Fuel problems

[theothersean]

I think I may have bad fuel?


We were going to take the dual sports out for a ride yesterday. I couldn't get either of them to start I figured it was due to the cold.

I put heaters near the bikes to warm them a bit

leahs is still new, only 113 miles on it.
mine I charged up the battery and changed the spark plug.

I draind the float bowls on both figuring it might help if there was any crap in there.

Hers would finally start but would only stay running with the choke on. Even after the motor was warm.

Mine will only fire up with a shot of starting fluid but then dies out.

We pulled both of them into the house last night to warm them up for today.



This morning I pull them out, mine still won't fire up.
Leah's will start and run but only with the idle set up around 2000rpm.

I ended up parking mine and taking the v strom out instead.

Leahs bike will run but then when we get to the end of the road it idles down and dies, will only fire back up with the choke out then choke in and it runs fine for a while. But everytime we stop it dies again.
we ran almost a full tank through it today with some carb cleaner. Then topped it off with fresh gas from the pump. It wouldn't fire up again with out the choke out.


Anyone have any ideas?

I think my carb might need a good cleaning as the bike is 7 yrs old but leahs is brand new only 113 miles on it the reason I think its the gas is that both bike were filled from the same can in the garage as was my mini that was stalling on the ice a couple weeks ago.

[ChR1s]

Sta-Bil. The stuff is mandatory these days.

[theothersean]

Sta-Bil. The stuff is mandatory these days.

thats what is puzzleing I use stabil in all the bikes , and everyother piece of gas powered equipment in the garage.

My hope is that the carb cleaner will help leahs bike with out haveing to pull the carb off. as hers will run , jus tnot stay running. Mine I can't even get started.

[ChR1s]

Paige's DRZ has been dormant for months. Put the battery back in today and it started right up? Her KLX is reluctant to fire up though -- battery is on the charger now for another go at it. I did notice the battery terminals weren't tight on the KLX. That fucker is very lean though, so it's going to be tough to start when cold even if there's nothing clogged in the carb. I'll have to see about the jetting/air screw on that. If Leah's KLX starts but only runs at idle with the choke on after it's warmed up, chances are you'll be needing to access that carb. Hopefully the carb bowl can be dropped while the carb's on the bike? If there's a tube running off the bottom of the bowl, you can loosen the screw there to drain the bowl. If there's water in there, you should be able to spot if you can manage to drain it into a container. 3 bikes running like crap sounds like water.

[theothersean]

Paige's DRZ has been dormant for months. Put the battery back in today and it started right up? Her KLX is reluctant to fire up though -- battery is on the charger now for another go at it. I did notice the battery terminals weren't tight on the KLX. That fucker is very lean though, so it's going to be tough to start when cold even if there's nothing clogged in the carb. I'll have to see about the jetting/air screw on that. If Leah's KLX starts but only runs at idle with the choke on after it's warmed up, chances are you'll be needing to access that carb. Hopefully the carb bowl can be dropped while the carb's on the bike? If there's a tube running off the bottom of the bowl, you can loosen the screw there to drain the bowl. If there's water in there, you should be able to spot if you can manage to drain it into a container. 3 bikes running like crap sounds like water.

That was one of the first things I did was drain the bowls on both bikes, infact i did it a couple times but I caught the fuel in a rag, I should have used a cup or something to see if there was crap.
I'll try it again and see if I get any water.

[RandyO]

sounds like contaminated gaS

drain it and use it to start a bonfire

[R7]

Sounds like a stuck float on the drz? It's common with the new ethanal fuel..even with stabil. From what I've been reading, the best results for long term storage and the new fuel is having a 2-stroke mix.

Starting fluid in any gas motor is VERY bad for it

[theothersean]

Sounds like a stuck float on the drz? It's common with the new ethanal fuel..even with stabil. From what I've been reading, the best results for long term storage and the new fuel is having a 2-stroke mix.

Starting fluid in any gas motor is VERY bad for it

You mean to say adding a touch of 2stroke oil to the fuel and running it in a 4 stroke motor?

As for the float, I assume I can just pull the bottom off ( float bowl) and clean in there with a bit of carb cleaner spray?

I am guessing that the ethanol has formed a sort of sticky layer on the float not alowing it to move freely?


Now what the hell am I going to do with all this fuel, between the bikes, the tractor and whats in the can I probablly have 6 gallons. Thats a bit much to burn on a fire, besides I don't want to comtaminate my well.

[R7]

You mean to say adding a touch of 2stroke oil to the fuel and running it in a 4 stroke motor?

As for the float, I assume I can just pull the bottom off ( float bowl) and clean in there with a bit of carb cleaner spray?

I am guessing that the ethanol has formed a sort of sticky layer on the float not alowing it to move freely?


Now what the hell am I going to do with all this fuel, between the bikes, the tractor and whats in the can I probablly have 6 gallons. Thats a bit much to burn on a fire, besides I don't want to comtaminate my well.

Yup, put the 2-stroke mix in and run it for a little while to make sure the fuel bowl is fuel of the mix. Obviously you don't need a tank full, just a small amount.

The needle and seat is what sticks so it may be a bit more involved than taking the bowl off and giving it a shot of carb cleaner. You'll probably have to remove the float and the needle and seat...and hope it's not damaged from being stuck...or you having to unstick it.
Ethanol retains moisture and allows things to corrode that normally don't, the gas itself hasn't gone bad.

As for the left over 2-stroke gas, I put it rite in the truck tank. I just dropped a gallon of fresh 2-stroke mix in the work truck because I bought a new chainsaw and didn't want to mix 2 types of oil together

[MsHap]

Just pull the carbs and clean the jets well.

