AM middlewieght race on Sunday

[ginness72]

I don't know who it was or even if they are on this forum.
Someone pulled a really dirty pass going into turn 11a on me that pissed me the F off.
I am #717 black and green zx6r . Went through 11 then flipped over to go through 11 a I was a the curbing and leaned over and someone put there front wheel almost into me witch caused me to stand up and go through the grass. Fucking dirty racing ... just wanted to vent and let be known

[jwm2k3]

I was about 3 or 4 bikes behind you and saw you go thru the grass, but didn't see the other guy....

[ginness72]

For what's it worth , during the dash on Saturday I was one of the guy's that went out through Nascar turn 1 and was dead last going into t-3 .... I passed 20 guy's during that race up 8th and ran out of steam to keep going with 2 laps left . Ended up 11th ... I DIDN'T run anyone off track to do it

[The Snowman]

There's an 11a at NHMS? News to me.

Depending on the circumstances, it may not have actually been dirty. Depends on how hard you flopped for T12 (part 1). He may have been coming under you on a more shallow line.

[Chippertheripper]

So somebody passed you on the outside of 11 and you couldn't make the flip for 12?

[ginness72]

I was already flipped into the turn and 2 feet away at the curbing.... he stuffed his front wheel on the inside ... I have had people in the past been right there before and had a legitimate pass .
Believe me when I say it was a straight up dirty move

[cdovego]

I had someone lean on me through there this round, I thought it was pretty cool. Never done that before - shoulder to shoulder, oh hey bro!

[butcher bergs]

I'd like to offer a suggestion.....

[Chippertheripper]

Chop. Chop.

[TTD]

My only comment here is it could have been bad judgment and not dirty.

If you go around someone in 11... or start going around him... you are not always able to get the pass finished by entry to 12. This sometimes happens when riders are a little slower in 11, but then go pretty hard into 12. The passer thinks he will have time, but then the rider in front doesn't slow as much as he expected.

The passer really has no where to go there, so both bikes end up touching noses... and only the PASSEE can fix the problem by going straight.

If I am the passer here, I look to apologize after the race... or at least give a hand wave down the front straight.

Then again... he might just be a real dick, in which case... Fuck him!

[Paul_E_D]

I agree with Tony. There's 2 sides to every story. Imagine this from another point of view:

Guy behind you is faster, you are holding him up, he decides to make the outside pass in 11, which is him taking all the risk. Only your cornerspeed is slow enough to allow you to goose the throttle a little more than the faster guy can. Suddenly the hole you left wide open is closing fast and the guy is fully committed with nowhere to go but to the apex. He's actually a little in front of you or else you could have completely shut the door on him.

Who is actually wrong? The answer is no one. It was a racing decision. It is BEST to make a decision and commit to it IMO. Sometimes you get it right, and sometimes it doesn't QUITE work out smoothly. Sounds like what could have happened here.

[CEO]

Agree with Tony and Paul. Also, when you are in turn 11 and looking through the turn to the left, you may not have noticed him right up next to you until you flipped it in late and hard... this happened to me in a race Sunday where someone did the same move and stood me up. I started to throw it in and then realized he was there and we were both going to go down... so I had no choice but to check up and straightline the chicane, costing me huge cornerspeed and drive out of 12 since I had to finish the turn on the apron. I felt like he came out of nowhere. I told him after I thought it was a good move but a little aggressive, but he thought he was already in a place where I would have seen him easily. In the end nothing bad happened except he beat me, that's racing.

[Chippertheripper]

In summation, this is racing, not tiddlywinks.
Somebody has to have footage of it. Your best bet is to find the culprit and ask him.

[ginness72]

I agree with everything everyone has said .
I know it's racing , I am very familiar with passing people there as well as being passed in that section . I hope there is some video of it then everyone else could see it .. I usually don't ever say to much about being slowing than or being beaten legit.
This pass Imo was definitely bad .

[ginness72]

I have actually put off some passes through there just to not force him of his line or cause an incident .. if I'm THAT much faster than the guy's in front of me then I'll get them in turn 1 on the outside

[jwm2k3]

I believe you about your particular incident....as I said, I saw you go thru the grass...it could have ended way worse....

