do slicks really last longer/wear better?

[kermita]

Is it true that slicks last longer/wear better than street tires for track-only use? I heard this recently but no one had a definitive answer as to why.

[Doc]

No.

[a13x]

Trick-question.

[kermita]

Trick-question.

how so?

[The Crashing Tomato]

O shit K you opened up another chance for Oreo to take us to school



Take it away OREO ...................................................

[OreoGaborio]

Photoshop.



Seriously though, if they did everyone would probably be using them.

EDIT: Apparently you've been schooled?

[The Crashing Tomato]

you must be tired

I was expecting a two page dissertation as to why this is not true






I actually like most of your answers

[kermita]

Seriously though, if they did everyone would probably be using them.

Right...but most people use their bikes for both track and on the street making slicks a less appealing option. I realize that not all racers use slicks but not all race classes allow them. I thought perhaps it has something to do with heat cycles...that slicks and more race-oriented tires were better constructed to deal with high heat followed by continuous cool downs. Is this not the case?

[The Crashing Tomato]

Hey K check out this thread if you havn't already http://www.nestreetriders.com/forum/...-med-comp.html

[OreoGaborio]

Well here's my theory...

slicks are designed with pretty much one thing in mind... maximum traction under maximum torture. As such, longevity takes a serious back seat in the design stages. Slicks are soft, high-heat tires that have a very short life when ridden the way they were intended. Of course if they were DOTs or Street tires, they'd probably be shreded long before a slick at that kinda pace.

The reason why I probably wouldn't use slicks on the street if it were dry out (& it were legal), is that it's tough to get em up to operating temp under those conditions. It'll last a helluva lot longer than it would if it were being ridden on the track, but if a tire isn't up to temp it's not gonna be working at its full potential. I'm not even so sure I could get a slick fully up to its operating temp during a typical track day. Under race conditions, maybe, but not at a track day where I'm only riding at about 90%. Now it may provide more traction at that temp than a DOT race tire, but I'm not so sure. I'd have to try em out back to back, & do some testing to know for sure.

Even my Dragon Supercorsas are a little slick in that first mile or two and no matter how long I ride them on the street they're still not as sticky as they are on the track where they're put under more stress from hard acceleration & braking.

That answer a little better?

Basically when ridden the way they were intended, they have a pretty short life... but they were meant to take more stress than a DOT race or a street tire, which would shred.
Ride em easier & they'll last a lot longer, but may not get up to operating temp & give you maximum traction.
Where the traction vs longevity lines cross to make it worth switching to slicks depending on your pace, I don't know.

I'm more interested in what Dave (Karaya One) has to add since I dont have any real experience w/ em other than on Degsy's 600RR.

[Degsy]

No.

Yes, ....sometimes.

It IS a trick question, because it depends on the rider.

1st scenario. I'm out there doing track duty in the blue group. Someone quite fast (say 1:20 pace) wants me to follow them and critique them or offer advice. I'm on street tires. I can keep up that pace on streets for a few laps, then the street tires overheat and I'll tear them up pronto.

2nd Scenario, same as first but I'm on medium compound slicks. I can stay with the guy for much longer without damaging the tires.

I have said it before and I'm not lying here. I have a set of slicks at home from the 600RR that have at least 750 miles on them (maybe more). They are not torn up and they have plenty of tread left. I don't use warmers. I just keep the acceleration to a minimum for the first lap or so to warm them up. I pay very close attention to tire pressure and I ride smoothly.

ymmv

[OreoGaborio]

Good point.

So the money question is, do ya think slicks would last longer & offer a comparable amount of traction compared to Kermita's current tire at her pace? Where do those curves that represent longevity & traction benefit the rider as they pick up their pace?

btw, edited my post above a little after doin some more brain storming.

[Paul_E_D]

Slicks often last longer, and it may simply be that they have no cuts in the tread making the surface less prone to tearing...

[nt650hawk]

I ran two sets of slicks in 2007. 7 Track days and 5 races and practice sessions W/out issues.

I have also ran a set of Bridgestones on the 929 for 7500 miles and 5 trackdays.

Key is to being smooth no matter what you're on.

[TTD]

If I had rains or DOT's readily available... mounted up on spare rims... then I'd probably run slicks for track days. (given my pace)

For the average rider doing trackdays, without spare rims ready to go... slicks mean that if it rains you are sitting in the garage and/or swapping tires.

With Street and Comp planning to be at our events to change tires, that might not be terrible.

I think I agree with Paul about the fact that no tread grooves let the surface wear a bit more evenly... and seem to last a bit longer.

As for heating them up, it depends what compound you go with. I would think the average blue group rider could heat up a soft or med compound pretty easily at the track.

[Mr. Kurtz]

Lots of more knowledgable people have chimed in here, but I'll still add my $.02...

Modern sport performance tire, just like modern SS bikes, typically perform beyond most riders capabilities. Unless you're racing or running fast blue group speeds, your money is probably better spent on a GOOD set of high performance street tires.

[Doc]

So we are REALLY talking just for the track?

I see Degs point but I took the question as someone with a streetbike that wants to have longer lasting tires.

I still say at a slower pacs a good DOT will last longer but I am BY FAR not the authority and bow out on this.

[Degsy]

Good point.

So the money question is, do ya think slicks would last longer & offer a comparable amount of traction compared to Kermita's current tire at her pace? Where do those curves that represent longevity & traction benefit the rider as they pick up their pace?

btw, edited my post above a little after doin some more brain storming.

That is the money question, right there.

Probably at the 1:25 lap time mark you are warming the slicks up enough to benefit from them. But, you might not be smooth enough to not tear them up. That's probably the cusp, right there, 1:23 to 1:25 .

derek

[Degsy]

I still say at a slower pace a good DOT will last longer

Absolutely correct.

[Crash Dummy Denno]

kim get slicks, there's nothing more fun then feeling the back end slide a bit and still feeling in control!

seriously though, i had a lot more fun on slicks at trackdays - but you'll want the 2nd set of rims or an option for tire changes....

rode slicks in the rain for one session and it is scary and slow

[SVRACER01]

i held off on getting slicks until i had the suspension to handle the extra grip.

[Doc]

I am holding off on getting slicks until I have the talent to use them... may never happen.

[KB]

O shit K you opened up another chance for Oreo to take us to school



Take it away OREO ...................................................

Isn't that an oxymoron. Oreo and school in the same sentence?

That EX is going down this year in sportsman!!!

KB

[KB]

Right...but most people use their bikes for both track and on the street making slicks a less appealing option. I realize that not all racers use slicks but not all race classes allow them. I thought perhaps it has something to do with heat cycles...that slicks and more race-oriented tires were better constructed to deal with high heat followed by continuous cool downs. Is this not the case?

My motard is plated and when jetting I usually slap a plate on and do a few highway runs, numbers, slicks, the whole nine. Turns some heads!!

KB

[OreoGaborio]

Isn't that an oxymoron. Oreo and school in the same sentence?

That EX is going down this year in sportsman!!!

KB

Remind me to turn around & wave to you as I lead you up turn 4 again... it was beginning to turn into a tradition