[sccbr600]

drain the gas put in some good fuel 93 the 87 sucks ass now i have a buddy that used 87 and it fucked up his quad and snowblower i cleaned the carbs and added 93 run new,the new gas has the ethonal shit and gums up the insides never use it

[ZX-12R]

At the tail end of the last riding season, the fuel pump in my 12R fell victim to bad gasoline. It didn't completely disable it but it can not maintain adequate pressure at 75%-WOT over 7K RPMs. It pulls like an animal up to 7K then falls on its face. Now that I'm settled down in NH I'll be bringing it to Hooksett Kawasaki for some warranty repairs.

Definitely clean your carbs and jets. The gas we have now is crap.

[TheIglu]

Seafoam.

Yeah, it sounds like bad gas/water. Also pull out your pilot jet screw (remembering how many turns out it was) and spray some carb cleaner in there. If it gunked up your main jet, you can bet it clogged up your idle jet as well.

[RandyO]

the new gas has the ethonal shit and gums up the insides never use it

actually, the ethanol does the opposite, it cleans gummy deposits that are already there, the problem when the gummy stuff starts moving, it doesn't fit thru the jets and they get plugged

[ChR1s]

Sean, I pulled the KLX's carb off today. THAT was some fun. I removed the bung covering up the air screw, then turned it in 1/4 turn. It hadn't fired at all prior, but I didn't see anything in the pilot jet. Hit the the carb with some carb cleaner anyway. Put the crap back together and it fired up instantly.

Oh, and that funky handling that Paige had mentioned? My suspicions were confirmed after I got the front end up -- the steering does have a slight bit of resistance. I'm going to let it be for now and see if some miles don't loosen it up, being that there's all of maybe 60 miles on it so far.

[sandman]

Sounds like a stuck float on the drz? It's common with the new ethanal fuel..even with stabil. From what I've been reading, the best results for long term storage and the new fuel is having a 2-stroke mix.

Starting fluid in any gas motor is VERY bad for it

or buy your gas in vt=no ethanal

does nh put ethanal in there fuel?

[theothersean]

Well what an adventure that was.

first thing i am doing if I ever hit the lotery is hire my own personal mechanic.

I have pulled and cleaned carbs on 2 stroke stuff before , chainsaw, weed wacker, 2 stroke scooter. But this was my first adventure with a 4 stroke motorcycle carb. Being that I only 1/2 knew what i was doing and the fact that I didn't have a shop manual I had to keep running up stairs to the computer for refernces.
I did manage to get it all apart, cleaned and back together , the bike fired right up. I think amoung other things the float was infact stuck.

I guess for my first time, 3 hours and change wasn't all that bad. But what a tight fit on the bike.


As for the KLX we put new fuel with carb cleaner and stabil in it and it seems to be running better. It will idle now , not sure if the 20 degree temp rise has anything to do with it.
I will have to take it out for a spin to make sure, if not. I guess I'll be pulling the carb on that one next.


Thanks for all the advice

[ChR1s]

Cool. Hey, at least you had a warm place to work. Those carb/airbox boots are a BITCH to work with when cold. It took me a bit to extricate the carb from the KLX, but I got it from the bench to the bike running in about 20 minutes. That's a pretty cool bike for a 250cc dual-sport. After it's broken in maybe I'll see what's available for hop up parts.

[theothersean]

Well I took the bikes out for a test ride. The dr seems to be all set, runs well through the rmp range and idles just fine.


The KLX is still intermitten. it will run fine and idle fine although the idle screw is turned all the way up. I rode it , and about everyother time I stopped it would idle down and sputter out. Then only start again with the choke out.

Someone said it sounds like the idle jet?

I guess I'm going to have to pull it off and spray it down after all. I was hoping not to have to.

[ChR1s]

Sean, an 8mm socket and Phillips screwdriver and you're all set. Remove tank shrouds, tank, chase TPS sensor cable back and disconnect, loosen and remove throttle cables, drain carb, disconnect hose from carb to vacuum acuator on the air injection deal, loosen airbox boot & intake manifold, pull carb upwards. While you have the carb out, and before you clean it, drill a small hole in the bung covering access to the air screw -- careful not to drill beyond the brass plug, so you don't hit the screw behind it. Use a small screw or something to pry the plug out.

[theothersean]

So after I get these carbs all cleaned up nice, Is it worth my while to put an in line fuel filter from the tank to the carb?
Is this likely to gum before the carb and be a hell of alot easier to change?
Or just not worth the effort?

[R7]

So after I get these carbs all cleaned up nice, Is it worth my while to put an in line fuel filter from the tank to the carb?
Is this likely to gum before the carb and be a hell of alot easier to change?
Or just not worth the effort?

It's just one more thing to gum up, though your problem is more likely corrosion caused by the ethanol than it is gumming up.

[theothersean]

Well , thats done.

I got the drz squared away last week.

I did the klx this evening. that carb is infact a bitch to remove its a real tight fit in the frame, there are more hoses and crap to take off or move out of the way.
Took it all apart and cleaned it but didn't notice any blockage.
Buttoned it back up and and fired right up. Though setting the idle was a bit tricky and I'm sure I'll have to re do it once the air temp is warmer.
Test roded it and its set to roll.

hopefully I won't have to do that again any time soon.

[ChR1s]

Wow, Sean. That must've been a tough job. I mean, look how quickly the DRZ was up & running, while her KLX lied in wait...

I'll have to drag the KLX out of it's berth this weekend, no matter what. Damn snowmelt is all over the place now, with more snow forecasted for Sat into Sun. Not likely the new 650R will be getting out much this w/e.

[Awesome]

Did you trying only using testable VP MS93.1?