Braking technique advice

[The Snowman]

Since most of us are dying to get on the bikes and ride, I figured I'd ask questions about technique for track/race riding.

Since I'm not a very experienced track rider (5 days total at NHMS over 2 seasons), I'd like to get some definitions and advice.

Trail braking. What exactly is it? Benefits? Drawbacks?

When NOT to brake.

Overall braking techniques. My issue is that I tend to hit the throttle hard then brake hard. One of these days, it's going to catch up to me and I'll tuck the front end under braking.

Let's try to keep this on-topic without BS, so it's beneficial to would-be track riders. Thanks in advance.

[union]

Trail braking is when youre braking into the corner. Instead of grabing the brake and letting it go while straight up and down you brake into the apex while letting off the brake. Its hard for me to explain because unlike many things on bikes that came to me easily. Youll be able to enter the corner a little faster and get through it more precise. If youre not careful you can end up crashing. It can be done in the rain to good affect too but its easier to lose the front.

Worst time to brake is when youre leaned over especially if youre off the brakes completely. It will upset the front and will either try to lowside you or pick the bike up. Ive had a few close calls coming up on slower riders where I had to grab a little front brake to avoid hitting them. I wonder if a littler rear would have been better but Id rather not test it

[OreoGaborio]

Trail braking is basically defined as braking (front OR rear) after turn-in.... so braking while leaned over. The term comes from how the action of trail braking should be performed.... the more you lean the bike, the more you have to "trail" off the brakes.

Click this - http://www.foreven.com/trackdod/NoviceGuide/ and scroll almost 1/2 way down until you see the Traction Circle... that's where it talks about trail braking.
It's a good article to read all the way through as well. I may not agree 100% with every single word, but it's concisely written and a decent overview of all the basics and some of the more advanced skills.

As for when NOT to brake.... well... I dunno if there is a time (EXCLUDING extenuating circumstances) when you should never brake unless of course you're already at the limit of traction. But as long as you listen to what the front tire is doing and it tells you there's some traction left to apply the brakes and you do so smoothly and progressively, you should be alright. Depending on what the circumstances are though, you might be better off with more pressure on that inside handlebar.

[Awesome]

turning in while on the brakes keeps the suspension compressed for a faster and quicker turn in. Getting off the brakes before turn in extends the front and makes the bike turn in slower since the suspension goes back to extended. It also upsets the bike more since the suspension is going from compressed to extended back to compressed.

[Paul_E_D]

The benefits of trail braking are that it reduces trail, making it easier to turn the bike AND it weights the front tire giving it more traction that is needed to change directions at high speeds/Gforces. You can brake later than the next guy if you can use the brakes deeper into the corner. Good for passing.

The downsides are that that you can exceed the traction limits as lean angle increases. A fall is almost instantaneous. This means it requires feel and skill to trail brake, especially in traffic, in bumps, and in limited traction situations. Also, it's possible to scrub a LOT of speed this way generally slowing you laptimes.

The only time you should not brake on track is when its unexpected. On the straights, before the commonly accepted braking zones, mid corner after you're leaned in, exiting a corner. Someone WILL hit you.

[CEO]

You've already gotten the definition Chuck... I would point out that after 5 track days you might not want to experiment much or at all with trail braking yet. You've got enough other basics to improve on before trying an advanced technique. Like Paul said, you tuck the front and you're down. No warning. And it hurts.

Also, it's possible to scrub a LOT of speed this way generally slowing you laptimes.

Good point... I noticed when I started trying to trailbrake effectively that I was braking later and deeper into the corner, but cornerspeeds decreased, driving out of the corner became a little hairier due to the decreased speed, and laptimes didn't really change. This is something I still need to work on.

[RyanNicholson]

yea what these guys said. Technique-wise you want to squeeze the brake as hard as you can (smoothly though, don't stab) at your brake marker to shave off the majority of your speed then set your roll speed by trail braking. This lets you brake later, smoother, etc. Like hesso said, this also compresses the front and lets the bike turn in faster... this also makes for a smoother transition from braking hard to cornering as you're letting off the brakes while leaning over.

In fact if you think about it, you can't even really turn a bike hard without the front brakes.

[Rambunctous]

I have been working on hitting the front brake while wheelieing over the hill so when it comes down it leaves smoke like a 747 landing. Makes cool pics and a crowd pleaser too.

[Ken C]

Check out the second video down for an explanation and a drill to learn the technique.
Riding in the Zone-Trail Braking Video

[CBR929RE]

You've already gotten the definition Chuck... I would point out that after 5 track days you might not want to experiment much or at all with trail braking yet. You've got enough other basics to improve on before trying an advanced technique. Like Paul said, you tuck the front and you're down. No warning. And it hurts.

