The nitty gritty of rear brake technique & its benefits

[zx1012r]

I use mine regularly on both the EX and the SV. However I have absolutely NO idea why. It is just instinct and it seems to work for me. (sorry Pete) I'll add that I use the cheapest crappy chinese pads I can buy on ebay so they hardly grab. You would have to stomp pretty hard on them to lock the rear.

However, in the rain, I am almost always dragging the rear slightly on the exits to keep the rear wheel from spinning up. This is something I have been purposefully working on and it seems to work. Go out on one of those "open" rain practices and try it out.

[Uncle Snake]

Mind telling me where my posts went?

[Doc]

You people are insane. Holy shit.

That is all I have to add. I don't touch it on the track... maybe I will experiment a little my next trackday.

[KB]

same place as this thread Don't take it personally, Bergs, it's not that your posts were worthless, I was just hoping to hear specifics on when/where one can benefit from using the rear brake under specific circumstances w/o having to filter though all the other stuff. It just wasn't turning into the thread I was hoping for.

Do you monitor every thread to make sure it goes where "you" want it or just your own threads? Admin duty going to your head already?

Jus sayin seems kind of selfish.

KB

[a13x]

Do you monitor every thread to make sure it goes where "you" want it or just your own threads? Admin duty going to your head already?

Jus sayin seems kind of selfish.

KB

You my boy Pete but KB makes a valid point. Shouldn't mods/admins be 'Average Joe's' in every thread unless that thread contains posts that violate the Terms of Use/Really Go Above The Line? Otherwise mods/admins shouldn't be playing God 'just cause we can' and doing things we (the rest of the users) are unable to do..

Hrm.

[OreoGaborio]

aw c'mon, that was a whole week ago! I'm a changed man! I swear!

[a13x]

aw c'mon, that was a whole week ago! I'm a changed man! I swear!

Translation: I got assraped behind the woodshed again for fucking with people's posts.

Ouch!

[OreoGaborio]

*EDITED by OreoGaborio for offensive and off-topic content.*



SEE???

[SVRACER01]

i also dont believe that "backing it in" is caused by the use of the rear brake. i think its caused by a combination of down shifting (slipper clutch?)and weight transfer to the front. once you lean the bike the rear goes in the opposite direction and since its already "sliding" its easier for it to slide out, therefor "backing it in". thats why the rear wheel is still spinning while its happening. i dont think you could modulate the rear brake enough to have just enough pressure to let it slide AND spin. and of course once you are past the apex..the backing is all throttle. i could be wrong, my old boss put a thumb brake on his GSXR race bike.

i believe that the fast guys use the rear brake over the hill to prevent the front from coming up.

[OreoGaborio]

Alex, where's that backin it in article you posted a while back? That was a cool read.

[BMFR6]

yeah, backing it in is not at all due to the rear brake. that article pete mentions pretty much sums it up.
my thoughts (note, not my experience) would lead me to believe that backing it in is very similar to that first time you come into 3 too hot, on the front brake, banging down gears like its your job and the ass end is everywhere. same thing only in control and on purpose.

[a13x]

i also dont believe that "backing it in" is caused by the use of the rear brake. i think its caused by a combination of down shifting (slipper clutch?)and weight transfer to the front. once you lean the bike the rear goes in the opposite direction and since its already "sliding" its easier for it to slide out, therefor "backing it in". thats why the rear wheel is still spinning while its happening. i dont think you could modulate the rear brake enough to have just enough pressure to let it slide AND spin. and of course once you are past the apex..the backing is all throttle. i could be wrong, my old boss put a thumb brake on his GSXR race bike.

i believe that the fast guys use the rear brake over the hill to prevent the front from coming up.

Actually you can use the rear brake to help you back it in.

The top motard guys (like actual Supermoto) use the rear brake a TON in getting the bike way sideways. Have you ever noticed that Nicky Hayden's RCV990 MotoGP bike has a much larger rear disc than Pedrosa's bike? That's because Nicky likes getting it sideways and backing it into the turns and uses the rear brake much more than Dani. It's pretty tricky to do, use the rear brake while backing it in, for the reasons you mentioned. You have to have excellent feel and not have the rear wheel lock up. It's something I haven't even tried yet!

Watch the guy at the :45 second mark. He's riding a blue YZF450. You can clearly see him on the rear brake and at the apex he gets off it and moves his foot back on the footpeg. WORD!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpHC8HQyKgE[/youtube]

Slipper clutches also do not cause you to back it in, they merely help control the slide. I've backed it into turns on everything from Honda Hawks, RMZ motards, 1098R superbikes and CBR600RR's. Twins, like your SV, are REAL easy to back into turns due to the massive amount of engine braking they have compared to I4's. Just bang some downshifts and let the clutch out and 'whooooo' there she goes.

A slipper clutch just helps control the slide much more. Without a slipper clutch you have to use the clutch lever to manually keep the rear wheel spinning/sliding smoothly. Otherwise if you are too abrupt with the downshift the back end will lock-up, hop, be erratic, and that's not very fun when it's sideways...if it does that you have to ease the clutch lever back in, get it controlled, and let it back out again. With a slipper the back-end comes out the same, but the wheel won't lock up or hop and as a result the whole process is easier.

I had a great experience with this at Barber. I was riding a 1098 and 1098R back-to-back, and the 1098R comes with a slipper clutch. Coming into Turn 5 at Barber you are 4th gear pinned. It's a hard left turn and you bang it down to 2nd gear while braking. On the 1098 the back end would come out sideways, the tire was squealing, and it would sometimes hop around etc. On the 1098R (with slipper) doing the exact same thing into the turn, the back end would simply come out sideways and slide nice and smoothly. No chirping, squealing, hopping, etc. While no slipper is more fun, having a slipper is easier/faster/smoother.

Make sense?