5 year helmet replacement scam(?)

[RandyO]

I'm not a safety nut or going to tell you what to do, but that's just not true.

you don't believe that you can wear a helmet out in a year ...... you don't ride enuf

[Falko]

I think his comment was more that one would last a long long time without wearing it. the components have a shelf life. And GO...

[Stromper]

I would watch your neighbors for VooDoo ceremonies <<< known head shrinkers

I have a slop sink meaning deep
Warm water a little shampoo swish swish soak

A good rinse under warm water , dry above water heater for a day

The helmet tightened up , cushions expand a little

My shoei liners are removable/replaceable but this gets the job done

Meanwhile with mcguires liquid compound and a microfiber cloth I am on year 4 with my visor
10 minutes work resting on your knee and it is 95% new, Also only wipe it with wet microfiber

[TheIglu]

I had my brand new clear visor in a visor sack on top of my rolling toolbox.


Enter Great Dane puppy.



In no time at all, he removed the hard standing/stomping pad from the toy, then stood on it and tossed the toy around the garage for a while.



= Clear shield face ground into the concrete like someone wanted to do everything possible to make it unusable.

[Paul_E_D]

Good doggie! lol

[cdovego]

what type of visor?

[TheIglu]

Arai

[7UPyours]

if aliens played hockey, would they need to wear a helmet and 2 mouth guards?

why 2 mouth guards? what do you know that maybe we don't?

[AEG]

why 2 mouth guards? what do you know that maybe we don't?

that they have teeth in their vaginas?

[sedanman]

I'm pretty sure l know a woman with teeth in hers.

[caloots]

HAHAHAAH

abeers photo at the start of this thread... from the movie..
im amusing myself

[nick5446]

you don't believe that you can wear a helmet out in a year ...... you don't ride enuf

What do you think you're wearing out? There are no moving parts...don't give the engineers more credit than they deserve...it's just styrofoam and plastic or fiberglass.

If your helmet gets a little loose, that's a different story. As others have mentioned, that's the open cell foam in your comfort liner breaking in/down. Washing them usually helps, or you can replace them from the manufacturer.

Hopefully you're not buying a new $500 helmet every year when you could just be buying $20 cheek pads.

[NPDCPA]

I see where the logic train is going with the concept of the styrofoam liner breaking down, but I'm not buying it. I have a couple of old Omaha Steaks styrofoam coolers that have been on combat duty for at least 6 years by now. In and out of unheated garage space, left on the deck in the sun, bounced around and not babied at all other than a quick rinse out with the hose after use. They are just as solid as they were when new. A helmet's foam which is treated 100% differently and not exposed to UV rays at all should be far better off. I know the cooler is not protecting me in a crash, but I'm referring to the integrity of the foam over time.

Ever read the instructions on a shampoo bottle? Wash, rinse, REPEAT. That 6 letter word at the end, placed there by marketers, sold more shampoo than any boobylicious ad campaign ever did. Methinks the 5 year replacement schedule on most quality helmets is about the same.

[PhilB]

What do you think you're wearing out? There are no moving parts...don't give the engineers more credit than they deserve...it's just styrofoam and plastic or fiberglass.

If your helmet gets a little loose, that's a different story. As others have mentioned, that's the open cell foam in your comfort liner breaking in/down. Washing them usually helps, or you can replace them from the manufacturer.

Hopefully you're not buying a new $500 helmet every year when you could just be buying $20 cheek pads.

You're wearing out the styrofoam, which is the part that actually protects your head. Every time you wear the helmet, you impact the styrofoam. Continued such impacts compress the foam, which causes it to have less protective ability. Thicker cheekpads will not protect your head in an impact.

I see where the logic train is going with the concept of the styrofoam liner breaking down, but I'm not buying it. I have a couple of old Omaha Steaks styrofoam coolers that have been on combat duty for at least 6 years by now. In and out of unheated garage space, left on the deck in the sun, bounced around and not babied at all other than a quick rinse out with the hose after use. They are just as solid as they were when new. A helmet's foam which is treated 100% differently and not exposed to UV rays at all should be far better off. I know the cooler is not protecting me in a crash, but I'm referring to the integrity of the foam over time.

Ever read the instructions on a shampoo bottle? Wash, rinse, REPEAT. That 6 letter word at the end, placed there by marketers, sold more shampoo than any boobylicious ad campaign ever did. Methinks the 5 year replacement schedule on most quality helmets is about the same.

Your cooler is not subjected to repeated compressions. I guarantee that if you put a basketball inside that cooler, and carry it around in the trunk of your car, the integrity of the foam will be completely destroyed in a lot less than 5 years.

Of y'all are (or at least should be) free to do as you like. It's your heads. But don't come off as acting superior to people who don't wear helmets, if you don't understand how yours works and don't replace it now and then so that your head stays protected.

PhilB

[cdovego]

It's all about shedding g-forces as they transfer through the helmet. New shells do that better than older compacted shells. It's really that simple.

Yes, there are other variables but the crux of the issue is the shell (not necessarily foam).