Good point... I noticed when I started trying to trailbrake effectively that I was braking later and deeper into the corner, but cornerspeeds decreased, driving out of the corner became a little hairier due to the decreased speed, and laptimes didn't really change. This is something I still need to work on.

I've done 6-8 track days each year since I started 3 years ago. I just got into the advanced group my last day this summer and I still really feel I'm hardly exploiting the brakes on the bike. I've started trail braking a little to get a feel for it but never all the way to the apex yet. I'd say you really shouldn't be trail braking a lot until you feel you have your corner entry speed high enough where you think you can brake a little later. Like I usually do almost if not all of my braking while straight up, sometimes I'll brake too much and have a lower corner speed than I know I'm capable of. So I think I'm sort of at a point where I think I'm learning how much faster I can go and using the brakes less. Its probably a transition period from being new at it and thinking I'm going too fast to trying to stop the habit of braking where I used to because I know I can go faster now. After that it'll be like I can use trail braking to make little corrections to speed and line because the corner speed is close to where I want it.

I have been working on hitting the front brake while wheelieing over the hill so when it comes down it leaves smoke like a 747 landing. Makes cool pics and a crowd pleaser too.

I hope you're joking. this is such a bad idea its not even funny. my very first track day I was at Grattan Raceway in MI and the very first session one guy came over the hump and must have touched the front brakes a little by accident, when the front wheel touched down it flipped him right over. the bike landed on top of him. He died 3 days later from complications due to the injuries. kinda scary to have a crash happen to an experienced person before you ever go out on track for your very first time.

[Pittenger5]

Ive always trail braked without even realizing what I was doing. In the wet I have to say out loud in my helmet not to trail brake as much as usual.

[OreoGaborio]

The entries to turns 1 and 11 are good spots to begin experimenting with trail braking.... Good grip in those areas and the entries to both turns are both braking zone and mild turns within themselves, plus there's plenty of run-off should it go wrong.

[The Snowman]

I would point out that after 5 track days you might not want to experiment much or at all with trail braking yet. You've got enough other basics to improve on before trying an advanced technique. Like Paul said, you tuck the front and you're down. No warning. And it hurts.

I didn't say I wanted to try it. I just wanted to know exactly what it was. Yes, I have heard the definition before, but as I do not head to the track often, my senile old self doesn't remember what the definitions for these terms are.

That said, I do try and do my braking before I tip in. Unfortunately, as a complete novice at track riding, it doesn't always happen this way and I do end up doing some trail braking. Luckily, to date, I have not had an incident as a result of it. However, I have noticed what Paul mentioned above, that it can scrub speed, sometimes substantially.

At least I will have more time out there this coming season, so I can work on it. Keep the input coming.

[OreoGaborio]

Chuck, if you ask me, I'd say you've got enough experience to start experimenting with it. Just EASE your way into it, keep track of your referrence points and listen to what the front wheel is saying to you.

[Crash Dummy Denno]

Take Doug Polen's 1on1 School if you ever get the chance - well worth the $

You will learn how to trail brake and why (as you're doing it) with him talking to you in your helmet... and its a safe way to learn the technique

[Kurlon]

The entries to turns 1 and 11 are good spots to begin experimenting with trail braking.... Good grip in those areas and the entries to both turns are both braking zone and mild turns within themselves, plus there's plenty of run-off should it go wrong.

I'd be careful with 1 though, there are a couple bits of bumpy pavement right near the line I've noticed since the repave. Might be just enough to turn an experiment into a yardsale? If you know the line and nail it every time you should be fine.

[CEO]

listen to what the front wheel is saying to you.

I hear this language a lot and I don't think the average new track rider has the ability to do that at all. They don't know what a sliding front or rear tire feels like, etc. Just like the guy running 2:10's comes into the pits and talks about his rear tire sliding all over the place, a track newbie trying to "listen to the front tire" is going to tuck the front and crash in most cases where they try to experiment with hard trail braking...

You did say to ease into it, and that's really the only way to do it I think... and you'll likely get some bumps and bruises in the process if you don't ease into it very slowly...

[The Snowman]

I'd be careful with 1 though, there are a couple bits of bumpy pavement right near the line I've noticed since the repave. Might be just enough to turn an experiment into a yardsale? If you know the line and nail it every time you should be fine.

