Forced Hot Air Vs Hot Water

[BSR6]

In the near future my fiancee and I will by buying a house, and the chances are pretty good we will be building. Last night we were talking about heating systems. I have this grand plan to use forced hot air so we can have central air and a "dual fuel heat pump" set up.

The catch is she has bad allergies and insists hot water is better because of the "lack of dust". I understand that forced hot air can cause a lot of dust problems but with a new well built system and the right filter set up, isn't forced hot air actually better these days because it filters all that crap out and allows you to control the air quality? From what I understand the newer systems draw fresh air from the outside, heat it, filter it, and maintain proper humidity levels. How could hot water be better when none of these things are possible?

Apparently her friend's husband is an HVAC guy and claims hot water is way better. With todays advanced systems I just don't see how this could be the case...Am I missing something?

[j4eric]

forced hot air is the way to go,dont forget to have a humidifier built in....

but....if your fiancee will have allergy issues.....you might not hear the end of it....
its a no win situation for you unfortunately...lol

most working environments have forced air...is her allergies acting up at work? if not..then you should be ok.

[drinkingmymilk]

but....if your fiancee will have allergy issues.....you might not hear the end of it....
its a no win situation for you unfortunately...lol

This is all that matters, it's in her mind. Enjoy the costs of heating your new home.

[DesmoTull]

Also look into an energy recovery ventilator (ERVs).

Having a forced hot air system, with good filtration is better (having mechanical ventilation), as opposed to HW radient (NO mechanical ventilation).

[Jaynnus]

Also look into the costs of duct cleaning since you will most likely need to have this done if she has high allergies.

Furnace manufacturers can offer the latest in electronic air purification systems..Trane markets the PureAir, Lennox markets PCO's (UV systems) and electronic PCO's, etc.

Keep in mind the cost of a 'off the rack' filter vs. a high efficiency MERV16. night and day.

A furnace will likely last you 15 years, a boiler 25+.

High efficiency is available in both types of systems.

[R7]

Use both and install a Hydro-Air system.
That's what I put in my house, still have a boiler but the water circulates through air handler units. The air handler also has central air built into it so you won't need to peice stuff together.

[BostonSVkid]

Also look into an energy recovery ventilator (ERVs).

Having a forced hot air system, with good filtration is better (having mechanical ventilation), as opposed to HW radient (NO mechanical ventilation).

+1 and its cheaper to heat a home with forced hot air typically. You put in a hepa filter and she will love you and you can humidfy the air and get rid of those stupid floor units.

[neuthunder]

My dad's an HVAC guy and he has forced air w/humidifier. Humidifier doesn't really help with the dryness too much. He's talking about going forced water/radient heat as soon as he can

[DesmoTull]

+1 and its cheaper to heat a home with forced hot air typically. You put in a hepa filter and she will love you and you can humidfy the air and get rid of those stupid floor units.

A fully condensing hot water boiler with outdoor air reset would kick the crap out of a hot air furnace, just on the fact that you won't be cycling the boiler, it would just modulate down to meet the heating load.

You could always do a radient system with a few ERVs in the high living areas, just to take care of the air changes to meet ASHRAE 62.2 (ventilation and indoor air quality standard)

[DesmoTull]

Oh, and depending on where you will be building (as long as it's not The People's Republic of Massachusetts) you should look into an outdoor wood fired boiler.

[BSR6]

After doing a little research on my own a good forced hot air system is leaps and bounds ahead of Water. It turns out, a good system is harder to come by then most realize, and this is the real reason why most people hate forced hot air. Either the system they are complaining about is old and doesn't contain the benefits that make the new one's superior, or it's new but cheap and wasn't designed right.

Apparently, with the air filtration technology we have today anyone with allergies (whether forced hot air or not) should consider a way to ventilate and filter the air in their home. That being said, its much easier to do this with forced hot air. The problem with radiant or hot water is that the air in the home is stagnant. While its not blowing around and spreading allergens, the truth is the stagnant air can cause a lot of problems as well in the long run.

