groups (was: saturday 8/7)

[chr|s sedition]

"I sped passed the group leaders 5 or so bikes about a mile into 8A, because I know that road well and felt I wanted to ride it faster."

ok, i do this all the time...especially when I know the road better than other people i'm riding with. the problem is people seemed to get pissed at me for doing so. "if your going to ride w/people, ride with them not way ahead". i dunno if it is the people i ride with or me. this going way out ahead rude? are my friends jerks? how does everyone else handle this issue and how do others react when you do it or have it done to you?

i'm starting to get sick of riding with people...you have like be "considerate" of everyone else and not hammer through the roads w/o worrying about who is keeping up


anyway, thoughts, comments, etc...
-chr|s sedition

[Half Squid]

Inconsiderate??? Ask my friends, Maybe it was wrong, but in no way was it a disconcern of my fellow riders/friends. I saw two of my fellow riders/friends in my rear view mirror for quite a while before I realized they were no longer there and what could have possibly happened. I was indeed very concerned. This bothers me a bit you qouted and posted this.....

I dont know you and never have rifdin with you never mind the fact you were not on this ride and did not witnessed what occurred...

So ppl on the ride I have asked this before, did I make a bad decision or piss anyone off? Didn't seem as if I did...

[skiierx]

Originally posted by Half Squid
[BI dont know you and never have rifdin with you never mind the fact you were not on this ride and did not witnessed what occurred...

So ppl on the ride I have asked this before, did I make a bad decision or piss anyone off? Didn't seem as if I did... [/B]

You taking the lead was fine with me, you know the road better than I do and I knew that, so no issues here!

Jamie

[TheIglu]

Please keep in mind before reading this post:

I lead my first large ride on Saturday.

I saw in my rear view mirror the beginnings of the accident.

I saw what caused it and what could have been done to avoid that situation.

I don't blame any thing other than "shit happens".

That being said, here's my tyraid.


You ride your own ride. If they feel like they need to stay close to you, then they should be on the back of your bike riding bitch.

Pass only when appropriate and when the person in front KNOWS you are going to do so, or at least give them a whole lane of space. It's not fun having someone go rippin by you with no warning at all.

If the pace is too fast for you, don't go that fast. If it is too slow, pass and go faster. Don't make the rider in front have to worry about you and what's in front of him/her.


NEVER ride close behind someone. That creates situations like what we had on saturday.

Stagger when not in the twisties. Straighten out and leave LOTS of space in the twisties. Saturday's events would not have happened if there was enough space.

Take corners responsibly. Tripple apexing a corner to show people how far you can lean isn't helping anyone. Do that crap on your own time. Smoothness is key.

If you are hard on the binders before every corner, you are racing and therefore on a track.

Ride at "the pace". Light braking should be reserved for tighter than normal corners and keeping very heavy bikes slowed down a little bit (like my Z-Rex, a tap of the front well before the corner helped the rpm's to drop and kept people following knowing there was a sharp corner comin up).

Group rides aren't free for all's. You have to realize that your actions and skill level will have a direct effect on the ride.



Half Squid is someone I ride with often. I know his skills and had no problem with him goin on ahead. He knows the road. If you ride in a group who knows each other's riding skills, there shouldn't be a problem with people wanting to do their own things. We don't ride in "packs" like Squids and Harley riders. We each ride our own ride, but we like to do it together. Remeber to ride your own ride, and that nobody else is responsible for telling you when to pass, how fast to go, where the cop is sitting, how sharp the corner is, etc.

[bemused]

uh, Mike?

it looks like he's talking about himself... just using YOUR quote to reference something he does himself. don't think he was taking a shot @ you...

FWIW... concerning the ORIGINAL QUESTION, my feeling is: if you can pass safely, go for it. just don't blast so far off into the distance that you're in danger of losing anyone following... stop @ the next intersection, etc, etc (normal group ride etiquette). no biggie...

if it becomes a regular problem, where you find yourself wanting to consistently go lots faster than the group...

...find another group!

[skiierx]

For the record, Mike just took the lead and did not blast way ahead! He had everyoone behind him and with in his view until the twisties. All was good until that corner! I do not think anyone had a problem with the pace or him taking up the front! He rode responsibly!

Clayton summed it up though!

Jamie

[Kham]

it is as simple as how well you know the person or group and how much respect you have for people you'v just met. i know Joe doesn't mind if i pass him safely or other way around but with squidly pace we're riding he's better off ahead with the radar protection. on the other hand i wouldn't pass someone like Degsy, Mark, Half Squid, etc. unless he wants me too.