On the flip side, the responses in this thread make me feel better...I had a guy give the the thumbs down on the cool down lap and I didn't know why. In the pits I stopped him before we got to the garages and asked him why he gave me the thumbs down. He said I passed him in 11 and another guy too and it put him off line....I was faster....he was holding me up....there was no contact, I felt there was plenty of room, but my pass made him have to alter going into 12....I said hey, this is racing! I didn't touch anyone, nobody went down, I went by you....then I apologized because I didn't want him angry, but guess what....IT'S RACING.

[JettaJayGLS]

I made an identical pass on Bill Morey in my first weekend as an amateur. On the last lap I started the pass on the outside of 11 and grabbed the inside line into 12. He had to stand the bike up a little to re-assess his line, and I stole the podium. After the race he came up to me, grabbed me (scared the shit out of me as this was my third weekend ever) and laughing he called me a "son of a bitch" or something like that. I apologized, he said it was close, but clean and all was good. I honestly would do it again and again and again. And I'm willing to bet that Bill would take a defensive line into 12 next time and shut the door on me. We had some good battles that year.

[csmutty]

I have had this done to me more times than I care to say. It sucks every time, and I need to learn how to better guard against it.

[loudbeard]

I was just ahead of John and saw you go through the grass, but didn't see the incident.

I tend to believe just about whatever a racer tells me. For example, if a guy repeatedly tells me about how someone made a bad pass on him or how he got stood up, I tend to believe that guy is a cünt.

Likewise, if I never hear a guy bitch and they start chirping, its usually based on something.

Not sure which one of those dudes you are, but I'm sorry you had a bad time.

[Chippertheripper]

I was just ahead of John and saw you go through the grass, but didn't see the incident.

I tend to believe just about whatever a racer tells me. For example, if a guy repeatedly tells me about how someone made a bad pass on him or how he got stood up, I tend to believe that guy is a cünt.

Likewise, if I never hear a guy bitch and they start chirping, its usually based on something.

Not sure which one of those dudes you are, but I'm sorry you had a bad time.

Hahahahahah


Fwiw, I got run over in the grass triangle between pit in, 12, and 12a. I know how bad it can go wrong there.
Be faster, don't let anybody in there.

[CBR929RE]

fwiw Tony is a good guy. races clean. had some good battles with him before he got too fast for me to keep up, asshole.

[carsick]

I got pushed to the grass and lost the lead on the checkers lap there this weekend. Next time I will not swing left enough from T11 to let that opening happen. Passer (winner) apologized of his own accord. I was OK with it since there was no crash. It was definitely a desperate last lap move for the win after I took the lead in T10. I think the passer and I can learn to do a classier job next round.

[Yknot]

I made an identical pass on Bill Morey in my first weekend as an amateur. On the last lap I started the pass on the outside of 11 and grabbed the inside line into 12. He had to stand the bike up a little to re-assess his line, and I stole the podium. After the race he came up to me, grabbed me (scared the shit out of me as this was my third weekend ever) and laughing he called me a "son of a bitch" or something like that. I apologized, he said it was close, but clean and all was good. I honestly would do it again and again and again. And I'm willing to bet that Bill would take a defensive line into 12 next time and shut the door on me. We had some good battles that year.

HAHAHA!!! I was thinking about that same thing when I was reading this. The LW guys have done it to me several times and have even done it myself. It is definitely not my favorite move due to the risk but that is the dash to the line. Some cases I wish I had done it more, LOL. It did force me to straighten my line up into 12 with more throttle.

It has been said before, but if there is room someone will fill it. Short of slamming into you or chopping your front, there are a lot of racing moves that are pretty aggressive but clean. I try to get the other side, file it away and learn from it.

That was a fun year Jay,nice tight racing.

[Petorius]

Is the following statement correct?

On an open track, the fastest line is to carry 11 deep for a later turn-in to 12. In a race with somebody right on your ass, the better (defensive) line is to "connect the dots" more or less between the apex of 11 and apex of 12, sacrificing some speed in the flip to 12a.

[Paul_E_D]

Probably, yes. I say probably because every rider is a bit different.