[bigred875]

August 24, 2004 -- ACCORDING to the letter to the Hebrews in the New Testament, faith is "the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen." By that criteria, liberals must count nowadays as among the most faithful people in America.
For example, liberals believe that the police in Florida, at the behest of Gov. Jeb Bush, prevented black voters from getting to the polls in the 2000 presidential election . . . yet they can never quite locate a black voter who was in fact prevented from voting.

Liberals believe that the Bush administration tricked the American people into thinking that Iraq was directly responsible for the terrorist attacks of 9/11 . . . yet they can never quite track down a quote from an administration official saying it.

Liberals believe that the Patriot Act has enabled the government to violate the civil rights of American citizens . . . yet they can never quite produce the name of an American citizen whose rights have been violated under its provisions.

Liberals believe that the Bush administration accuses whoever expresses doubts about the War on Terror of being unpatriotic . . . yet they can never quite cite an instance where an administration official has done so.

Liberalism, in its current form, seems less and less like a political viewpoint and more and more like a religious orthodoxy. Its articles of faith persist in the absence of tangible evidence. Its tolerance of dissent is minimal. And its antipathy towards non-believers is seething.

Why not go the whole nine yards and anoint Michael Moore as its prophet?

Originally posted by bigred875

Why not go the whole nine yards and anoint Michael Moore as its prophet?

LMAO

Oh, soooooo true...

[highsider]

"Liberals" - Well, lets see - Dick Cheney has been touting the Iraqi connection to Al Qaeda as recently as last month - he insits that there are documents that they met, and THAT is the big Iraqi connection to 9/11. Let me know if you want a link to a quote of him saying it, I'll have to dig through CNN.com's archives.

"Liberals" have never said the police kept black voters from polls - what they said was that a number of voters, primarily black, were wrongfully (and accidentally) purged from voter rolls by the company that handles Florida's elections - a company that happens to be run by one of Jeb Bush's election committee officials.

The Patriot Act has indeed violated a number of people's civil rights - take for example the teacher from Wisconsin who was held as a terrorist without being charged because he was Islamic and was "supposedly" a secret Al Qaeda agent - only to be cleared of all charges, his career ruined.

"Liberals" dont express doubts about the war on terror - they express doubts about the war in Iraq, which is a nation that has been proven to have nothing to do with terrorism outside of their own country.

Michael Moore isn't our "prophet", he is a filmmaker who made a mover of facts that the whole Bush administration hasn't yet been able to refute.

Sorry, but I'm afraid your goofy little article appears to be

Originally posted by highsider


Michael Moore isn't our "prophet", he is a filmmaker who made a mover of facts that the whole Bush administration hasn't yet been able to refute.

Wait a minute, so if some crackpot makes a film about me full of spin derived from a warped viewpoint in the first place, I would have to bear the burden of refuting whatever was presented?



No, I wouldn't deal with fools, and apparently, neither does the Bush administration...

[bemused]

...knew it just a matter of time before lost-and-not-lamented CT virus poked its head up in here...

Originally posted by bemused


...knew it just a matter of time before lost-and-not-lamented CT virus poked its head up in here...

Don't lie bemus, YOU enjoy it as much as everyone else does. You're a sucker for a good bru-ha-ha and you know it.

[highsider]

Yes, the movie has a slant. Actually, as a liberal, I didn't really like it. He was too busy trying to make connections that didn't exist - ie, between the Bush and BinLaden families.

That said, I would think the Bush administration would want to cover their ass and respond to some of the scarier facts presented in the movie - i.e., where was Bush during Vietnam? Why couldn't he come in and have his physical? Why did Bush have a huge hard-on for Saddam before 9/11 even happened? Why did he want until after 9/11 to do something about Saddam, if he was so worried?

Thats all....no more politics. I've gotten in way too pissing matches with people over politics.

Lets just talk about bikes

[SEVENSGT]

Originally posted by highsider
Why did Bush have a huge hard-on for Saddam before 9/11 even happened? Why did he want until after 9/11 to do something about Saddam, if he was so worried?

Ummm, the USA has had a hard on for sad-damn, since kuwiat, yes even the unmetionalble prez clin-ton.... Not a pissing war, just saying

[highsider]

The difference between Dubya and Clinton is that while Clinton (and the rest of the world, for that matter) was worried about how Saddam was treating his own citizens, Dubya was the one who used a bunch of bogus info and a national tragedy to start a war, getting nearly 1,000 (and counting) of our solidiers, and countless Iraqi innocents killed.

This from a guy who can't account for his own military experience. Perhaps if he'd served in a war, he would have a different perspective of its importance.

Not pissing either, just saying.

I don't understand why so many people place emphasis on where exactly Bush was during Vietnam/military record.... Does it REALLY matter? That was, what, 30 years ago? Whether or not he was or not, how is that relevant to the situation at hand? Clinton is almost a proven draft dodger, yet he's held in such high regard...

just sayin'

[bigred875]

Originally posted by highsider
The difference between Dubya and Clinton is that while Clinton (and the rest of the world, for that matter) was worried about how Saddam was treating his own citizens, Dubya was the one who used a bunch of bogus info and a national tragedy to start a war, getting nearly 1,000 (and counting) of our solidiers, and countless Iraqi innocents killed.

This from a guy who can't account for his own military experience. Perhaps if he'd served in a war, he would have a different perspective of its importance.

Not pissing either, just saying.

lol...trying not to get dragged in...but..lol...lol new blood i guess

You mean the bogus intel our CIA came up with, along with the Britian and Russian intelligent agencies....

Not too mention he had them, had the ability to mass produce them and the balls to use them(as you know...on his own people)

Played games w/ the inspectors..not allowing them in certain places for weeks at a time....

