Motogp: Yamaha f'd up

[Philkinson]

How does Yamaha stand by their decision to sign Vinales, before the season starts, for another 2 years? With a prospect like Zarco sitting on deck, you'd think that Yamaha would have at least waited a few rounds to see what their performances were like this year before making a decision.
Discuss!
Part 2 - where will Zarco go next year? Stay on a satellite Yamaha with no chance of a factory seat until 2021, or... Honda? KTM?

[Teamdineen]

Moto GP is like F1 much more than speed and performance. It all how they can market and make their product sell. Being photogenic is also a huge part, not so much for height.

[motoarch]

Repsol taking Dani’s seat

[MUZ720]

I believe Tech 3 is changing to KTM for next year. So if Zarco stays with them its a down grade. Dani stays with Honda as long as he produces wins every now and then. I would think Suzuki would be interested in him or one of the Ducati teams.

[gixxer72]

How does Yamaha stand by their decision to sign Vinales, before the season starts, for another 2 years? With a prospect like Zarco sitting on deck, you'd think that Yamaha would have at least waited a few rounds to see what their performances were like this year before making a decision.
Discuss!
Part 2 - where will Zarco go next year? Stay on a satellite Yamaha with no chance of a factory seat until 2021, or... Honda? KTM?

I guess Yamaha is smarter than you thought?

What a race!!!

[Philkinson]

I guess Yamaha is smarter than you thought?

What a race!!!

We will see.. one race doesn't tell the whole story. I'll never understand presenting a contract before the season begins. So much could go wrong

[hawk]

Vinales was one of the fastest guys on track the whole race. A bad qualify and start was the cause of his place. If he was in that front group from the beginning it would have been a different finish.

[loudbeard]

I'm not sure why you'd view the Vinales extension as a questionable move in regards to how it affects Zarco? Vinales is top tier talent and a proven race winner, Zarco hasn't won anything at GP level. If anything I'd question Yamaha's decision to resign Rossi through 2020. I know that gets you into a whole Tom Brady argument but Vinales is the future of Yamaha racing. Zarco may be as well, but he hasn't proven it yet. There is also talk of fielding Zarco a factory bike through Tech 3 because Yamaha doesn't want to let him go. Either way, Yamaha's plan currently looks like they want Zarco to replace Rossi when he retires, not replace Vinales.

[scottieducati]

It's always cute when people make sweeping statements after 1 performance. Zarco has it, no doubt... but Vinales went *forward* that race, Zarco went backwards.

Vinales also finished with ~35% more points last season than Zarco, and ran at the front in the final few laps, not just the first few, with regularity.

[Teamdineen]

It's always cute when people make sweeping statements after 1 performance. Zarco has it, no doubt... but Vinales went *forward* that race, Zarco went backwards.

Vinales also finished with ~35% more points last season than Zarco, and ran at the front in the final few laps, not just the first few, with regularity.

All true but look at Zarco's bike and equipment compared to Vinales. Zarco is on a 2016 bike. That is light years behind the curve. It's very impressive what he is doing with that field and technology ahead of him. Full on factory compared to support team. The only way to compete is ride your balls full out. That's why he has spent tires

[motoarch]

I'm not sure why you'd view the Vinales extension as a questionable move in regards to how it affects Zarco? Vinales is top tier talent and a proven race winner, Zarco hasn't won anything at GP level. If anything I'd question Yamaha's decision to resign Rossi through 2020. I know that gets you into a whole Tom Brady argument but Vinales is the future of Yamaha racing. Zarco may be as well, but he hasn't proven it yet. There is also talk of fielding Zarco a factory bike through Tech 3 because Yamaha doesn't want to let him go. Either way, Yamaha's plan currently looks like they want Zarco to replace Rossi when he retires, not replace Vinales.

Two things

1. Ok he hasn’t won a race yet at the highest level but to be fair out of every moto gp race under the current satellite format how many 2nd tier bikes have won a race and how many of those were in dry conditions? Not really a valid point on your part.

2. There is no talk of Yamaha putting him on a tech 3 factory bike because tech 3 is moving to ktm. So you just made that up.

