Count Down Till' 2011 Race Season

[BrianC]

Intentionally, no. I've never had reason to think he'd steer someone wrong unless he knows you and is just screwing with ya. I just think it's a case of him not realizing the rules say no to just dropping vents to the belly pan.

I know he races the same bike as me so I thought he should know, but that is why I'm asking, so as to make sure I don't show up unprepared.

Another country heard from on this one..........................

One other thing to consider is riding/racing in the rain. I have seen in the past that the lower on some fully faired bikes have some rubber plugs in them such that when it is raining they can be pulled so that rain water doesn't build up in the belly pan during racing and then slosh out in front of your rear tire causing traction issues. I have no idea if this is fully rule book legal but I have definitely seen it done this way. So if you have this situation you would be much better off having a catch can so as to prevent these slippery fluids from draining out in front of your rear tire and causing the aforementioned traction issues.

Joel

Yes, the drain holes are there in case it rains, but the vent hoses aren't venting oil. One is fuel, and the other is water (coolant).

Just a personal thought, but I would be doing whatever I could to avoid dropping fluids on the track. Not only to limit the chances of causing yourself to crash, but also to avoid being "that guy" who drops oil on the track causing a multi bike pileup and/or a long delay for fluid cleanup. Its easy enough to run the vents into a plastic bottle ziptied somewhere out of the way.

Yeah I hear you, but there just isn't anywhere "out of the way" on this bike!

["Dangerous" Dan K]

On the topic of LRRS racing, am I the only one starting to worry about our April race? I don't know if they'll plow that track, but I'm starting to wonder where we'll be in April. We have 3+ feet on the ground right now, with more storms to come.

[lrrs313]

They have had to plow the track for the SCCA event that was the weekend before the traditional first LRRS weekend. Not sure how well that would work for bikes though. Do snowbanks work kinda like airfence?

[BrianC]

On the topic of LRRS racing, am I the only one starting to worry about our April race? I don't know if they'll plow that track, but I'm starting to wonder where we'll be in April. We have 3+ feet on the ground right now, with more storms to come.

I was thinkin' the same thing... .

[butcher bergs]

Brian - CEO is right. These other guys are on motards and have a different prep to adhere to.

My CBR has passed tech numerous times without a catch can. All tubes run directly into the belly pan.

You are all set if your belly pan has 5 quarts of containment.

[Kurlon]

Yeah I hear you, but there just isn't anywhere "out of the way" on this bike!

What happened to your airbox?

[BrianC]

Brian - CEO is right. These other guys are on motards and have a different prep to adhere to.

My CBR has passed tech numerous times without a catch can. All tubes run directly into the belly pan.

You are all set if your belly pan has 5 quarts of containment.

Excellent, thank you.

[butcher bergs]

I have seen in the past that the lower on some fully faired bikes have some rubber plugs in them such that when it is raining they can be pulled so that rain water doesn't build up in the belly pan during racing and then slosh out in front of your rear tire causing traction issues. I have no idea if this is fully rule book legal but I have definitely seen it done this way.

It is legal. I *believe* the hole diameter can not exceed 1 1/2 inches.

[Kurlon]

Brian - CEO is right. These other guys are on motards and have a different prep to adhere to.

My CBR has passed tech numerous times without a catch can. All tubes run directly into the belly pan.

You are all set if your belly pan has 5 quarts of containment.

Hate to do this but gotta disagree with ya Bergs.

Your belly pan is not legal to call your catch can for your vent tubes. If it were, can you show me how you vent it into your airbox if present, and if not how you vent it into your carbs, again as per the rules?

Weather or not you 'pass tech' does not mean your legal, again, covered in the rule book. Tech is not ment to certify you're compliant, it's ment to try and catch any safety problems before you go on track.

[Kurlon]

It is legal. I *believe* the hole diameter can not exceed 1 1/2 inches.

Up to two 1 inch holes, max, and must remain plugged unless the race director declares it a 'wet' race.

[OreoGaborio]

Winter needs to fucking end.

[butcher bergs]

Hate to do this but gotta disagree with ya Bergs.

Fine by me.

7.17 All in line four cylinder motorcycles that have crankshaft covers that
contain oil must use approved race covers or case guards.
All 4-stroke machines must be equipped with a fluid catch pan of
sufficient size and heat-resistant material to contain the contents of the
crankcases in the event of an engine or crankcase failure. Minimum
capacity of the fluid catch pan is to be 3 quarts.
A. Enlargement and/or modification of an OEM fairing lower is permitted
to attain the necessary fluid retention
B. Machines not equipped with a lower OEM fairing may install a fairing
in order to comply with this rule as long as it meets the minimum
requirements in Section 5.2.11 of the rules.
C. A maximum of two holes, 1” or smaller in diameter, may be drilled in
the fluid catch pan. These holes are to be plugged during dry
conditions, and may be opened only when the event is declared “wet”
by the Referee/Race Director.
D. All fluid catch pans must be mounted in a safe and workman-like
manner. (Zip-ties and duct tape do not qualify as safe and
workmanlike mounting.)
E. Final approval of the catch pan system rests with the Tech Inspector.
F. All production twin motorcycles are exempt from the catch pan rule

[butcher bergs]

Sorry I lied to you, Brian. A minimum of 3 quarts of containment is what you need.

