Lets talk brakes...

[OreoGaborio]

Current set-up:
Stock SV650 2 pot per caliper Tokico (will not change)
GSXR master cylinder (19x18, I believe. A little tired, me thinks)
Galfer wave rotors
Some kinda SS lines (a few years old at least)
EBC HH pads.

Current performance:
Very good stopping power.
Very consistent, though a little fade if I do back-to-back hard races.
Not much feel (lever is squishy... pretty sure the cause is a tired master cylinder)


Possible plans:
Replace master (Another GSXR OEM (Nissin 19x18) or R6 OEM (Brembo 16x18) master? I may spring for a 19x18 Brembo if I can find a deal)
Fresh lines (Perhaps -2 lines, though they're effin $. May just go with Galfer Superbike lines)
Maybe try a different set of pads. (Vesrah RJL's? Cabrone Lorraine?)


Suggestions?

Queue Degsy, G man, Scotty G, Mike Martire, etc

[dudutzu]

Maybe try a different set of pads. (Vesrah RJL's? Cabrone Lorraine?)


Suggestions?

Vesrah SRJL's

[Degsy]

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Stock gixxer tokicos don't dissipate heat well enough. In my opinion, your brake fade is due to the fluid getting too hot and becoming contaminated. I has this whole go-around with jims bike. Beat bet is to gt a set of r6 calipers and the spacers required to make them work (readily available). If you are feeling flush with cash, keep the tokicos and get some yoshimura vented pistons ( mucho bucks unless you find them used).

[Kurlon]

The EBC GPFAs and the new EPFAs are supposed to be hot shit pads. Those in combination with an EBC Prolite Contour rotor work damn well on the Ptwinkies, low fade, good bite/feel/stopping power and they don't warp rotors.

I'm a big fan of the Nissin radial masters also.

[Jim]

Vesrah SRJL's

i would suggest truing Performance Friction 07 compound

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Stock gixxer tokicos don't dissipate heat well enough. In my opinion, your brake fade is due to the fluid getting too hot and becoming contaminated. I has this whole go-around with jims bike. Beat bet is to gt a set of r6 calipers and the spacers required to make them work (readily available). If you are feeling flush with cash, keep the tokicos and get some yoshimura vented pistons ( mucho bucks unless you find them used).

R6 calpiers would be best and are maybe $50 on WERA, but not SS legal. since you're going SB i would consider it for your SV. if you're not happy with the GSXRT master, dont buy another one. either rebuild it for $40 or get an R6 or Brembo. I'm also surprised Degsy didnt suggest trying a better brake fluid as well.

[The Snowman]

Stock gixxer tokicos don't dissipate heat well enough. In my opinion, your brake fade is due to the fluid getting too hot and becoming contaminated. I has this whole go-around with jims bike. Beat bet is to gt a set of r6 calipers and the spacers required to make them work (readily available). If you are feeling flush with cash, keep the tokicos and get some yoshimura vented pistons ( mucho bucks unless you find them used).

R6 calipers won't fit on stock SV forks, will they? Aren't they radial?

[OreoGaborio]

The SRJL's are not available in SV650 fitment
The calipers will not change per CCS LWSS rules
The rotors will not change per my wallet rules

Luckily it's rare that I get any fade. Only if I ride FLAH TOUT for two back-to-back races.

My main concerns are better feel and less squish.

[dudutzu]

R6 calipers won't fit on stock SV forks, will they? Aren't they radial?

they probably assumed Pete's bike has gixxer front end or maybe they dont know how a sv front end looks like

[Kurlon]

R6 calipers won't fit on stock SV forks, will they? Aren't they radial?

Depends on the year R6 you're stealing from. Earlier years had monoblock 4 piston conventional mount units that are considered pretty dang good and are used as upgrades on many bikes.

[The Snowman]

I have the same squishy-feeling brake lever. I noticed it more at the 10/6 TTD, when I was doing back-to-back-to-back sessions, even in the rain.

Possibly the heat issue Degsy described, but the cool rain should've helped a little.

Yeah, I'm still considering the GSX-R front end swap, just to give Jim something to bith at me about, but wold love to hear more about set-ups with the stock triples.

[jcbell1007]

I don't see why you would need to replace your SS lines, I could be wrong but I don't think they wear out.

