Ever wonder what an image x-ray of an AMB transponder looks like?

[xsiliconkid]

I'm gonna look into this a bit more. There's a group at work that may well have an answer.......not that I'm looking to get into repairing these things but the useless information is always good to have.

I would imagine boiling it in some kind of liquid would loosen up the end cap at the very least. So long as the battery's dead the electronics won't be harmed in any way.

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95% of failed transponders - just a bad $1.30 battery.

[NobodySpecific]

I would imagine boiling it in some kind of liquid would loosen up the end cap at the very least. So long as the battery's dead the electronics won't be harmed in any way.

That liquid can have minerals in it that can create short circuits when dried, it's not just a concern of shorting through the liquid itself. If you are careful the risk can be minimized (distilled water, etc).

[NeverlosT]

transponder looks like a printed circuit board (a few cents if you make a lot), a battery (also cheap in bulk) and an antenna. How much do they charge for these things? I think you are right, these guys are making bank!

[Yknot]

Just my $.02 but what you are paying for is the development and certification of a ~$60 BOM cost design. Having spent 2 years developing a RFID solution and another 6 months in certification, the process is timely and expensive. The design itself isn't the driving factor for setting prices for products. Just look at the cost of a reverse engineered Chinese product, manufacturing costs are low and "they" have very little overhead in the stolen design.

Sorry for the rant, I usually just keep my opinions to myself..

[xsiliconkid]

Just my $.02 but what you are paying for is the development and certification of a ~$60 BOM cost design. Having spent 2 years developing a RFID solution and another 6 months in certification, the process is timely and expensive. The design itself isn't the driving factor for setting prices for products. Just look at the cost of a reverse engineered Chinese product, manufacturing costs are low and "they" have very little overhead in the stolen design.

Sorry for the rant, I usually just keep my opinions to myself..

Agree 100% to making money.,

But there are a number of ways to recover investment and make profits... 20th century model is to use the product - as in, one time sale of a transponder in this case.

As timing is basically a transaction based service, Software-as-a-Service and fees based upon transaction rates is a 21st model that is being employed by mylaps competition. Add, significant technology and hardware costs dropping, its essential fees can be gained by not simply selling an expensive "dongle". Transaction based models also lowers barrier to entry.

My thought is, while Mylaps is the current world wide leader with dominant market share (have a very reliable product) their business model may get caught out over time. I can just hear it in their Netherlands board room, “what we change to give away our transponder product for cost?” as in being forced to play by others rules of variable service based pricing models. Will not happen. As an example mylaps started to also charge a fee for their online mylap.com service (where you can go to see your lap times) but received huge pushback from customers who had already paid a HUGE fee for transponders (dongle).

Right now mylaps has a target on their back simply because they are the dominant player and are charging huge prices (others see big margin opportunity using newer cheaper standards based technology; passive RFID as an example).
ps BTW their BOM is less than $12.

[butcher bergs]

That liquid can have minerals in it that can create short circuits when dried, it's not just a concern of shorting through the liquid itself. If you are careful the risk can be minimized (distilled water, etc).

Deionized distilled water is where I was going with my previous post. What Graham mentioned as far as disolving epoxy is what I'm really curious about. If I have time this week I will be getting in touch with the department at work that handles conformal coating and will do some learning about their process as well as repair.

transponder looks like a printed circuit board (a few cents if you make a lot), a battery (also cheap in bulk) and an antenna. How much do they charge for these things? I think you are right, these guys are making bank!

Call it $400.

Yeah it definitely appears that there are very basic components on these boards. No BGA's or other expensive or exotic components. Looks like some resistors, capacitors, couple transistors an ID chip and that's about it. To give people an idea of how inexpensive the basic components are, for the most part, a reel of 5000 resistors is about $50-$60.

An interesting thing I'd like to note is that the ID of the transponders themselves aren't programmed to the user each time they are sold on the used market. Each of them are given a static ID that is associated, through the MyLaps software, with the serial number label on the x-ponder. The only reason you have to register them is so the timing system can be set up to match your x-ponder number with your name.

For example:

Let's say my xponder number is 000069. Every time I cross the start/finish line the system only sees xponder 000069 and nothing more, that is, until I register my name. What references my name to that xponder is the MyLaps software that gathers the data......software that someone goes in and associates xponder number 000069 to me rather than programming the xponder itself.

A $40 service, BTW, which at one point in time became suddenly unavailable until enough people squawked about it. Believe it or not there was a time where you could purchase a used xponder but it would be useless to you since you couldn't associate your name with it.

[butcher bergs]

Up next:

Honda ECU

Coil on plug (minus the plug)

[drinkingmymilk]

This thread is awesome... I've learned a shit load of useless knowledge, yet at the same time I am pissed I owe my Dr. $163.72 everytime they click that button and take an x-ray of me.

[butcher bergs]

^^

The difference is I am not developing xray film like the Dr's are. Otherwise, yeah, xray is xray no matter how it's being used.


I'm trying to get a fuel injector scanned but whatever the material is, it's difficult to get a decent scan of it even on full power.

What sucks is I only have a few minutes at a time to get these images scanned and saved because the machine is actively being used to review product defects which means I can't really sit down and mess with the settings on the machine to pick up more detail.

So, after this fuel injector is scanned I'm thinking a hands free device is up next.

[drinkingmymilk]

It's 2011. I can't tell you the last time a dr. looked at a film. They pull a laptop right in the room and show you the x-ray/mri/ct right there. The healthcare companies know they can charge it because they are "trained techs" and liability insurance costs.... but that's another thread. Keep on shooting sir! I love reading the convo between you and Graham.

[butcher bergs]

Goes to show the last time I had xrays done.

[butcher bergs]

Well, I spent a little time while the machine was down at break and tried some new settings to get a better image of the fuel injector. Still not pleased with the quality and I'm gonna keep trying for a better image as I'm becoming more familiar with the software functions. I don't have a direct need to use the xray machine but I was able to get a better idea of what I need to do.

For now, this is what I came up with along with the ignition key to my Ford Ranger.

Can't find my hands free earpiece at the moment....