[loudbeard]

Two things

1. Ok he hasn’t won a race yet at the highest level but to be fair out of every moto gp race under the current satellite format how many 2nd tier bikes have won a race and how many of those were in dry conditions? Not really a valid point on your part.

2. There is no talk of Yamaha putting him on a tech 3 factory bike because tech 3 is moving to ktm. So you just made that up.

Two things

1. The argument is pretty valid in the context of replacing Vinales with Zarco, which seems to be what you're advocating for. Phil's argument is a classic example of creating a solution for something that isn't a problem. Vinales is one of the best riders in the world and he's only 23 years old and you guys want to cut him lose for Zarco? I like Zarco as much as anyone else, he's talented and exciting as hell to watch *and* if/when he gets a factory ride he very well may take it to the next level. Vinales is a proven talent with an entire career ahead of him, of course he gets a contract extension.

2. Ok, I mis-remembered and jumbled a detail or two...but here is an article with Yamaha team boss Lin Jarvis explicitly stating they would like to get Zarco on a factory works bike for 2019. They haven't partnered with a satellite team to do that with after Tech 3's departure (that part I fucked up) but it sounds like their goal is to keep Zarco with Yamaha in the new satellite team deal.

[OreoGaborio]

I'm not sure why you'd view the Vinales extension as a questionable move in regards to how it affects Zarco? Vinales is top tier talent and a proven race winner, Zarco hasn't won anything at GP level.

At first I was all

If anything I'd question Yamaha's decision to resign Rossi through 2020.

But then I was all

I know it's inevitable... I'm just not ready for it yet. And from the looks of it neither is he.

[motoarch]

Two things

1. The argument is pretty valid in the context of replacing Vinales with Zarco, which seems to be what you're advocating for. Phil's argument is a classic example of creating a solution for something that isn't a problem. Vinales is one of the best riders in the world and he's only 23 years old and you guys want to cut him lose for Zarco? I like Zarco as much as anyone else, he's talented and exciting as hell to watch *and* if/when he gets a factory ride he very well may take it to the next level. Vinales is a proven talent with an entire career ahead of him, of course he gets a contract extension.

2. Ok, I mis-remembered and jumbled a detail or two...but here is an article with Yamaha team boss Lin Jarvis explicitly stating they would like to get Zarco on a factory works bike for 2019. They haven't partnered with a satellite team to do that with after Tech 3's departure (that part I fucked up) but it sounds like their goal is to keep Zarco with Yamaha in the new satellite team deal.

I’m not advocating for anything I’m just saying it’s not a valid point and I stand by that statement. It’s not realistic to expect him to win anything on a second tier bike. Vinales had a hard enough time winning anything on the factory Suzuki.

That aside I actually agree that it’s hard to justify signing zarco to a factory ride when he cant seem to get a set of tire to last more than 3/4 of a race. Whats to say if he was on a factory bike he wouldn’t just burn up the tires anyway. Every time he was competing last year he’d smoke the tires and drop like a rock and he’s doesn’t seem to have resolvoed that issue this year.

[loudbeard]

I know it's inevitable... I'm just not ready for it yet. And from the looks of it neither is he.

I'm not ready for it either; #1 he's the GOAT, #2 he's still a front runner, #3 the man has style to spare. Exactly why I framed it in the Tom Brady context above. Ideally the path to long term franchise success is to put in the heir apparent before the king is dead. That said there is the marketing backlash which is difficult to quantify; if you couch Rossi/Brady in lieu of Zarco/Garoppolo before Rossi/Brady are ready to hang it up, good chance half of your fan base tells you to go pound sand. That certainly hurts selling motorcycles/seats.

I’m not advocating for anything I’m just saying it’s not a valid point and I stand by that statement. It’s not realistic to expect him to win anything on a second tier bike. Vinales had a hard enough time winning anything on the factory Suzuki.

That aside I actually agree that it’s hard to justify signing zarco to a factory ride when he cant seem to get a set of tire to last more than 3/4 of a race. Whats to say if he was on a factory bike he wouldn’t just burn up the tires anyway. Every time he was competing last year he’d smoke the tires and drop like a rock and he’s doesn’t seem to have resolvoed that issue this year.