We have found the rooms he kept them in...along with some WMD here and there....

And let's not forget what the actual threat was.....It was NOT that we were afraid Saddam was going to attack us.....it was the he was going to sell them to a terrorist group and they would bring them into this country...

It has been proven that Iraq and Al-Qeda had ties(no link to 9/11 but there is definate proof the they worked for the same team....Iraq was a safe heaven for terrorists)...not to mention the role Saddam played with other terrorist groups...Hammas....

In 98 Clinton made it his TOP priority for a regime change in Iraq...but per usual did nuttin....

I have said this many times.....you want to point ther finger at someone for this war..aim it in the right direction...at SADDAM...he could have stopped this from happening even up to minutes before the 1st bomb went off...

[highsider]

LOL...pardon me, I'm not trying to be a pecker and get the last word in, I'm just a whiny, over-opinionated bitch

IMO, President Bush led us into a war on a witch hunt for "Weapons of Mass Destruction", which we never found. (Which is very peculiar, because during the first Bush's administration, we sold Saddam cluster bombs to help Iraq win the Iran/Iraq war.) Had he actually served in a combat situation, I really think he would have kept his pecker in his pants and got his facts straight before sending soldiers with families over there to die.

I just get upset because every day it seems like we hear a story of a young mother/father/newlywed getting killed over there, in a war that seems to have had no legitimate reason in the first place other than to end a decade old family blood war between Bush and Saddam.

Again, my opinion - I apologize if I come across as a pecker

[bigred875]

Originally posted by highsider
LOL...pardon me, I'm not trying to be a pecker and get the last word in, I'm just a whiny, over-opinionated bitch

IMO, President Bush led us into a war on a witch hunt for "Weapons of Mass Destruction", which we never found. (Which is very peculiar, because during the first Bush's administration, we sold Saddam cluster bombs to help Iraq win the Iran/Iraq war.) Had he actually served in a combat situation, I really think he would have kept his pecker in his pants and got his facts straight before sending soldiers with families over there to die.

I just get upset because every day it seems like we hear a story of a young mother/father/newlywed getting killed over there, in a war that seems to have had no legitimate reason in the first place other than to end a decade old family blood war between Bush and Saddam.

Again, my opinion - I apologize if I come across as a pecker

The world has changed a great deal since the Iran Iraq thing....at that time Iraq was supposed to be our alley and we thought we were dong the right thing....just goes to show you that you cant trust anyone....

[bigred875]

I suppose I should comment on your other points....

Dick Cheney has been touting ........

It shows they work for the same team....see above post about the Iraq/Al-Qeda reletionship

what they said was that a number of voters, primarily black, were wrongfully (and accidentally) purged from voter rolls by the company that handles Florida's elections - a company that happens to be run by one of Jeb Bush's election committee officials.

please link source...how do you accidentally purge black voters...

only to be cleared of all charges, his career ruined.

shit happens and life is sometimes unfair.....these cases are few and far between....and from what I understand there are very specific reasons for any investigation....this is a hard thing to enforce...some people may be effected..but if in the long run it makes this country safer it is a small price to pay...

in any case..please link source..

[highsider]

Its getting warm in here....... LOL

Just to clarify, no one has EVER found ANY WMD in Iraq. If they did, it would be edification, in IMO. They found some rooms that *could* have been used to make sarin gas, but could just as easily been used to make industrial grade hydrogen.

There is NO Iraq/Al Qaeda connection, and ther never was. Saddam, arrogant prick that he was, felt that he was above dealing with the likes of Bin Laden. Saddam did harbor some terroists, granted, and he needed to be removed from power. I just feel that it should have been done on UN's timeframe, not ours. We were right to pressure them to enforce old resolutions that had been ignored; we were wrong when we used their alleged non-compliance to march in like a bunch of cowboys with our ridiculous "coalition of the willing".

I'll have to dig through web site archives to find that story about the Florida election screw up, and how they purged a bunch of voters wrongfully; however, you should know that is an undisputed fact, even now, by the Republican party. I'll post a link to it later today, so you dont think I'm pulling your leg

[highsider]

Here's one link -

http://www.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/...ion/index.html

Interestingly, it says that police did indeed turn black voters away wrongfully, which I thought was BS.....

[odduc]

OK, I cannot stay out of this any longer...

highsider, why is it that people of your political persuasion absolutely refuse to see the TRUTH???? There have been numerous reports that prove the existence of WMD in Iraq. Besides that, you and all of the naysayers, refuse to acknowledge another reason why we went to war in Iraq. Let me lay it out for you and the others, AGAIN: Iraq had numerous ties to several terrorist organizations. ALL of these terrorists groups are intent on killing as many Americans as they can before they go to meet Allah and their great prize. That FACT and that alone is more than enough to justify our war with Iraq. The USA needs not ask permission before defending herself, EVER. Defense of our country is the bottom line, if you don't understand that or refuse to accept, I can't help you.

Please don't misunderstand my response by taking offense, I mean no disrespect whatsoever. But, I feel very strongly about my country and all that we enjoy here and if the President says that we are in danger, I believe him, EVEN IF his name were Clinton. Let's face it, the President is privy to far more detailed information than what we see on the news or online or in the papers, etc.

Now, let's ride...

[highsider]

Fuck it, lets just ride and not bitch about politics (which we have virtually no control over anyway) and kill some pavement

It doesn't appear that any of you are going to be swayed anyway, so I'll save my breath - just be sure you get out and vote in November.

[odduc]

[SEVENSGT]

Originally posted by highsider
It doesn't appear that any of you are going to be swayed anyway, so I'll save my breath - just be sure you get out and vote in November.

check and check