[Half Squid]

Originally posted by bemused
uh, Mike?

it looks like he's talking about himself... just using YOUR quote to reference something he does himself. don't think he was taking a shot @ you...

Kind of looks incriminating to me?? Maybe , maybe not...



Thanks for the vote of confidence of my riding, and glad I didn't do anything wrong to opset the group....

Who's riding Sunday? Now Who wants to ride with me ?

[bemused]

Originally posted by Half Squid
Kind of looks incriminating to me?? Maybe , maybe not...



Thanks for the vote of confidence of my riding, and glad I didn't do anything wrong to opset the group....

Who's riding Sunday? Now Who wants to ride with me ?

hell, I'll ride w/ you any time... but I'm likely to be between bikes this weekend...

[benVFR]

Crashes suck, group rides require care.

My guess is Half Squid went through that corner 10mph faster than any of you if he had taken off ahead. The pictures don't look like the corner was in particularly tough shape at all.

What I see every time I go on a group ride and ride in the back is that the less experienced the riders are, the less willing they are to accelerate through a corner.

If the person ahead of you accelerates through the corner and you don't, you then have a gap to make up on the next straight. So you open the throttle more than the guy in front of you. He's setting up for the next corner while you have the throttle at WOT trying to catch up. Then you have to work harder to get set up for the next corner than he does, and the whole cycle repeats.

It is a cycle that will get the less experienced rider who is following in trouble every time if he's not careful. You have to recognize that situation and just let the guy open up a gap on you, and ride your own ride. Once you have got the cornering skill down it is absolutely amazing how fast you can close in on riders ahead of you if they wacked it on a straight and you didn't.

I doubt Mike was on the gas much on the straights, I've never seen him ride a "dangerous pace". Fast, but not dangerous.

Ben

[KB]

There is only one thing that will come out of this and that is a lesson learned. Unfortunately the hard way but still a valuable lesson!!!!

Group rides can be tricky. One thing I like to do before I ride with people I have never been out with is ask them if they have any rules and such. That way everyone knows ahead of time what is expected. I also ask them if they don't mind breathing in some oil burning when I am in front of them!!!

Here is a good read on group rides that JC did back in the day.

http://www.nestreetriders.com/forum/...=&threadid=237



KB

[chr|s sedition]

Originally posted by Half Squid
Inconsiderate??? Ask my friends, Maybe it was wrong, but in no way was it a disconcern of my fellow riders/friends. I saw two of my fellow riders/friends in my rear view mirror for quite a while before I realized they were no longer there and what could have possibly happened. I was indeed very concerned. This bothers me a bit you qouted and posted this.....

I dont know you and never have rifdin with you never mind the fact you were not on this ride and did not witnessed what occurred...

So ppl on the ride I have asked this before, did I make a bad decision or piss anyone off? Didn't seem as if I did...

whoa, whoa...i was saying in *anyway* that you were being inconsiderate! I in fact said that I do the same thing all the time...and that people i ride with often chide *ME* for being incosiderate. I was wondering if others have delt with the same issue. I *never* implied or meant to imply that what you did was wrong!

-chr|s sedition

[chr|s sedition]

Originally posted by chr|s sedition
whoa, whoa...i was saying in *anyway* that you were being inconsiderate! I in fact said that I do the same thing all the time...and that people i ride with often chide *ME* for being incosiderate. I was wondering if others have delt with the same issue. I *never* implied or meant to imply that what you did was wrong!

-chr|s sedition

whoops, typo. I mean to so that in NO WAY was I trying to say you were being inconsiderate. I was talking about my experiences, how people reacted to me, and used your post as a launching point for the subject (indicating that i'm not the only one who does this).

[Kham]

Originally posted by chr|s sedition
whoops, typo. I mean to so that in NO WAY was I trying to say you were being inconsiderate. I was talking about my experiences, how people reacted to me, and used your post as a launching point for the subject (indicating that i'm not the only one who does this).

you can pass me and turbo charge all you want. that's me though.

[Half Squid]

Originally posted by chr|s sedition
whoops, typo. I mean to so that in NO WAY was I trying to say you were being inconsiderate. I was talking about my experiences, how people reacted to me, and used your post as a launching point for the subject (indicating that i'm not the only one who does this).