I also don't think it's fair comparing Vinales' factory Suzuki to a factory M1. If anything, the Suzuki Vinales rode in '15/16 was a less developed/polished/competitive race bike than what Tech 3 is rolling out.

[motoarch]

I also don't think it's fair comparing Vinales' factory Suzuki to a factory M1. If anything, the Suzuki Vinales rode in '15/16 was a less developed/polished/competitive race bike than what Tech 3 is rolling out.

You’re probably correct in that assessment. The tech 3 Yamaha could likely be a better bike then the Suzuki Vinales was on. And again I don’t disagree that zarco hasn’t shown enough to prove he should get a seat Vinales earned and at this moment appears to deserve to keep. Niether point invalidates my original point.

Having said that I still think pedrosas seat is not safe right now. He’s only getting older and less competitive in today’s current field though he’s still an amazing rider. I think Honda will take a chance that zarco can learn to keep his tires a full race distance while running at the front.

[Paul_E_D]

It looks like Pedrosas's seat is definitely up for grabs. They are talking to Dovi as well as zarco.

[MUZ720]

It looks like Pedrosas's seat is definitely up for grabs. They are talking to Dovi as well as zarco.

Don't see Dovi leaving Ducati but I guess for the right money anything is possible. Zarco is the wild card. Be interesting to see what Yamaha does for a satellite team next year, with Tech 3 moving to KTM. Not sure that was the smartest move? So It depends if his contract is with Yamaha or Tech 3..
Dani been rumored to be gone for the last five years or so. But he keeps his job buy winning races ever year. I believe his manger is also IN at Honda.(And may have pictures of goats) So I wouldn't count him out just yet. Not a fan of his at all but I think as long as he wants to race its his ride..

[motoarch]

It looks like Pedrosas's seat is definitely up for grabs. They are talking to Dovi as well as zarco.

I might be miss remembering but didn’t dovi ride repsol earlier in his career? I don’t see him going back with his current success and the love affair he and Ducati are having right now. He’s own 7 out of the last 14 gps. Think about that; that’s crazy.

Anything is possible I suppose.

[motoarch]

Don't see Dovi leaving Ducati but I guess for the right money anything is possible. Zarco is the wild card. Be interesting to see what Yamaha does for a satellite team next year, with Tech 3 moving to KTM. Not sure that was the smartest move? So It depends if his contract is with Yamaha or Tech 3..
Dani been rumored to be gone for the last five years or so. But he keeps his job buy winning races ever year. I believe his manger is also IN at Honda.(And may have pictures of goats) So I wouldn't count him out just yet. Not a fan of his at all but I think as long as he wants to race its his ride..

I’m not sure Yamaha does anything till 2020. My understanding is that’s when Rossi will bring his team to moto gp.

I love Dani but I think the writings on the wall and time might be up.

[Paul_E_D]

I'm sure he's just trying to get Ducati's accountants ready. But the fact remains, this is the first year we are actively hearing about riders talking to honda about Dani's seat. KTM would do well to scoop Dani up.

[loudbeard]

Zarco's contract is with Tech 3 through 2018, he'll be free to do what he wants after this year. It will be interesting what happens with a satellite Yamaha team over the next few years. Yamaha has stated that a VR46 team would receive priority with bikes and support, which is why Tech 3 is leaving in the first place. That said, the VR46 team as of now is not intending on fielding a 2019 team.

[MUZ720]

I would think Suzuki would make a play for Zarco or Dani for that matter if he doe's lose his ride.. KTM talks the talk but as of yet to show improvement, Early yet but I doubt they race for podiums this year must less make the top ten..

[OreoGaborio]

This is what I wanna see happen to Dani's ride: MotoGP: Crutchlow gunning for Pedrosa’s seat | MCN

[MUZ720]

Crutchlow the crash king... Never happen! He is fast I will grant you that and he has as close you can get to a factory Honda already. Needs to stay on two wheels and have top fives and podiums before he's handed the key to the orange bike.