits, which means you learn your skill a lot quicker. Does it mean you can't be good practicing somewhere else given the risk? and I don't mean trying to pop the first wheelie on a freeway at speed limit. Hey I'm not trying to be a squid(heh another new term I've learnt) here. It depends on what techniqu you practice. I don't think the guy on harley is interested in the same technique as the a guy say on a sportsbike such as how far can you lean or how high can you do wheelie/stoppie? They're just out there to look cool.

Aren't there a lot of sources for good techniqu such as you guys?

[beet]

others r 2 stupid 2 live takes skill 2 ride . some have the capabilities some dont never will dont care how long you try they will never lern. every one is not smart in the same way .

[ShredHed]

Originally posted by Kham
Aren't there a lot of sources for good techniqu such as you guys?

Yep, lots of opinions too.

Most anybody can learn to ride well if they're curious and motivated but many aren't.

There are plenty of Harley riders that rip, as there are sportbikers who suck.

Ain't just experience, but ya can't be any good without some.
30 years of practicing shitty riding skills makes an experienced shitty rider just as one month of practicing good riding skills makes a decent rider without much experience. -J

[SEVENSGT]

Your level of skill will depend on how and what you ride. I don't think I'm a great rider sometimes don't feel I'm a good rider.

I'm no stunter although I like the ocasional power wheelie, and I'm no road racer, I ride to the best of my ability everytime I mount up.


All you can count on is being the best you can, oh and not getting yourself killed Wheither by car or tree

I know that as time goes on as long as I ride with the people I've meet so far I will be a better rider Hey Jay that includes you(even though I haven't ridin wit you yet)

Do I feel a Group Hug comin on

[Rye]

To some this may seem wrong but I feel that exploring limits is the way to build skill. The Harley rider (or any for that matter) that just kicks the bike over on a saturday for a 3 hour casual putt putt is probably doing more bad than good. I like trying to explore leaning limits, brake hard and late at clear stop lights, initiate a skid when the coast is clear etc. If you're not sharp with these skills then that late braking entry into a blind corner or a car pulling out on you, or that hard braking skid, etc. will likely catch up to you. The machinery we run now is extremely high performing and our skills should match. And call me biased but I feel those skills are attained more easily on a sportbike as opposed to some stretched and raked cruiser (couch) built for show.

[SprintPoser]

Originally posted by ShredHed

There are plenty of Harley riders that rip, as there are sportbikers who suck.

Very true words. As a matter of fact, those familiar with racing at LRRS know well the name Chuck Chouinard. He won 5 classes last year, at least 2 this year in semi-retirement mode. He says he's fully retired from racing now. The last race weekend, he was seen tooling around the paddock on a Night Train, and within days, his sweetheart, Shandra, was out on the web trying to track one down for him.

If you ever thought you could get by ANY Harley on the street, don't for one minute think THAT Night Train wouldn't absolutely dust you.

And yeah, there's a SHITLOAD of sportbike riders out there who have no fucking clue how to ride their bike, but do have a very attractive wallet. Once in a great while, you might find a guy on an expensive sportbike who can ACTUALLY ride it. I know at least one, and he's a helluva nice guy to boot.

[Kham]

Originally posted by ShredHed
Yep, lots of opinions too.

Ain't just experience, but ya can't be any good without some.
30 years of practicing shitty riding skills makes an experienced shitty rider just as one month of practicing good riding skills makes a decent rider without much experience. -J

Ain't that the truth. Did you see the TV show "Worse Case Cenario" where the experience, been doing it daily for some 10 or 20 years and a pro Olympic gold metal, compete? The result was .. I didn't see it. haha..

THe other thing was where appropriate place to practice and where to learn good techniqu. What does it mean without ever seeing a track? You probably won't ride like a pro, but out in the real world, you're not gonna be doing the same track speed corner if you don't want to be a squid, right?

[keet]

......u guys all made some very valid points....ive been riding for some time, and feel that there is always something new to learn...if more people used their common sense,im sure there would be fewer deaths and accidents....one of my major peeves is when i see people pooping down the road at a snails pace,(usually cages,or pickup trucks)...and dont have the curtesy to move over at an appropriate spot.....i find it extremely difficult to contain myself at 20-25mph when the speed limits are way higher....who gets nailed?....the guy that passes....not the dumbass that caused a long line of people sick of the slow pace....
back to the issue of biking skill.......there are a lot of variables to think about concerning skill......age,type of bike,weather, road conditions,etc,etc.....hopefully people will ride with enough interest to learn about all the factors, to keep it REAL, safe, and interesting too.

ps...i ride a "wing"...besides the fj....(and i dont have one of those stupid fuzzy things attached.)..but thats another "topic"

[RandyO]

I can tell you right not, you can take MSF, track days, riding schools, etc and FUCKING FORGET ABOUT THEM ON THE STREET,

the only thing that that stuff provides is the easy stuff, the mechanics of riding.

The only IMPORTANT street skill comes from riding, driving and life experience in general, IF you know when to fuck to slow down you avoid the whole emergency situation to begin with.