Based on what other guys are saying, a high quality DOT 4 fluid may solve a bunch of your problems. The Motul synthetic stuff that I used in my hawk, and in other bikes before that has been phenominal.

My .02, for what its worth, if you are happy with what you have, and its working well for you obviously, try changing just the fluid and see how it feels. it'll save you some $$$ and at the worst, your braking will be the same as what you have now.

[Degsy]

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Sorry, assumed youwere superbike legal. My bad.



Hmmm. I have always wondered how it is legal for safety reasons to change master cylinder but not calipers. That's a debate for another day. Here's your issue, pete. You are running that brake system way over it's design spec and adding an even better master cylinder is going to overpower the whole system even more I think and you'll be getting fade because the fluid is getting too hot I think. I would say get some of the brembo 64 fluid as a first option. Changing to -2 lines means you'll get more stopping power but you will need race fluid to cope with the heat. I had the 20mm brembo billet master and -2 lines on my f4i, with galfer race rotors a performance friction pads. I used to constantly change fluid as I used the racing600 stuff. Every race weekend I would change it out. If I didn't, I'd get fade eventually.

[kmf]

The EBC GPFAs and the new EPFAs are supposed to be hot shit pads. Those in combination with an EBC Prolite Contour rotor work damn well on the Ptwinkies, low fade, good bite/feel/stopping power and they don't warp rotors.

EBC is the McDonald's drive through of brake parts.

[Stromper]

I vote new fluid and banjo bleeding

A small amount of moisture will steam up

[smf]

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Motul rbf600 and a solid blead, then if you're still not getting decent feel change hardware.

in my experience most people dont bleed the system well enough.

[obsolete]

Pete what are you looking to improve? I mean it's working pretty good right now, no?

[OreoGaborio]

Pete what are you looking to improve? I mean it's working pretty good right now, no?

Thank you...

I"ll say it again. I'm NOT all that worried about fade as it rarely happens.

My MAIN concerns are better feel and less squish. I've been riding on this set-up since I got the bike. It's not an improper bleed issue. Hot or cold, the lever has always had more squish than I'd like, even though it stops well.

[Awesome]

zip tie the lever.

[Degsy]

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Buy my brembo billet master cylinder $450

[Awesome]

:bemused

Can you get a few guys to lift it up?

[OreoGaborio]

zip tie the lever.

Tried it a thousand times. I've left it zipped for days. Martire confirmed via PM that the GSXR Nissin radial's are notorious for being a little squishy.

I told him it sounds like my "budget" options are
A used forged Brembo for about 200,
An OEM cast Brembo off a Duc or Aprilia for about 100,
Or trying my luck and just swapping out for a different GSXR Nissin for about 60.

Another option is an OEM Brembo radial from an R6/1, but those are 16x18 and I'm looking for less play, not more.


Or I can just rent a crane.

[eboos]

With the stock calipers, you are only pushing 4 pistons total. Wouldn't a Brembo 16x18 give you better feel? The ratio should give you a good ballance of travel and feel, while the piston size should be appropriate for a total of 4 brake pistons.

[OreoGaborio]

From my understanding of it (someone correct me if I'm wrong), it would give better feel through lever travel, not lever pressure.
Looking for less lever travel & more pressure feedback.

[eboos]

From my understanding of it (someone correct me if I'm wrong), it would give better feel through lever travel, not lever pressure.
Looking for less lever travel & more pressure feedback.

A higher ratio will decrease the lever travel, but at the same time decrease the feel. Sure, you will feel like you are applying more pressure, but only because you are loosing mechanical advantage. When I switched to the Brembo 16x18 for my 6 piston Buell setup, I initially thought I made a mistake because I didn't feel much of a difference in lever pressure. When I rode the bike, that was another story. It was much easier to modulate brake pressure, and even to apply greater brake pressure through the mechanical advantage that the lever ratio gave me.

In any case, I have a 17mm Nissin radial MC that I can give you. Try that out. If you like it, keep it. If you don't like it, just return it. If you are going to the awards dinner, I'll bring it with me and give it to you then.

[Paul_E_D]

IIf you want stiffer lever action, you need a bigger piston. BUT, you lose feel.

I would actually suggest keeping you fluid fresh by flushing it every weekend, and using better pads. EBC HHs go wooden after a bunch of hot laps IMO. Start trying the more expensive stuff out there. PF, Versah, whatever is available for those calipers.

New lines might actually help with the stiffness thing.