[Kurlon]

No one is arguing that you need a belly pan. I'm saying the rules I quoted earlier covering catch bottles for things OTHER than your crankcases need to go to separate bottles or straight into your airbox.

7.7 On 4 stroke machines all vent, breather or overflow tubes coming from the engine, transmission or radiator must
be routed into a heat resistant catch can of at least 350cc capacity or the air box.
A If the air box is utilized, any drains from the air box must be removed and the air box sealed.
B. If an airbox is not installed, catch can vent tubes must be routed into the intake area of the carburetors so that any
overflow from the catch can will be drawn into the engine.
C. Radiator overflow and battery vent tubes can be routed into a separate catch can which need not have it’s vent
routed to the intake area

So, again, if your belly pan is your catch bottle, how are you venting it to either your airbox or carb intakes?

[BrianC]

What happened to your airbox?

My airbox is fully enclosed w/about 1/2 inch of space around the air filter.

Hate to do this but gotta disagree with ya Bergs.

Your belly pan is not legal to call your catch can for your vent tubes. If it were, can you show me how you vent it into your airbox if present, and if not how you vent it into your carbs, again as per the rules?

Weather or not you 'pass tech' does not mean your legal, again, covered in the rule book. Tech is not ment to certify you're compliant, it's ment to try and catch any safety problems before you go on track.

The belly pan is a catch can. There is no restriction on maximum size of the catch can, so a 3 or 5 quart catch pan is just as good as a 350ml bottle. If a drip or two of fuel or coolant (water) were to get into my belly pan, I think it would evaporate before it ever hit the track, if it could even escape the pan. Now in the event of a wet race, they allow the pan to have drains, and are then obviously not caring that a whole shit load of oil would leak onto the track in the event of a crankcase failure, so a couple drips of fuel mixed with the water in their? I don't know, just want to pass tech, I don't think I've ever even seen anything come out of those vent hoses except when overfilling the tank.

I don't believe the catch cans need to be vented into the airbox, and def not the carbs because my bike is fuel injected and doesn't have carbs. I am guessing that in the rulebook they are just pointing out options for ways to do it, not dictating that their needs to be a vent on the catch can. I'd have to look again, but I'm not going to worry about it.

[Kurlon]

If you have your airbox still, route the lines into there, done.

If you're calling your belly pan a catch bottle, enclose it, run the vent to the airbox as per the rules... except then it's not viable as a belly pan... shit... huh, guess that doesn't work does it?

[BrianC]

Sorry I lied to you, Brian. A minimum of 3 quarts of containment is what you need.

Armour bodies has it covered I'm sure

[butcher bergs]

Not sure what to tell you Josh. I know numerous MW machines in particular that are set up the same way and all pass tech without issue.

The belly pan can be used as the catch can as I don't see anywhere where the rules state the dedicated catch can, should one be used, must be enclosed.

[Kurlon]

Not sure what to tell you Josh. I know numerous MW machines in particular that are set up the same way and all pass tech without issue.

The belly pan can be used as the catch can as I don't see anywhere where the rules state the dedicated catch can, should one be used, must be enclosed.

So, you don't see the section of the rules I posted, covering specific vent and drain lines, specifying entirely enclosed containment systems that only vent back into the intake of the engine?

Really?

I can post'em again in 72pt bold Impact?

[butcher bergs]

I saw what you posted. I read the rule book every year, cover to cover.

The rules do not specify that the catch can must be enclosed. The rules do however suggest that if you are not using some sort of containment (belly pan, catch can or otherwise), the lines must be run into a sealed air box which would prevent the fluids making it to the racing surface in the absence of dedicated fluid containment.

It's all about interpretation, IMO.

[Chippertheripper]

i have a bunch of catch cans...3 of em. not one goes into my airbox. that is all.

[OreoGaborio]

I can post'em again in 72pt bold Impact?

Don't bother, I will.

On 4 stroke machines all vent, breather or overflow tubes coming from the engine, transmission or radiator must
be routed into a heat resistant catch can of at least 350cc capacity OR the air box.

I'll take that to mean "Just route them to the fucking belly pan"

And I'll wrap it up with a big ole
WHO THE FUCK CARES? JUST DON'T BE A DOUCHE AND DUMP ANYTHING ON THE TRACK. NOW SHUT UP AND GO SHOVEL SOME FUCKING SNOW

[lrrs428]

Now now, Pete there is nothing wrong with this thread. look how much entertainment it has brought to all of us.


p.s. there is still only 72 days

[OreoGaborio]

Don't make me break your grill again.

[butcher bergs]

Is discussing the interpretation of the rulebook some kind of problem?