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I've been holding off making this thread as you guys are probably pretty sick of hearing me talk about my newly purchased bike, but I still have some unanswered questions and I need some answers. Supermotojunkie has been of little help responding, and I think Christian is sick of being my sole human source of motard knowledge, so I am opening it up to the whole NESR community. So think of this thread not as a build thread, but more a consolidated version of all the crap I've been spewing around lately to prevent me from bumping old threads and cluttering up other topics that don't involve me.
I started with an 02 crf450 with the following:
-Suspension rebuilt using stock components
-Beringer 6 Piston front
-Aftermarket Crank
-Larger aftermarket case cover
-Excel wheels, with what appear to be stock hubs, although I'm not 100% positive
-Michelin Pilot rains 16/63/17 mounted (excellent shape)
-Michelin Pilot Supermotos Slicks 16/63/17 unmounted (excellent shape)
And a few other, not as important, odds and ends
Since I've bought the bike I've done the following:
-STM Slipper (Thank you Smutty) While doing this, I realized how good of shape the previous clutch was in
-Excel wheels/talon hubs/39t rear sprocket (Thank you Smutty) with the Supermoto Slicks mounted.
-Air filter, spark plug, oil filter, fluids
-Checked valve clearances (perfect)
-Inspected all bearings, all good
My Plans
-Inspect the top end
-Replace Beringer pads, the previous owner gave me a receipt with a place to order them from as they are hard to find, so I think I'm good there
-Replace radiators. The stock have no leaks, so they will make good spares, but they are significantly bent, so much that I can't get the radiator braces on them.
-Finish up the safety wiring
And here are my current questions
-The rains rub the chain a real good amount, more than I am comfortable with. The Slicks have minimal rub, but it does touch. I have read on Supermoto Junkie that you can back off the spokes on one side of the wheel half a rotation and tighten the other side half a turn and this helps a good amount. A lot of people swear by it on there, any thoughts? I've also noticed that lots of people just deal with the rub. At full lean, how would the chain grease getting on the tire not affect you?
-I have no chain guide underneath the swingarm near the rear axle. The bracket for it is still there, though. Is this bottom guide recommended? The previous owner mentioned it is fine without it, and it seems to be fine without it, but I see most motards running this slider. If it is not necessary, I am going to cut off the bracket for it.
-My Beringer brakes are giving me the hardest time in the world bleeding. They stop on an absolute dime, with just a fraction of an input, and the lever is firm to pull, but there is substantial squish, and I can pull them all the way to the bar if I try hard enough. Maybe I should just buy the pump bleeder and be done with it.
-Do motards need a belly pan? I read in the rulebook that ex500s do not need them, maybe I just missed the part about motards, since I haven't seen any run with them. All my hoses run into one catch can or another, so I think I am good on that part.
-Are the Michelin Supermoto Slicks good for road racing? I don't see a reason why not, but you never know.
-The seat hump, is it really necessary? My seat does not have it, but I think I could buy one pretty cheap, or easily make one.
Thanks guys, I'll be updating this thread with questions as I get further along. Probably won't be a picture intensive type build thread though, as nothing magically is going on here, just trying to get into racing without spending a ridiculous amount of money.
A man of many names...Jay, Gennaro, Gerry, etc.
As far as a belly pan, yes you need one. I was going to fab one up using a stock part from another street bike and mount it to the frame. Clearance is not an issue with a motard so you can mount just about anything under there. The most critical place is in front of the motor though as motard motors usually blow in the front.\
The Beringer brakes I had also were squishy but stopped well. If they stop well I wouldn't worry about it. Also try zip tying the lever in for a day or so. If there is air in the lines it will help them to raise up to the top.
Michelin slicks are fine for road racing. Just make sure the wear is fine. That is what Martire runs.
The seat hump is not necessary. It helped me to stay in place on the bike and also looked cool. If you are interested I have one that was custom made by Adam Clark that I am parting with.
And as far as the chain rub, I say run it.
-Christian LRRS/CCS HasBeen ECK Racing
2011 Pit Bike Race CHAMPION!
Offseting the rear tire a touch via the spokes is pretty common. Dig around, you may be able to get a chain guide setup to help with the situation a bit too.
Is it a beringer master pushing the 6 piston calipers?
It's all water under the bridge, and we do enter the next round-robin. Am I wrong?
Is this rule new for this year? Anything available OTC? If not, looks like I'm getting crafty, my friends will have fun with this one.
Short of offsetting my rear tire, whether that be by shims of playing the spokes, I don't see any other way...I mean, If I correct it by putting pressure on it with a slider, it wouldn't be running straight.
Yup.
A man of many names...Jay, Gennaro, Gerry, etc.
There are a couple of threads on supermotojunkie.com about people installing chain rollers on the top side of their swingarm to keep the chain off the side of their tire. From a purely scientific point of view I wouldn't think it would be the best thing for the chain when under load but they have done it and it functions for them without issue as far as what they post about.
Joel
Yes it is a new rule for this year.
-Christian LRRS/CCS HasBeen ECK Racing
2011 Pit Bike Race CHAMPION!
preteen is on the money with everything in his first post...
i hadn't heard much bitching about the belly pan yet (that seems like something cats would definitely gripe over)
michelins are fine
chain rub is fine
chain guides are for dirtbikes
bleed like a s.o.b. try a vacuum pump.
seat humps are for real supermoto racers (and unnecessary anyways) and we are just road racers.
