[ZX-12R]

Originally posted by Honclfibr
You mean like this guy? Doesn't look like he was exactly "hopping up" afterwards, and he isn't a small lad.

The farther apart the probes are, the stronger the reaction to the taser. They put a probe by his right shoulder and his left thigh which puts the current through the largest muscle groups of the body. That almost represents the ideal probe placement for incapacitation. After getting tased, he laid there for a few seconds and when he finally tried to get up, he stood up with no problems. He also rode the lightning for the full 5 seconds.

The kid at UCLA was belted with the drive-stun setting. In that mode the probes do not deploy and the stun gun works by contact, delivering a shock to a localized section of the body (like a stun gun). He took a far less severe shock than the officer in the video you posted. He most certainly should have been able to get up.

[zombie]

ACAB

you cannot control your muscles after being tazed as it takes time for the body to recover as I have found out the hard way

here's another one for you guys to look at
A decorated hero marine gunned down in cold blood for the simple crime of association


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The 25-year-old member of the Pagans Motorcycle Club shot to death by Wilmington police on the steps of a row house was a decorated U.S. Marine who survived two combat tours in Iraq.

Derek J. Hale, a probationary member of the club, was shot three times in the chest Monday afternoon by an officer using a department-issued .40-caliber handgun. He was killed after receiving multiple shocks from electronic Tasers, which caused him to "speak gibberish," witnesses said. Police said they found a can of pepper spray and a switchblade knife in Hale's pockets after the shooting.

Police confronted him two days after serving a search warrant on the home's owner, another new member of the Pagans.

Late Thursday, the Delaware State Police identified Hale as a "person of interest" in an 18-month investigation that resulted in the arrests of 12 suspects for felony drug and weapons offenses, saying he was suspected of drug and weapons offenses -- something his family strongly disputes.

Hale lived in Manassas, Va., with his wife, Elaine Hale. The couple had three young children from previous relationships, and planned to have children of their own.

She said Derek was a member of the Pagans but did not discuss "club business." He told her he was visiting Wilmington. "Those who I met and talked with were decent people, like my husband. Derek was a good man."

Virginia police notified Elaine Hale of her husband's death Wednesday, then conducted a search of her home.

"There must have been nine cop cars," said Trina Schaetz, a family friend who was at the house Wednesday. "They took his Pagan T-shirts, patches, coats, motorcycle books and videos. She [Elaine] was just shocked. They made us stand out on the curb."

On Thursday, Elaine Hale retained Wilmington attorney Thomas S. Neuberger to monitor the investigation into her husband's death.

"After two full tours in Iraq, where he was protecting all of us, to die on the Wilmington streets -- I can think of no greater tragedy for small children and a newlywed than to lose a father and a husband," Neuberger said. "And it's even worse that it's done at the hands of trained police officials."

Neuberger said he will file suit if he is not allowed access to the investigative reports of the shooting.

"The leadership of the Delaware State Police is interested in nothing but politics, and their standards of professionalism have plummeted," Neuberger said.

Hale's shooting and the search warrant that preceded it are part of a statewide crackdown that Pagans said had targeted the club.

Several Pagans told The News Journal of other police raids, during which property was seized and members were beaten by police. State Police said 12 people, including the owner of the Hilltop house, have been charged as part of the sweeping investigation. Other Pagans said they have had their motorcycles and club clothing seized, but no charges had been filed.

Wilmington defense attorney Joe Hurley is representing one of the Pagans arrested this week.

"I suspect there's a wiretap -- that's my gut," Hurley said Thursday. "If they don't have criminal charges, they've got conversations. Logically, the rules for seizure are the same as arrest. Police have to have probable cause to believe the property was used in the commission of felonies."

According to the written statement by state police, Hale was seen at the house and investigators observed Hale moving items from inside the residence to a vehicle and "had reason to believe he was preparing to flee."

Police sought to arrest him outside the home, police said. "It was during the attempt to take Hale into custody outside of the residence that a confrontation ensued, and Hale was fatally shot."

Other Pagans were swept up in the raids and later released.

In one instance, Pagan Jim Jollie was visiting a friend's home outside Newark on Saturday when a state police SWAT team threw a flash-bang grenade into the home.

Jollie, a Vietnam veteran, was in a hallway when the stun grenade exploded.

"There was this 'pop,' and then police in black stormed in and told me to put up my hands," he said. "I did."

Jollie said he was then struck on the back of the head by a nightstick, forced to the ground and kicked in the head, ribs and leg.

"They spit on me and cussed me," he said. "There were children in the home."