Ok. Thats fine. Just looked scetchy when I first read it, and being a direct quote...
Well I do see one good thing about your post in my benifit, I am glad to hear people are kewl with my riding! I am very glad to hear that, I try to ride and treat people as they would like to be treated. I do tend to ride fast, and think I need to tone it down on the street, not sure I can control myself? But being on the track today is a whole different ball game!! "NO FEAR" well maybe a little.. But you can tear it up and not worry about cages, people, debri, dogs, sand.. Wow now thats wear you ride hard and fast!!!!! I got some awesome pictures from today taken by the expert! He got me in turn 1A on the R1 with a puck on the ground!!!!

[ftrain]

Originally posted by Half Squid
I am glad to hear people are kewl with my riding!

You riding sucks squid, I will wax yo ass

[KB]

I ride fast and danger!!

[R7]

Originally posted by chr|s sedition
"I sped passed the group leaders 5 or so bikes about a mile into 8A, because I know that road well and felt I wanted to ride it faster."

ok, i do this all the time...especially when I know the road better than other people i'm riding with. the problem is people seemed to get pissed at me for doing so. "if your going to ride w/people, ride with them not way ahead". i dunno if it is the people i ride with or me. this going way out ahead rude? are my friends jerks? how does everyone else handle this issue and how do others react when you do it or have it done to you?

i'm starting to get sick of riding with people...you have like be "considerate" of everyone else and not hammer through the roads w/o worrying about who is keeping up


anyway, thoughts, comments, etc...
-chr|s sedition

Sounds like you're either better off riding alone or leading the rides you go on I been doing the group riding thing for quite a few years now and what you're describing is probably the MOST inconsiderate thing that can be done to a group ride leader Probably the main reason why you don't see many big group rides posted anymore, most just don't feel like babysitting children
Your friends are trying to tell you something and give you some good advice, listen to them!!

[chr|s sedition]

Originally posted by R7
Sounds like you're either better off riding alone or leading the rides you go on I been doing the group riding thing for quite a few years now and what you're describing is probably the MOST inconsiderate thing that can be done to a group ride leader Probably the main reason why you don't see many big group rides posted anymore, most just don't feel like babysitting children
Your friends are trying to tell you something and give you some good advice, listen to them!!

thanks for the feedback. i will admit that out of the 3-4 people i ride with on a regular basis I am a bit faster. i also almost always lead. i suppose i should either ride with faster people or be mindful / considerate of the group i am with. again, thanks for the feedback. It's good to have people keep me in check

-chr|s sedition

[zombie]

Originally posted by bemused
hell, I'll ride w/ you any time... but I'm likely to be between bikes this weekend...

get a lift down here and take the RF home and I'll leave the plate on it for you if ya want to ride

[VFRKeith]

It sounded like you guys had some good rules worked out for Sunday. Sometimes shit just happens, despite the best preparation.

Usually if someone is more familiar with a road and wants to ride it faster I would work it out with them ahead of time that they will lead through that section.

I think it's also a good idea that all new riders to the group and those less experienced go to the back until they prove themselves.

I've ridden 8A and believe that it is a challenging section. You can't take that turn at full speed because it's a blind section. It descends and if you've never ridden it before you have no idea which way. After you can see the curve it decreases its radius. Then you have to immediately set up for a right hander afterward. Very tricky. It just sounds like people went in too hot and were too close together. You can go over the rules beforehand but that's no guarantee that in the heat of the ride people will abide by them. Ultimately each person has to be responsible for their own riding.

Group riding can be high risk/high reward. Sounds like everyone (even those of us not on the ride) learned something from the experience.

[SEVENSGT]

i just like playing sweeper

[Half Squid]

Originally posted by ftrain
You riding sucks squid, I will wax yo ass

Hey Gimp. Tie those dam legs to the bike hold on to one crutch while riding and use it to prop yourself up when we stop so I can show you a little something beeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaatch....

[lefty954]

after riding a bunch of times with mike and jamie i would never question what they do...it is these 2 and maybe 1 other that i give full confidence too...nobody on here should have second thoughts about it with them...of course i keep up with them and sometimes have to back of to make them feel good about themselves..they hate when a squid qith chrome rims passes them...

[Half Squid]

Originally posted by lefty954
[Bsometimes have to back of to make them feel good about themselves..they hate when a squid qith chrome rims passes them... [/B]

Nice !!!!

What are ya doing tomorrow Lefty???? I have to work till 11 AM, but taking the bike to work and heading to Motorsports in Webster after.. Wanna go?