Cliff's Cycles KTM
NETRA enduro B-vet
Close your eyes, look deep in your soul, step outside yourself and let your mind go.
Check the seal on the master, they don't seat well. The lever will pull to to the bars on the stand, it 's one finger braking and bites way before moving, you'll never get it to the bar riding.
It's all water under the bridge, and we do enter the next round-robin. Am I wrong?
You can also use a wood plane to shave off about 1/4" of rubber on the left edge of the tire to get more clearance for the chain. You don't use the last 1/2" or so of tire edge, so it won't cause a problem with grip.
My chain rubbed worse than anyone else's I've ever seen at Loudon with no ill effects. It'd rub so bad I'd end up losing a good bit of tire on the left side. That said it would still lean over so far with so much grip I could drag my (cut in half) footpegs.
While it does look funky having a chewed up tire (and rim in my case) I wouldn't lose sleep over it performance wise.
PM Sent
Excellent, so here's what I have put together so far....
Don't worry about the tire rub. If I want, I can adjust the spokes or shave the wheel down a bit.
Screw the lower chain guide.
Don't worry about the brakes. Yes, there is no way in hell I would get them to the bar while driving, I'd be over the bars before I got them half way.
I need to make a belly pan.
My michelins are fine.
I don't need the seat hump.
Thanks guys, I'm sure I'll be bumping this as I get more confused.
Thoughts on either one of these set ups?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Supermoto-Be...6d61c2&vxp=mtr
Last edited by JettaJayGLS; 03-01-12 at 09:37 AM.
A man of many names...Jay, Gennaro, Gerry, etc.
Well, not a question about the build, but thoughts on this suit? I currently have a joe-rocket, which I don't mind, but this deal seems killer, and its supermoto specific? Enlighten me please. My biggest concern is compromised protection for flexibility.
http://stores.sportbiketrackgear.com/Detail.bok?no=4031
I do have some large ass thighs, and I'm not sure how accommodating the alpinestars stuff is for them. My Joe Rocket is a 44, and I would probably go with the same for the Alpinestars.
Last edited by JettaJayGLS; 03-12-12 at 08:56 AM.
A man of many names...Jay, Gennaro, Gerry, etc.
Yes that is a good deal if it fits. You do not need a sumo specific suit though. Any suit is fine. I wore my teknic when I raced it.
-Christian LRRS/CCS HasBeen ECK Racing
2011 Pit Bike Race CHAMPION!
They're forcing a belly pan this year? WTF? Where/how can I get one?
Zip-Tie Alley Racing
LRRS/CCS #103
PPS | Dunlop | Boston Moto | Woodcraft & Armour Bodies | 35 Motorsports | Pit Bull | K&N
As per the belly pan post, I would not run something like that. It will do nothing to contain oil. I would try to fab up an oil pan from something like this...
http://www.airtech-streamlining.com/...5001994-06.htm
I say this because motards usually blow from the front. So all of the oil will be coming out of the front of the bike and a pan like that will not retain any of the oil but a few drops. You do NOT want to be that guy that is blamed for a 45min clean up of the track that sets the whole schedule off for the day.
Last edited by csmutty; 03-12-12 at 09:03 AM.
-Christian LRRS/CCS HasBeen ECK Racing
2011 Pit Bike Race CHAMPION!
People are going to ghetto fab stuff to make a solution for this so it likely won't even make an ontrack difference except to be a pain in the ass.
Is the old ex500 turkey pan with zip ties a viable option here?
Zip-Tie Alley Racing
LRRS/CCS #103
PPS | Dunlop | Boston Moto | Woodcraft & Armour Bodies | 35 Motorsports | Pit Bull | K&N
Thanks Smutty! I probably should have just bought your bike at this point....
CEO, from what I've read searching around, the turkey pan works as like a spur of the moment fix, but is kinda a one shot deal? Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.
A man of many names...Jay, Gennaro, Gerry, etc.
Zip-Tie Alley Racing
LRRS/CCS #103
PPS | Dunlop | Boston Moto | Woodcraft & Armour Bodies | 35 Motorsports | Pit Bull | K&N
Anyone willing to help me safety wire the bike? Most of the bolts are already drilled, and this bike has been raced at Loudon, but it really doesn't seem as if enough has been drilled to pass tech. I have safety wire pliers, safety wire, a drill, I can buy whatever drill bits are necessary. Beer of your choice, pizza, whatever will be provided. No vice or drill press though. A lot of the bolts on the bike are drilled at an angle with only one hole in them, and I'm having some trouble wiring those.
My trailer hitch and trailer should be ready to go next weekend, so I could come to you most likely. I'm mechanically inclined, but I don't want to fail tech, and I don't want my bike to come apart on the track, and take anyone else or myself out, so I think asking for some help this first time is rational.
In other news, thanks Chip for the transponder. Smutty, radiators are on. The braces I have are for the OEM radiators though, so they don't fit with the wider fluidynes. Any chance you have those floating around?
A man of many names...Jay, Gennaro, Gerry, etc.
Worst case we'll get you sorted at the track.