[Rosco61]

separate systems is the way to go. Forced hot water baseboard, with a superstore for your hot water, then central air for your cooling. More money but worth it.

[slammp]

Radiant Floors - that is all

[BostonSVkid]

Oh, and depending on where you will be building (as long as it's not The People's Republic of Massachusetts) you should look into an outdoor wood fired boiler.

DEATH TO THOSE THAT OWN THESE DAMN THINGS!! A guy that lives behind where I own my land has one. The smoke goes right into where my house is going to be!

[Point37]

separate systems is the way to go. Forced hot water baseboard, with a superstore for your hot water, then central air for your cooling. More money but worth it.

forced hot water with a wall hung munchkin boiler and superstor ultra tank and whirlpool a/c units...3 zone heating...2 zone cooling...pretty efficient and haven't had any problems

[R7]

DEATH TO THOSE THAT OWN THESE DAMN THINGS!! A guy that lives behind where I own my land has one. The smoke goes right into where my house is going to be!

The problem is the people using them, not the actual unit. It's advertised as being able to burn anything from dry wood, to green wood, to pine, to even stumps. If it would say only dry wood, then you cut out over 50% of the smoke.
My neighbors on both sides of me have them, one is outside and one is an inside unit. I never get smoke from either of them and one burns year round. They also both use dry wood

[BostonSVkid]

This guy burns EVERYTHING

[sandman]

After doing a little research on my own a good forced hot air system is leaps and bounds ahead of Water. It turns out, a good system is harder to come by then most realize, and this is the real reason why most people hate forced hot air. Either the system they are complaining about is old and doesn't contain the benefits that make the new one's superior, or it's new but cheap and wasn't designed right.

Apparently, with the air filtration technology we have today anyone with allergies (whether forced hot air or not) should consider a way to ventilate and filter the air in their home. That being said, its much easier to do this with forced hot air. The problem with radiant or hot water is that the air in the home is stagnant. While its not blowing around and spreading allergens, the truth is the stagnant air can cause a lot of problems as well in the long run.

if you want cheap go with scorched hot air if you want the best most even heat go you can get go with radiant

[DesmoTull]

forced hot water with a wall hung munchkin boiler and superstor ultra tank and 2 whirlpool a/c units...pretty efficient and haven't had any problems

You know that they make this stuff that goes on pipe made out of fiberglass that keeps the heat in, right?

[Stromper]

You say heat pump so that is electric, most have resistance heater for supplemental

Even with the heat pump multiplier effect it would still be the most expensive option. Central air is wonderful but cools areas where you aint so expensive. Look at the separate units where the condenser is outside and only the freon is pumped to a wall unit inside...quiet and efficient. like 1 in master bedroom one in the house etc. so only is running where you are

First also this is THE BEST MARKET IN 40 years to BUY a house you could get 50% more house than you could build

If you do build you should look at natural gas if its in the street. Then propane then oil
If oil then hot water makes most sense

Either way make sure there is a solid "wood" burner with ah entrance nearby. A real heatilator fireplace is great ... does it all


There are also some nice passive solar designs which with sun available will save like 1/2

[DesmoTull]

You say heat pump so that is electric, most have resistance heater for supplemental

Even with the heat pump multiplier effect it would still be the most expensive option. Central air is wonderful but cools areas where you aint so expensive. Look at the separate units where the condenser is outside and only the freon is pumped to a wall unit inside...quiet and efficient. like 1 in master bedroom one in the house etc. so only is running where you are

You make more then one control zone and solve that problem easily.... A t-stat and a Honeywell damper... done.