Wednesday afternoon, Jollie's head and legs were still swollen, and he had difficulty breathing because of two broken ribs. All of his injuries were on the left side of his body.

Handcuffed in the hallway while one officer stood on his neck, Jollie was taken to a back bedroom after police discovered he was wearing his colors with club insignias underneath a denim coat.

"They told me they were gonna cut them off me," he said. "And one guy had out his knife."

Police let him go hours later; however, they confiscated his colors and his 2005 Harley-Davidson. Jollie still doesn't know why his property was seized.

"They said the attorney general wanted it," he said. "They said he'd been after it."

In response to Jollie's allegations, Delaware State Police Superintendent Col. Thomas F. MacLeish announced Thursday that an administrative investigation has been initiated by the Delaware State Police Office of Professional Responsibility.

"The DSP takes any allegation from a citizen very seriously and will conduct a thorough, comprehensive and fair investigation," MacLeish said in a written statement. "Additionally, investigators will follow DSP internal administrative procedures pertaining to violations of state police rules and regulations."

Jollie, a Marine Corps veteran, was taken to the V.A. Hospital for his injuries.

"When the doc saw blood trickling out of my ear, they took me to Christiana," he said.

When he returned home, he learned police had seized his ice cream truck.

"I'd just used it at the [charity] toy run Saturday," he said. "It's my livelihood. We were selling breakfast sandwiches out of it."

He was never charged with a crime.

Jollie said he met Hale several months before he was shot by Wilmington police.

He was a good kid, very respectful. He didnt drink or use drugs, Jollie said. He didnt even smoke cigarettes.

While he was serving his tours in Iraq, Hale and wife Elaine had kept in touch via e-mail.

He wasnt allowed to say much, where he was at or what he was doing, Elaine said in an interview Thursday. He called whenever he could. He was down a lot. He missed me and wanted to come home.

They were married on a beach in North Carolina on Oct. 22 of last year, after Derek finished his second combat tour and was honorably discharged.

He really loved being a Marine, Elaine said. He told me he would serve for a lifetime if they needed him, but he really felt that the divorce rate in the Marines was too high, so he got out. He didnt want anything to happen to our marriage.

Contact investigative reporter Lee Williams at 324-2362 or lwilliams@delawareonline.com. Staff reporter Sean O'Sullivan contributed to this story. Contact Terri Sanginiti at 324-2771 or tsanginiti@delawareonline.com.

http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ article?AID=/20061110/NEWS/611100347/1006/NEWS



and more comes out from the witnesses who were there
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Deleware - The 25-year-old man shot to death last week by a Wilmington officer never threatened police, according to five witnesses working nearby and a sixth witness standing next to the victim when the confrontation began.

Derek J. Hale, a U.S. Marine who served two tours in Iraq, died on the front steps at 1403 W. Sixth St. after a Wilmington police officer fired three .40-caliber rounds into his chest. He was killed after receiving multiple shocks from electronic Tasers.

"He didn't deserve to be shot. He wasn't any kind of threat," said Fred Mixson, 53, a contractor working in the home next door who watched the shooting unfold from across the narrow street. From the initial confrontation with police to the fatal shooting, only two to three minutes elapsed, witnesses said.

Four members of Mixson's work crew witnessed the shooting from a variety of angles and distances, although Mixson was the only one interviewed by investigators after the shooting and the only one willing to allow his name to be used for this article.

But in interviews with The News Journal last week, all five said Hale did not pose a threat.

"No matter what his background was, he didn't deserve that," Mixson said. "They had him surrounded. They could have grabbed him."

The News Journal canvassed the neighborhood. Residents across the street and living next door said they either were away or saw nothing of the events.

Police said Hale, who had recently joined the Pagans Motorcycle Club, was a "person of interest" in a recent drug investigation conducted by the Delaware State Police. The U.S. Department of Justice classifies the Pagans as an outlaw motorcycle gang with a history of violence and drug offenses, but Hale, police have said, has no arrest record in Delaware. At the time of his death, Hale had a valid permit in Virginia to carry concealed weapons, according to the clerk of Circuit Court in Manassas.

Concealed-carry permits in Virginia are issued only to people who never have been convicted of a felony, narcotics or a domestic violence charge and who have no history of mental illness or substance abuse.

Two days before the shooting, officers searched the residence as part of a wide-ranging drug and weapons investigation and had charged the owner. According to a written statement by state police, Hale was seen Nov. 6 moving items from inside the house to a vehicle and officers "had reason to believe he was preparing to flee." Mixson said he saw Hale place a large Tupperware container into the vehicle.

