[-jro-]

very sorry to hear this.... turn three is evil it scares the shit out of me (hah and I'm on a clunker vintage bike). Here's hoping you have a super speedy recovery Scott!!

[quartetwest]

Scott - I hope you heal up quickly, my friend. In the meantime, I'll be over with some beers and racing vids.

[pps216]

i spoke with eric after sundays races in trophys cause he was banged up and i asked him what happened and he told me what had gone on and i dont want to speak for him or anything but i know he felt really bad about that incident and said he had no intentions on that at all i race him every weekend and is one of the few novices i dont mind going wheel to wheel with but either way it sucks when riders go down

[trackdog]

Originally Posted by Degsy

He only enters F40 as it's supposed to be a gentleman's class where the racing isn't so damn furious. At this rate, he may as well enter the meatgrinder class.

I have said it before and I'll say it again, mixing different types of bikes in the same race is a recipe for disaster. In order to pass on the corners, the 2 strokes and motards are forced to make more and more risky moves. The bikes take different lines and there end up being converging points.

I have ridden them all, 2 strokes, motards and middleweights and they all take different approaches to passing due to specifics of geometry and power. Put the 3 together in a race and it's going to be a problem unless the people racing them are seasoned racers who know how to pass and when to pass. For Novice classes, they should keep the different types of bikes separate.

Alot of this has been said for years. Especially with the advent of the motard.
I saw it all the time. Trackside and racing. You will see this incident happen again and again.
I have no ill feelings against anyone who races motards whatsoever. Wish I had takem R7's invite to turn a few laps on one. but also , let's assume that the same thing may have happened if motards did not exist. Safety for a fellow racer appears to be almost nonexistant at times.

I am suprised something like this happened in F40. Suddenly I do not miss racing so much. As much fun as racing is, I hope everyone realizes that when the green flag drops, you are taking a serious risk. Sucks, but thats a FACT.

Hope things work out for you Scott.

[Degsy]

Originally Posted by pps216

i spoke with eric after sundays races in trophys cause he was banged up and i asked him what happened and he told me what had gone on and i dont want to speak for him or anything but i know he felt really bad about that incident and said he had no intentions on that at all i race him every weekend and is one of the few novices i dont mind going wheel to wheel with but either way it sucks when riders go down

Actually, a couple of others have said that the accident was out of character for him. At least it seem that he does understand that it was a bad one.

If he's that competitive and fast (1:22 on a motard is pretty fast) he really should think about bumping to amateur.

[davemon]

That just blows and from my days racing cars I know how both parties feel... except with cars people are just looking at the checkbook even in some nasty T3 incidents.

A reflection: I did the Penguin racing into school a few weekends back with one of their rental machines. I did that same school in the early 90s and this time I wasn't comfortable even though I was one of the faster folks out there... the passing by others was well beyond what I thought was called for in an intro school. Then again, perhaps it was fine as it IS a racing school. Honestly I thought I had signed up for a sport rider course but when I arrived there was no such school that Friday and I agreed to participate anyway (really wanted to try 900SS before chosing my track bike) without thinking about the lack of passing rules. I think I am done with that and will stick to venues like Tony's and Fishtail where my own actions have a much higher percentage of being my downfall if there is to be one. Being passed really late at the end of 9/beginning of 10 by a guy who couldn't keep it on the track at the exit of 10 was a wakeup call and I don't feel the need to be "there" again.

Hope you heal up fast man! Ibuprofen, ice, warm bath, ice, get the girlfriend to distract your mind, sip a bourbon, nap...

Dave "not a doc"

[lrrs428]

I dont think its fair to crap on motards or say they dont belong on the same track. I do belive in decision making skills and planned passing, especially when there are multiple styles of bikes on track. I spoke to the 350 earlier in that day and he was wanting to move up but was waiting for his minumum of 10 races to do so. Its a shitty situation somone being hurt and bike smashed and its somthing no one likes to see. Hope we can learn from this and if I can help let me know bostongixxer

[ku996r]

rest and heal up scott. lets hope nothing broken internally.

[Degsy]

Originally Posted by lrrs428

I dont think its fair to crap on motards or say they dont belong on the same track. I do belive in decision making skills and planned passing, especially when there are multiple styles of bikes on track. I spoke to the 350 earlier in that day and he was wanting to move up but was waiting for his minumum of 10 races to do so. Its a shitty situation somone being hurt and bike smashed and its somthing no one likes to see. Hope we can learn from this and if I can help let me know bostongixxer

Now go back and re-read the thread. No-one was crapping on motards OR saying they don't belong on the same track. Just not at the same time...in novice. There are too many racers out there who are racing their FIRST race.

Thanks for the info in 350 waiting to move up. He should get to bump as 1:22 is freaking fast for a less-than-10 novice on a 'tard.

[DucDave]

Well...that sucks...

The very reason I quit racing was I didn't think I could get out of Novice quick enough. My first novice race an asswipe took me out on 1a...yeah, I was leaned over, right knee practically on the curbing, and this asswipe tried to dive inside me...huh???

Anyway, everyone said to me, "That's racing...get over it." I raced one more novice race later in the season and decided I was too old to compete.

Back to track days...suits me fine....