[BluGixxer]

You say heat pump so that is electric, most have resistance heater for supplemental

Even with the heat pump multiplier effect it would still be the most expensive option. Central air is wonderful but cools areas where you aint so expensive. Look at the separate units where the condenser is outside and only the freon is pumped to a wall unit inside...quiet and efficient. like 1 in master bedroom one in the house etc. so only is running where you are

First also this is THE BEST MARKET IN 40 years to BUY a house you could get 50% more house than you could build

If you do build you should look at natural gas if its in the street. Then propane then oil
If oil then hot water makes most sense

Either way make sure there is a solid "wood" burner with ah entrance nearby. A real heatilator fireplace is great ... does it all


There are also some nice passive solar designs which with sun available will save like 1/2

Finally , someone who knows what's going on,
The only thing I don't like about hot water baseboard, is the baseboard, takes up way to much wall space , someone said floor heat, maybe you should look into that as an option, , and also the geo -thermal stuff , I don't know a lot about it other then its more expensive upfront ,but the long run sounds good, and how the oil prices have been, and natural gas has sky rocketed in the last few yrs, even when those prices flatten out , the petro taxes will go up. Geo- thrmal is starting to sound really good.

[Falko]

I am currently installing a dual fuel (heat pump / oil boiler) system. heat pump handles everything down to 40F and the boiler beyond that. pretty efficient overall and has A/C.

As for allergens, at least a forced air system filters. hot water systems are stagnant air unless you get a few room filters.

Forced water will allow you to run your boiler at a lower temperature and that is typically more efficient. Even the floating set point water systems will raise to 180F in winter so the baseboard can get the capacity it needs. A condenser boiler will not condense under these conditions. Dew point of a flue is around 130-140 so your return has to drop below this point, and you typically will not get a 40F dT on a baseboard system.
Forced air can be fed at 130-140 all winter as the coils draw more heat out of the water stream.

domestic hot water, go superstore side arm or instant heat unit.

For A/C there are a number of VRF type residential systems out there. The multi evap unit with one condenser are nice, but expensive to install given the amount of piping you have to do. Add in the big wall mount units, they aren't that attractive. Trane and Carrier (and many others) make central condensing units with multi speed compressors and fans to optimize efficiency, in cooling these units easily hit 16 SEER.

If you are building, definitely look at geo-thermal. While you have everything tore up, it may be more cost effective to install the geo part of the system. if you have to drill or tear up for an existing house, your payback will be around 12-15 years.

[rbrais]

In the near future my fiancee and I will by buying a house, and the chances are pretty good we will be building. Last night we were talking about heating systems. I have this grand plan to use forced hot air so we can have central air and a "dual fuel heat pump" set up.

The catch is she has bad allergies and insists hot water is better because of the "lack of dust". I understand that forced hot air can cause a lot of dust problems but with a new well built system and the right filter set up, isn't forced hot air actually better these days because it filters all that crap out and allows you to control the air quality? From what I understand the newer systems draw fresh air from the outside, heat it, filter it, and maintain proper humidity levels. How could hot water be better when none of these things are possible?

Apparently her friend's husband is an HVAC guy and claims hot water is way better. With todays advanced systems I just don't see how this could be the case...Am I missing something?

With the filtering systems that you can buy the problem is not with they heating system, but with what is already in the air. Dust and pollen that would just settle out can be stirred up with forced hot air. In the same respect, some of what is in the air will be collected by the filters.

If you keep a clean home I doubt you will have any issues with forced as opposed to baseboard. We would have gone with forced hot air/ac but it was an extra $10k and we just couldn't swing it.

[rbrais]

The problem is the people using them, not the actual unit. It's advertised as being able to burn anything from dry wood, to green wood, to pine, to even stumps. If it would say only dry wood, then you cut out over 50% of the smoke.
My neighbors on both sides of me have them, one is outside and one is an inside unit. I never get smoke from either of them and one burns year round. They also both use dry wood

The new ones are also much more efficient. They are an actual wood furnace with computer monitoring to open and close the flu to regulate temp and minimize smoke. The old ones are more like big wood stoves. If you don't burn dry wood in them they get pretty nasty.