Not sure if I nail T1. I seem to go a little more shallow than most of the people who were riding the track. I was using that orange square as a reference point and rolling right over that (no, I wasn't look at it as I was rolling over it). Then you have to tip it in hard before the apex. Is this or is this not right? I saw a lot of people going wider after the repaving.

[OreoGaborio]

I'd be careful with 1 though, there are a couple bits of bumpy pavement right near the line I've noticed since the repave. Might be just enough to turn an experiment into a yardsale? If you know the line and nail it every time you should be fine.

True that... there's a bump right in the middle of what most people think is the line, right when you cross from the old pavement onto the new (I'm to the inside of that)... but most track day riders should be off the brakes by then... hell, most are probably be off the brakes by the time they come off the banking & onto the apron... if not, they probably should be.

I hear this language a lot and I don't think the average new track rider has the ability to do that at all. They don't know what a sliding front or rear tire feels like, etc. Just like the guy running 2:10's comes into the pits and talks about his rear tire sliding all over the place, a track newbie trying to "listen to the front tire" is going to tuck the front and crash in most cases where they try to experiment with hard trail braking...

You did say to ease into it, and that's really the only way to do it I think... and you'll likely get some bumps and bruises in the process if you don't ease into it very slowly...

I dunno what you're talking about, I knew exactly what my front tire was doing the first time I ever got onto a bike... And if you believe that, I also put down a 1:11 my first track day

[RyanNicholson]

Not sure if I nail T1. I seem to go a little more shallow than most of the people who were riding the track. I was using that orange square as a reference point and rolling right over that (no, I wasn't look at it as I was rolling over it). Then you have to tip it in hard before the apex. Is this or is this not right? I saw a lot of people going wider after the repaving.

you're on the fast line, maybe hair tight but not much.

[The Snowman]

you're on the fast line, maybe hair tight but not much.

Wow, then I'm actually doing something right.

Do most newer riders tend to grab the brake, rather than squeeze it? My biggest mistakes have come from panicking coming into 3 and 1 and grabbing too much brake at one time. Thankfully, I haven't reached the limits of my traction, yet.

The only incident I had was due to improper line and too much input into the bars and had nothing to do with braking. I can only hope that the future holds the same with regard to braking.

Do you think any of the track day organizations would consider doing something similar to the Polen school where you would have someone speaking to you about your line and technique? Get one of the really seasoned veterans who do track days to run it. (Ken, Graham, Degsy, etc...)

As expected, it would come as an additional fee.

[CEO]

Do most newer riders tend to grab the brake, rather than squeeze it? My biggest mistakes have come from panicking coming into 3 and 1 and grabbing too much brake at one time. Thankfully, I haven't reached the limits of my traction, yet.

Braking is the hardest place to get proficient IMO... it's where I still need the most work.

Just an FYI... when straight up and down, you cannot reach 'the limits of your traction' on dry pavement on a motorcycle... you will just lift up the rear wheel.

When you feel the rear wheel wagging around a bit, that's how you know you're getting to the limit of effective front brake, because the rear wheel is so light it's skimming along the ground.

[RyanNicholson]

Wow, then I'm actually doing something right.

Do most newer riders tend to grab the brake, rather than squeeze it? My biggest mistakes have come from panicking coming into 3 and 1 and grabbing too much brake at one time. Thankfully, I haven't reached the limits of my traction, yet.

The only incident I had was due to improper line and too much input into the bars and had nothing to do with braking. I can only hope that the future holds the same with regard to braking.

Its just like everything else, it takes practice to learn but your brakes will take a STUPID amount of abuse if applied smoothly. Jabbing the brakes will lock the wheel and upset the bike but you'd be amazed at what your brakes can really do without breaking traction on their own. What gets tricky is learning the balance of lean vs. braking once you're in the corner. The tricky part of it isn't the act of doing it, its just getting a sense of what the bike is telling you and getting a feel for how the front tire is reacting.

Also, most trackday people take wider entrance into T1... however if you watch the faster guys on a race day they'll all go right by that box you're using as a ref point.

[a13x]

The entries to turns 1 and 11 are good spots to begin experimenting with trail braking.... Good grip in those areas and the entries to both turns are both braking zone and mild turns within themselves, plus there's plenty of run-off should it go wrong.

Yea, you can't NOT trailbrake in T11 since you are never truly straight up and down on the bike.

[Ken C]

I have experimented with communicators on track with my wife and it proved to be an excellent tool. As much as I'd like to do more of this, it is logistically difficult to do at a typical track day. A track school can do this, because the instructor to student ratio is very low, however this means that the cost is very high.