Lets talk brakes...

[Stromper]

We are assuming the rotors are de-glazed and brake cleaned

[zx1012r]

You said rock hard and cock in the same post... wrong forum!

Sorry, didn't mean to fly off the handle.

I tried to tell Pete to stop, but he just keeps coming after me.

[OreoGaborio]

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We are assuming the rotors are de-glazed and brake cleaned

New pads, new rotors... But that wouldn't change the feel at the LEVER.

Plus, again, stopping power is good. It's feel I want to change.

[nt650hawk]

a friend with over 40 years of motorcycle experience with many being racing experience. he knows his shit. and I've also tried it and it seen it first hand do nothing. doesn't take much thought to understand how holding the lever in does nothing to actually fix a problem. people do it to get air out of the system but it doesn't get air out of the system. if the air is gonna float to the top its gonna do it regardless of whether the lever is in or out. I can see where holding it might open up the flow in the master and get the air just that little bit higher. I know on my Brembo it doesn't work that way though. got almost all the air out just by squeezing the hose to the reservoir and pumping the lever.

I Agree.

I've never done it before and never thought this would help. I just tip the bike as far over to get the reservoir at the highest point and snap the brake lever after the bike has sat following bleeding. Never had any issues afterwards.

[Rada]

New pads, new rotors... But that wouldn't change the feel at the LEVER.

Plus, again, stopping power is good. It's feel I want to change.

I'm not a big expert on this so consider the source.

I was experiencing a slight mushy feeling but good overall power my SV.
I found that once I cleaned my calipers the solid feel came back.

Cleaning mostly involved removing the pads and extending the pistons a little then cleaning the gunk ring off with soap and water and a tooth brush.

Another thing is to put a little grease on the lever pivot and the spot where the lever pushes on the plunger.

Your results may vary but it worked wonders for me.

[OreoGaborio]

I Agree.

I've never done it before and never thought this would help. I just tip the bike as far over to get the reservoir at the highest point and snap the brake lever after the bike has sat following bleeding. Never had any issues afterwards.

The two theories behind the zip tie method that I could find are:
1 - the pressure makes the air bubbles smaller and thus perhaps more "mobile"
2 - the pressure makes the surrounding fluid slightly more dense and thus the air bubbles more buoyant and likely to rise to the top.

[Stromper]

Did you bleed at the banjo fittings?

[butcher bergs]

I'm willing to bet a simple rebuild of the components would take care of things.

[smf]

I'm willing to bet a simple rebuild of the components would take care of things.

+1. tho martire is right. certain suzuki masters are known to be suspect. use the KISS theory 1st unless you're blowing sponsor $$.

[OreoGaborio]

I did earn a couple bucks from Pirelli this year

[OreoGaborio]

And folks, I appreciate the help and all the "extra" advice on how to care for, clean and bleed brake systems... but please be aware that I know all that and have done all that basic stuff already. It's not an issue of poor care or no basic mechanical knowledge.

[davemon]

Oh! Something I can actually help with!

I ran a similar setup but not quite the same:
---------------
Stock SV650S 2006 caliper (whatever that is)
Stock master cylinder
Stock rotors
Some kinda SS lines (note the kinda... same brand as yours)
EBC HH pads
ATE Super Blue

Changed to the same as the above but for:
----------------
Motul whatever supe high temp (same stuff I use in my Porsche)
Carbone Lorraine pads from MotoCD.com


I still get a squishy-ish lever after longer or faster sessions and feel just isn't there. I'm not that good on bikes but have lots of experience with track and racing cars. The feel is way better with the Carbone Lorraine pads though. i don't think the even higher temp Motul helped. My setup is different though as with a really fresh bleed my brakes don't feel squishy but without bleeding them twice per track day (if 5 or 6 sessions) they get squishy and leve travel seems longer... or maybe it's just the feel that is going. Not sure, like I said I am not that good at bikes.

Looking for improvement too as I am riding this bike until I can get a used bike with track spec traction control, ABS, and a button that makes me smarter.

Dave

[The Snowman]

So, talking Brembo MC, what is the difference between the 19RCS GP Radial and the Forged GP Radial besides the price? (19RCS runs close to $100 more)

19RCS ($364 at HardRacing.com)


Forged 19x18($255 at HardRacing.com)


Forged 19x18 w/ folding lever option ($333 at HardRacing.com)

[Awesome]

The two theories behind the zip tie method that I could find are:
1 - the pressure makes the air bubbles smaller and thus perhaps more "mobile"
2 - the pressure makes the surrounding fluid slightly more dense and thus the air bubbles more buoyant and likely to rise to the top.

My logic is the air bubbles can float to the top and escape the lines into the res while the master is held open. It's always made a noticeable difference for me.

[Degsy]

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Pressure affects bouyancy. The bubbles will rise quicker in a pressurized liquid.

[Awesome]

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Pressure affects bouyancy. The bubbles will rise quicker in a pressurized liquid.

If the lever isnt' held down won't they just stay at the high point in the line with the master closed?

[Degsy]

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Pressure affects bouyancy. The bubbles will rise quicker in a pressurized liquid.

If the lever isnt' held down won't they just stay at the high point in the line with the master closed?

Yep. If the line loops higher than the master then thats where the bubbles will stay

[Kurlon]

So, talking Brembo MC, what is the difference between the 19RCS GP Radial and the Forged GP Radial besides the price? (19RCS runs close to $100 more)

You can alter the effective piston size on the RCS, the Forged units run a fixed effective piston size ala normal masters.

[blacklightning]

If the lever isnt' held down won't they just stay at the high point in the line with the master closed?

That is true either with pressure or without. Pressure has no "direction" in the system. Once applied, the pressure is equal and undiminished in all directions. It is only when a bleed location is opened that fluid moves toward the lessened pressure, and trapped air will move with it. When the system is static, regardless of the pressure, air will only move up due to buoyancy.

Sorry Pete, off topic.

[eboos]

You can alter the effective piston size on the RCS, the Forged units run a fixed effective piston size ala normal masters.

Incorrect. The RCS allows you to change the lever ratio, not the piston size. The lever ratio will either give you more travel for more feel, or less travel for greater pressure at the lever.

[Kurlon]

Incorrect. The RCS allows you to change the lever ratio, not the piston size. The lever ratio will either give you more travel for more feel, or less travel for greater pressure at the lever.

A better way of describing what I was trying to get across by calling the lever ratio 'effective piston size'.

[scottfromboston]

A better way of describing what I was trying to get across by calling the lever ratio 'effective piston size'.

Yeah, but your description left the mechanical engineers in the audience saying "how the F would they do that????!"

[The Snowman]

You can alter the effective piston size on the RCS, the Forged units run a fixed effective piston size ala normal masters.

Incorrect. The RCS allows you to change the lever ratio, not the piston size. The lever ratio will either give you more travel for more feel, or less travel for greater pressure at the lever.

A better way of describing what I was trying to get across by calling the lever ratio 'effective piston size'.

So, the only difference is the ability to get 19x20 AND 19x18 with the RCS vs a fixed 19x18 OR 19x20 with the forged?

[OreoGaborio]

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Correct

[The Snowman]

Correct

Might be worth the extra $30 to get the additional setting then, since I would probably go for a model with the folding lever option. (and you can get shorties for the RCS as well)

What the hell, if you're going to spend over $300 . . .

EDIT: Does anyone know where to get the RCS cheaper than $350 w/ remote reservoir?