[finao]

Scotty, This really sucks the knee and the bike. You already had a bad right knee now the left. That is a bunch of damage on the brand new bike, Fawk! I also hope the kids are ok as you said fortunately they did not see the actual crash. My son cried when I went down a couple of weeks ago and it breaks your heart. Tallk to you soon, Joel

[Paul_E_D]

It's the most dangerous sport I know of. Didn't you guys get the memo?!

Given that, reckless riding should be policed by the community. However, peer pressure is our only tool.

You can't go out there without the knowledge that someone may make a bad judgement and hurt or kill you. That's why people have diarrhea before every race for the first few years. Their body is absolutely aware of the risk. (stay away from the bathroom before the start of racing, phew)

[GixerJockey]

This sucks. You are out there with people that are supposed to be capable on the track. It's is not asking too much for the other racers to make a clean pass. It's not on me to make sure someone else doesn't plow into me. Sure, accidents happen, but to get t-boned entering a turn is over the line...

[Honclfibr]

It's a thin line.

[BMFR6]

a blurred line even.

[Ken C]

Poor jugement in the heat of battle. I was taken out the same way in the same place by the class champion in PRACTICE! He was sorry, but I told him he should have known better.

You've had some tough luck Scott. Heal up.

[RyanNicholson]

Originally Posted by BMFR6

a blurred line even.

+1

this is why one of the first things they tell you is no matter what happens out there, you say "sorry bud" and leave it at that. we all accept that risk when we go out. i'm sure the guy feels terrible about what happened, getting angry and throwing fists wont help anything.

[Degsy]

OK, I have calmed down a little now, so I must apologize for the emotive first post in this thread. It was how I felt at the time and I should have waited to post.

So, I apologize for the name calling and I'll delete it, but I still feel the same way about the attempted pass.

derek

[virtualbong]

Originally Posted by RyanNicholson

+1

this is why one of the first things they tell you is no matter what happens out there, you say "sorry bud" and leave it at that. we all accept that risk when we go out. i'm sure the guy feels terrible about what happened, getting angry and throwing fists wont help anything.

Agreed, but the guy should know that everyone knows what he did and look down upon it. Hopefully he will be smarter than that next time.

[DucDave]

Originally Posted by Degsy

OK, I have calmed down a little now, so I must apologize for the emotive first post in this thread. It was how I felt at the time and I should have waited to post.

So, I apologize for the name calling and I'll delete it, but I still feel the same way about the attempted pass.

derek

Classy Degs....

[RyanNicholson]

Originally Posted by virtualbong

Agreed, but the guy should know that everyone knows what he did and look down upon it. Hopefully he will be smarter than that next time.

Right, thats kinda what I mean....I'm sure he'll learn from it and avoid a similar situation in the future.

Originally Posted by DucDave

Classy Degs....

+1

[Paul_E_D]

Right on Degs.

[Degsy]

Originally Posted by RyanNicholson

+1

this is why one of the first things they tell you is no matter what happens out there, you say "sorry bud" and leave it at that. we all accept that risk when we go out. i'm sure the guy feels terrible about what happened, getting angry and throwing fists wont help anything.

Sorry Ryan, that just doesn't cut it when negligence is involved. Take a look around for the several lawsuits that have been successfully brought against racers and race tracks for negligence. Just because it's a closed circuit it doesn't mean you can be negligent and get away with it.

Any number of small factors could have come into play that could have resulted in the "sorry bud" being said to Scott's fatherless sons. It's dangerous enough already without yahoos dreaming they are in motogp.

BTW, nice going this weekend Ryan.

[Honclfibr]

Originally Posted by virtualbong

Agreed, but the guy should know that everyone knows what he did and look down upon it. Hopefully he will be smarter than that next time.

You'd be surprised, with the adrenaline going and everything happening so fast it is possible to make stupid moves out there without even recognizing that they're stupid, especially as a novice.

I remember one time I was up looking at the race results and I hear some guy mumbling my race number. I go over and tell him that I'm rider 386, and he kinda flips out at me. Apparently I passed him on the inside before turn three, missed a shift, went wide and cut him off, forcing him to jam on his brakes and run off the track (fortunately without crashing).

Now, I vaguely remember the missed shift but that was really the extent of it, I'm sure I passed him like he said but at the time even if I could have done anything about it my brain wasn't thinking "you just passed this guy on the inside, don't run this wide" it was thinking "oh fuck I missed a shift oh shit what do I do oh fuck fuck fuck fuck".

Anyway I apologized to the guy as I would to anyone I caused to run off the track, intentionally or not...my point is, until he came up to me and said something I hadn't even considered that there might have been a problem.

Granted, it's a little different than T-Boning someone but yeah, as a beginning racer it can be a bit of information overload out there, hopefully we are smart enough not to do stupid and dangerous things but unforunately a lot of that understanding comes with experience. Until then, sometimes it takes a "you fucked up here, and this is why" from someone more experienced to really understand how stupid what we did really was.

[BMFR6]

Originally Posted by Degsy

Sorry Ryan, that just doesn't cut it when negligence is involved. Take a look around for the several lawsuits that have been successfully brought against racers and race tracks for negligence. Just because it's a closed circuit it doesn't mean you can be negligent and get away with it.

Any number of small factors could have come into play that could have resulted in the "sorry bud" being said to Scott's fatherless sons. It's dangerous enough already without yahoos dreaming they are in motogp.

BTW, nice going this weekend Ryan.

well said.