[Garandman]

You're wearing out the styrofoam, which is the part that actually protects your head. Every time you wear the helmet, you impact the styrofoam. Continued such impacts compress the foam, which causes it to have less protective ability.

The manufacturers - at least Arai - spray on a light coat of black spray so any such impacts are immediately obvious.

I took a helmet I'd crashed in to Paul at MotoMarket. He looked at the helmet and pronounced it good to go. He pointed this detail out.

[RandyO]

What do you think you're wearing out? There are no moving parts...don't give the engineers more credit than they deserve...it's just styrofoam and plastic or fiberglass.

If your helmet gets a little loose, that's a different story. As others have mentioned, that's the open cell foam in your comfort liner breaking in/down. Washing them usually helps, or you can replace them from the manufacturer.

Hopefully you're not buying a new $500 helmet every year when you could just be buying $20 cheek pads.

EPS is NOT styrofoam


EPS is Expanded polystyrene

Styrofoam (XPS) is Extruded polystyrene foam

wear is from being compressed over time by pulling your helmet off and on


there is no Styrofoam in a helmet, Styrofoam is not a suitable to protect your head

[PhilB]

It's all about shedding g-forces as they transfer through the helmet. New shells do that better than older compacted shells. It's really that simple.

Yes, there are other variables but the crux of the issue is the shell (not necessarily foam).

No, it's the foam. That's what provides the controlled deceleration, and reduces the g-forces to your head. The main purpose of the shell is to keep the EPS foam in place around your head.

The manufacturers - at least Arai - spray on a light coat of black spray so any such impacts are immediately obvious.

I took a helmet I'd crashed in to Paul at MotoMarket. He looked at the helmet and pronounced it good to go. He pointed this detail out.

The paint is a telltale for large impacts or for damage by pointy objects, etc. It does not tell you about the day-to-day small impacts, accumulated wear, and compression.

EPS is NOT styrofoam
EPS is Expanded polystyrene
Styrofoam (XPS) is Extruded polystyrene foam
wear is from being compressed over time by pulling your helmet off and on
there is no Styrofoam in a helmet, Styrofoam is not a suitable to protect your head

OK, yes, I had the wrong tech term for the type of foam. Everything else I said still stands as valid.

PhilB

[cdovego]

Shell is the foam composite inside the outer shell. Believe me, I know what I'm talking about.

[RandyO]

OK, yes, I had the wrong tech term for the type of foam. Everything else I said still stands as valid.

PhilB

yes except for perpetuating the foam myth

EPS is made with pre-expanded beads, there is no foaming in the process so it is more uniform in it's compression properties

both are polystyrene, so the physical chemical and photosensitive properties are the same, EPS is a much sturdier product,

[nick5446]

yes except for perpetuating the foam myth

EPS is made with pre-expanded beads, there is no foaming in the process so it is more uniform in it's compression properties

both are polystyrene, so the physical chemical and photosensitive properties are the same, EPS is a much sturdier product,

Definitely true, but you're nit-picking. EPS is even less susceptible to compression issues than styrofoam. True, you can distort it without crashing if you try hard enough (i.e. compressing a hot spot with your thumbs or a spoon if your helmet doesn't fit right), and you inevitably also distort it a little putting it on and off every day, but we're talking about fractions of millimeters over years of use, not life and death. I would be amazed if any helmet manufacturer told you that was why you should replace your helmet every 5 years.

They lean on things like degradation of materials, saying that the foams and plastics break down with UV and sweat and all of that good stuff. While that's true, it's insignificant in the grand scheme of things. The only components that will break down and give you real problems are the glues used to hold it all together. Your EPS isn't one piece, it's a few pieces glued together, and all of that is glued to the shell. If those glues break down and those pieces are able to move around, that's where you're going to have issues in a crash.

BUT, I think we're all in agreement that 99% of the reason manufactures make the 5 year claim is because of lawyers and sales. No one makes money if they sell you a helmet that lasts a lifetime. And if you end up brain dead after crashing in a 6 year old helmet, they get to point to that sticker on the box when your family tries to sue.

So everybody stop fighting about styrofoam! I mean EPS!!

[cdovego]

Glue as in, literally - glue from a hot glue gun.

[nick5446]

Exactly. It's not a precision process.

[RandyO]

but we're talking about fractions of millimeters over years of use

like I said, you don't ride enuf,

and all it takes is fractions of millimeters before you see hairline cracks in the black coating that manufactures put on the EPS to examine helmets.

for me, they start showing up in a helmet after about 3 years (75,000-100,000 miles or so) but I have other helmets that are not worn so much that are 7 or 8 years old, if they are not on your head sitting in a closet, they are not exposed to anything that will degrade the EPS

biggest exposure while wearing is humidity from body perspiration, EPS does absorb moisture

[PhilB]

Shell is the foam composite inside the outer shell. Believe me, I know what I'm talking about.

OK, yes, if by "shell" you meant the EPS layer, then I agree, you're right.

PhilB