"It was during the attempt to take Hale into custody outside of the residence that a confrontation ensued, and Hale was fatally shot," police said. Hale never displayed a weapon, police said, but a spokesman for the Wilmington police said officers found a can of pepper spray and a switchblade knife in Hale's pockets after the shooting.

Hale's stepbrother, Jason Singleton, who lives in Missouri, never knew his brother to carry a switchblade. "The last time I saw Derek, he had a small Swiss Army knife. To my knowledge, I've never seen Derek with anything like a switchblade."

In a written statement issued last week, Wilmington police Master Sgt. Steven Elliott said Hale was shot three times because an "officer in close proximity to the developments feared for the safety of his fellow officers and believed that the suspect was in a position to pose an imminent threat. That officer then utilized deadly force."

Wilmington police denied a request from The News Journal for their use-of-force policy, which addresses how and when officers may use deadly force and less-than-lethal weapons such as Tasers. They cited an August 2005 Freedom of Information request in which the Attorney General's Office found that the policies are not public documents.

Asked if Hale ever threatened the officers, Elliott said in an interview last week: "In a sense, when he did not comply with their commands" to show him his hands. Wilmington police Chief Michael Szczerba did not respond to calls, e-mails or messages left with his staff about the shooting, although Elliott handled press calls after the incident.

Friday night, John Rago, spokesman for Wilmington Mayor James M. Baker, issued a "joint statement" attributed to Baker, Szczerba and Public Safety Director James N. Mosley.

"The incident that occurred in the 1400 Block of West 6th Street is being investigated internally by both the Wilmington Police Department and City Solicitor's Office," the statement reads. "All information from those investigations will be shared with the Delaware Attorney General's Office which conducts its own investigation and issues its own determination of the action of the officer involved. This is standard practice with regard to shootings involving police officers to ensure that all matters related to the incident are given a thorough review."

The News Journal informed city and police officials that it had received eyewitness accounts that questioned the need for Hale's shooting. In his written statement, Rago said: "If the News Journal, or any other organization or individual, has information regarding this incident that can be helpful to the investigation, it is recommended that they present that information to the Wilmington Police Department, the City Solicitor's Office or to the Delaware Attorney General's Office to aid in the thoroughness of the investigation."

On Monday, Nov. 6, Mixson arrived at the 1400 block of W. Sixth St. just before 4 p.m., quitting time for his work crew, which was renovating one of the row houses next door to the shooting.

Mixson parked across the narrow street from 1403 and was standing by the driver's door of his work van when a black SUV sped up the wrong way of the one-way street and screeched to a halt in the middle of the road.

Several police officers jumped out and ran to where Hale was sitting on the steep steps of 1403, approximately six feet higher than the sidewalk.

Mixson and his crew had barely noticed Hale before he was confronted by police. Hale, they said, was chatting with Sandra Lopez and two children at the top of a 10-step concrete stoop. Hale was seated on the third step from the top. Mixson and another witness were standing across the street from 1403, while others were on the sidewalk in front of a row house adjacent to the site of the shooting.

The officers ordered Hale to take his hands out of the front pockets of his hooded sweat shirt.

"About a second later, they Tasered him," Mixson recalled. "He was just sitting there. He didn't do anything."

A compressed air charge in the Taser cartridge launched two metal barbs, attached to wires trailing back to the hand-held device, at a speed of more than 160 feet per second. On impact, a strong electric charge was carried into Hale's body, which caused what the manufacturer, Taser International, describes as "an immediate loss of the person's neuromuscular control and the ability to perform coordinated action for the duration of the impulse."

The witnesses said Hale shook violently from the charge, as if sitting on an electric chair. His right hand came out of the front of his sweat shirt and was shaking violently.

Seconds later, police repeated their command for Hale to show them his hands, and they Tasered him a second time.

Mixson and others said Hale, who was still seated on the steps, rolled onto his left side and vomited into a flower bed.

"My brother yelled at the police that this was overkill. That this was crazy," Mixson said. "They told him to 'shut ... up,' or they'd show him overkill."

Hale rolled back to his right, into a sitting position, still shaking, and police Tasered him a third time, Mixson said.

Lopez, who lived at the home where Hale was killed and was talking to Hale when police arrived, told her attorney Hale was trying to show police his hands. Lopez was standing with her two young children until police ordered her to move.

Contact investigative reporter Lee Williams at 324-2362 or lwilliams@delawareonline.com. http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/p...NEWS/611150383